Which fighters do you suspect of juicing past or present?

[GhostBlade]

Morrison, Holyfield and practically every non-American fighter that made it big. Who knows.

[Vadrigar.]

Disclaimer, this is not a thread of accusations, I'm just speaking about my personal su****ions as a fan

Let's be objective about this... No fanboyism just be honest.

Here's my list.

Mayweather and Pacquiao, Matthysse, Kovalev, Marquez, Rigo, Bernard Hopkins (maybe), Canelo (maybe)

Reasons:

Mayweather

IDGAF how much you spout ''hard work dedication'', it's simply not normal to be performing at this level at the age of 37, people also forget that roids help you train harder and longer, plus the fact that he went on this PEDs crusade comes across as being like someone who is trying to hide their own juicing by accusing other fighters (Pacman) to deflect accusations from himself.

Also the video when he was questioned about TRT (Testosterone replacement therapy) was su****ious as hell, his face looked guilty as hell. There has also been another instance where he was asked about TRT and he looked at Ellerbe worried as hell. Not to mention his balding, small looking testicles and apparent anger management problems, the tell tale signs are there.

(TRT, EPO) (opinion)

Pacquiao

As much as I love Manny, one cannot deny that in his peak at 2009 he was strangely physically gifted, if he was natural he may be the genetic freak of our times, his stamina was inhuman, and his power was cray. Ariza is also a su****ious character and he's been caught with Rios, plus the talk of Freddie not knowing what was in those ''shakes''. Plus he didn't jump at the opportunity to abide to the random testing in the Mayweather negotiations. Manny always had the physical gifts but he is not beyond su****ion.

(EPO, HGH, Testosterone) (Opinion)

Matthysse

This guy had crazy power, he just dropped guys right left and center, but my main su****ions are that leading up to the Garcia a poster mentioned that he alongside many big time gamblers had inside info that Matthysse was a big juicer and that he wouldn't have the same power against Garcia, alas Garcia was the one who appeared to have the greater power in that fight.

Bernard Hopkins

I'm a big fan of B-Hop but you can't be performing like this at the age of 50, it's just not normal notwithstanding a clean lifestyle etc. (probable drugs) (HGH, TRT)

Rigondeaux

This is mainly due to a documentary I watched on the cuban academies, where they said the most talented fighters get the best 'vitamins' hmmm.... sounds like some su****ious ish to me, there isn't that great of a variation in vitamin quality, plus they don't have that great of an effect on performance.

Feel free to discuss.

From recent fights I've watched, Tyson and Holyfield.

I couldn't agree more about mayweather, he is maxed out on TRT.

[blacraven]

Mayweather

IDGAF how much you spout ''hard work dedication'', it's simply not normal to be performing at this level at the age of 37, people also forget that roids help you train harder and longer, plus the fact that he went on this PEDs crusade comes across as being like someone who is trying to hide their own juicing by accusing other fighters (Pacman) to deflect accusations from himself.

Also the video when he was questioned about TRT (Testosterone replacement therapy) was su****ious as hell, his face looked guilty as hell. There has also been another instance where he was asked about TRT and he looked at Ellerbe worried as hell. Not to mention his balding, small looking testicles and apparent anger management problems, the tell tale signs are there.

(TRT, EPO) (opinion)

This too. When Mayweather flaunts how he works out all day and night with no recovery, this makes me su****ious because this would'nt be possible with out peds. Same with Manny being able to consume over 7k calories a day and stays lean. Even body builders who take in that many calories don't stay lean and their four times the size of Manny. I also believe pretty much everyone is on some kind of peds!

Ive heard this alot.
Ill tell you why Mayweather IS NOT on PEDs...
Let me break this down so it can forever be broke:

Floyd was born into the sport of boxing.
His dad and uncle were fighters.
His father fought SRL so he knows what kind of training and preparation you need to fight an ATG Elite guy.
Uncle Roger was a 2x World champion, the Mexican assassin. He fought Chavez twice and a host of other guys, so he also knows what it takes to deal with ATG, Elite guys.
These guys molded him from birth like a Spartan, prepared him mentally and physically for a Spartan life.

When he was a baby his dad used to always hold his hands and simulate punching left and right repeatedly until finally they say on day Floyd started punching on his own.
He literally learned how to throw punches before he could talk.(Real talk, look it up)

His father had him in the gym since birth.
When he was a few years old he used to stand on a chair and punch the punching bag.
He did this for years until he was tall enough to do it with out a chair(Real talk, look it up)

Growing up in a gym with a Father and an Uncle who were boxers, many world class boxers frequently worked out and sparred at the gym.
Floyd used to spar these GROWN MEN as a young child and all while growing up.
Being exposed to every style known to man and gaining tips and knowledge from these men.(Real talk look it up)

Speaking on his stamina,
He's been training since he was in single digit years.
Running miles with his dad and uncle and himself since he was a young child.
So lets put it this way...
Your body is developing as you grow up, your heart, lungs, etc...
They tell you as a young child to eat your vegetables and drink milk, etc. to help your body develop right.
Well just imagine how his heart and lungs developed while growing up doing basically a full boxing workout since about 5 years old.
The dudes heart and lungs are super developed. he can do those work outs standing on his head man. it's totally normal for him to box 30 rounds with ease. That would probably kill a normal man.
Most of these guys train only at training camp when they have a fight and then go to the club afterwards or don't do anything on they're off time, they gain weight and all kinds of stuff.
Floyd's lifestyle IS TRAINING, this is what he does normally, what he has been doing normally since a child. he knows nothing else. He's basically out of place trying to do anything else, that's why he seems so awkward when you see him trying to be normal and do regular stuff.
He's a Spartan and there's nothing he can do about it.

In conclusion:
So what seems to be, not normal with working out hard all the time,
is totally normal for him, it's not even as hard for him as you think.
That's why he does it so much and a few times a day during training camp.
Normal hard work is child's play and naturally easy for him.
So he has to push it into Triple gear just to get a good work out in.

[Nights King]

Ive heard this alot.
Ill tell you why Mayweather IS NOT on PEDs...
Let me break this down so it can forever be broke:

Floyd was born into the sport of boxing.
His dad and uncle were fighters.
His father fought SRL so he knows what kind of training and preparation you need to fight an ATG Elite guy.
Uncle Roger was a 2x World champion, the Mexican assassin. He fought Chavez twice and a host of other guys, so he also knows what it takes to deal with ATG, Elite guys.
These guys molded him from birth like a Spartan, prepared him mentally and physically for a Spartan life.

When he was a baby his dad used to always hold his hands and simulate punching left and right repeatedly until finally they say on day Floyd started punching on his own.
He literally learned how to throw punches before he could talk.(Real talk, look it up)

His father had him in the gym since birth.
When he was a few years old he used to stand on a chair and punch the punching bag.
He did this for years until he was tall enough to do it with out a chair(Real talk, look it up)

Growing up in a gym with a Father and an Uncle who were boxers, many world class boxers frequently worked out and sparred at the gym.
Floyd used to spar these GROWN MEN as a young child and all while growing up.
Being exposed to every style known to man and gaining tips and knowledge from these men.(Real talk look it up)

Speaking on his stamina,
He's been training since he was in single digit years.
Running miles with his dad and uncle and himself since he was a young child.
So lets put it this way...
Your body is developing as you grow up, your heart, lungs, etc...
They tell you as a young child to eat your vegetables and drink milk, etc. to help your body develop right.
Well just imagine how his heart and lungs developed while growing up doing basically a full boxing workout since about 5 years old.
The dudes heart and lungs are super developed. he can do those work outs standing on his head man. it's totally normal for him to box 30 rounds with ease. That would probably kill a normal man.
Most of these guys train only at training camp when they have a fight and then go to the club afterwards or don't do anything on they're off time, they gain weight and all kinds of stuff.
Floyd's lifestyle IS TRAINING, this is what he does normally, what he has been doing normally since a child. he knows nothing else. He's basically out of place trying to do anything else, that's why he seems so awkward when you see him trying to be normal and do regular stuff.
He's a Spartan and there's nothing he can do about it.

In conclusion:
So what seems to be, not normal with working out hard all the time,
is totally normal for him, it's not even as hard for him as you think.
That's why he does it so much and a few times a day during training camp.
Normal hard work is child's play and naturally easy for him.
So he has to push it into Triple gear just to get a good work out in.

So you're implying because Floyds work ethic is superb it destroys all accusations that he may be on PEDs?
Floyd does not have the character of a spartan . He would've fought EVERYONE!

Oh and another thing he wouldn't put his health before his honor!

[fighter1234]

Ive heard this alot.
Ill tell you why Mayweather IS NOT on PEDs...
Let me break this down so it can forever be broke:

Floyd was born into the sport of boxing.
His dad and uncle were fighters.
His father fought SRL so he knows what kind of training and preparation you need to fight an ATG Elite guy.
Uncle Roger was a 2x World champion, the Mexican assassin. He fought Chavez twice and a host of other guys, so he also knows what it takes to deal with ATG, Elite guys.
These guys molded him from birth like a Spartan, prepared him mentally and physically for a Spartan life.

When he was a baby his dad used to always hold his hands and simulate punching left and right repeatedly until finally they say on day Floyd started punching on his own.
He literally learned how to throw punches before he could talk.(Real talk, look it up)

His father had him in the gym since birth.
When he was a few years old he used to stand on a chair and punch the punching bag.
He did this for years until he was tall enough to do it with out a chair(Real talk, look it up)

Growing up in a gym with a Father and an Uncle who were boxers, many world class boxers frequently worked out and sparred at the gym.
Floyd used to spar these GROWN MEN as a young child and all while growing up.
Being exposed to every style known to man and gaining tips and knowledge from these men.(Real talk look it up)

Speaking on his stamina,
He's been training since he was in single digit years.
Running miles with his dad and uncle and himself since he was a young child.
So lets put it this way...
Your body is developing as you grow up, your heart, lungs, etc...
They tell you as a young child to eat your vegetables and drink milk, etc. to help your body develop right.
Well just imagine how his heart and lungs developed while growing up doing basically a full boxing workout since about 5 years old.
The dudes heart and lungs are super developed. he can do those work outs standing on his head man. it's totally normal for him to box 30 rounds with ease. That would probably kill a normal man.
Most of these guys train only at training camp when they have a fight and then go to the club afterwards or don't do anything on they're off time, they gain weight and all kinds of stuff.
Floyd's lifestyle IS TRAINING, this is what he does normally, what he has been doing normally since a child. he knows nothing else. He's basically out of place trying to do anything else, that's why he seems so awkward when you see him trying to be normal and do regular stuff.
He's a Spartan and there's nothing he can do about it.

In conclusion:
So what seems to be, not normal with working out hard all the time,
is totally normal for him, it's not even as hard for him as you think.
That's why he does it so much and a few times a day during training camp.
Normal hard work is child's play and naturally easy for him.
So he has to push it into Triple gear just to get a good work out in.

Well said.

[UTEP]

Jim Lampley said it best, ALL top athletes are using PED's.

[toshmurph]

Feel free to discuss.

Before I say who I think, I got a couple of points first..

Firstly regarding the Mayweather TRT situation, Nevada state had a full disclosure aggreement in place before the ban.. So Mayweather would have to be granted a TRT exemption for him to avail of it.. Now if he wanted he'd easily be allowed an exemption given his age but there's no records of him looking for one and he's never failed a testosterone test! I don't care how famous you are you can't hide that, so if you still disagree you're probably one of those illuminati believing ******s!

Secondly regarding Matthysse and Marquez gaining additional punching power from doping... I am getting pretty tired of guys ignorant of the physical gains that Roids give you! Steroids do not give you additional punching power, fact!! look at Mariusz Pudzianowsk, former bodybuilder and worlds strongest man who turned to mma a few years back! The guy is a muscle bound freak that has availed of hgh and steroids for years... He couldn't punch his way out of a paper bag!!! That's just an example of course

Regarding the guys that I believe have been juicing in recent years I think Evander Holyfield is pretty obvious, Roy Jones Jr also the rumours are just too strong!

[SplitSecond]

Steroids do not give you additional punching power, fact!!

when people say this their credibility on knowing about the sport just goes down the ****ter because it proves they really dont know sht about boxing

have you ever boxed to begin with? i mean atleast a serious amatuer

i'd find it hard to believe that you did if you dont know the mechanics of generating force, you know what power is? speed x strength = power, a bulked out guy doesn't equal power because although their strength may be high, where is the snap to transfer force?

marquez was trained perfectly by hernandez, he was a guy with already very respectable punching form, he needed a boost in power(explosive strength/strength+speed) and he got it in abundance, he was ridiculously strong, yet kept his ability to transfer force/punching form

[Shambrolic]

Most of the UFC roster.

[toshmurph]

when people say this their credibility on knowing about the sport just goes down the ****ter because it proves they really dont know sht about boxing

have you ever boxed to begin with? i mean atleast a serious amatuer

i'd find it hard to believe that you did if you dont know the mechanics of generating force, you know what power is? speed x strength = power, a bulked out guy doesn't equal power because although their strength may be high, where is the snap to transfer force?

marquez was trained perfectly by hernandez, he was a guy with already very respectable punching form, he needed a boost in power(explosive strength/strength+speed) and he got it in abundance, he was ridiculously strong, yet kept his ability to transfer force/punching form

Yes I boxed at amateur at national level here in Ireland (not a great amateur by any stretch), not that it really matters as you said yourself you're talking about body mechanics not the ins and outs of the sport!

The question is does steroids improve punch power not the definition of force which you gave! You mentioned Marquez' S&C as an example of the reason he punched harder, not use of steroids so give a logical answer to the question first and don't deviate!

As an after thought, you mentioned mass x acceleration = force as your resolution? Well if that's the case then TimBradley would be the hardest hitting guy at 147, he's a very athletic fighter with good reactionary times (fast twitch muscle fibers) and a lot of mass for 147, he's a muscle bound guy that weighs 160+ on fight night! These are all signs he should hit like a mule according to your explanation, but we all know that that's not the case now isn't it? Look at a guy like Matthysse, he's not a big 140lb fighter, he's also not a quick fighter, he shouldn't be a big hitter by your standards.. Guess what he hits like a tank!! But I guess your reasoning would be that he's on PEDs??