Sonny Liston - great or ****e?

**butterfly1964** · 02-16-2006, 01:01 AM

Originally posted by hitmanhomey

I love the legend of Sonny Liston - the phantom punch, the fix, etc - but I really can't see what all the fuss is about when I watch his fights. He is clumsy as hell, always off balance, and looks bad even in the victories leading up to the fights with Clay/Ali. I think Clay/Ali would have beaten him 100 out of 100 times, and Foreman, Frasier, Shavers, and Tyson would have had little trouble taking him out.

What say you? Is it all hype stemming from his beatdown of little Floyd Patterson?

liston is probably the most underrated hw ever period. his whole career is based on the ali fights. only ali would be able to take out prime liston. foreman didn't have the skills liston had, frazier had a bad style for liston and sonny would have no trouble taking him out, and shavers was not really a good boxer, just a heavy hitter, and sonny would ko him in two rounds or less. tyson is a joke compared to liston so enough said. liston is 2nd on my all-time hw list, under ali.

**ChrististheAnswer2** · 02-16-2006, 01:10 AM

Tyson is a joke compared to Liston? Yeah whatever you say. Why is it that there is so little respect for professional prize fighters on here? You say Tyson is a joke, yet his accomplsihments stack up to the greatest of all time, and he deserves to be ranked along with them.

Liston was one of the greatest of all time end of story, and so for that matter is Tyson. What you people fail to realize is that the Alis, Listons, Fraziers, Tysons, Holmes, Foremans, Holyfields etc. are all GREAT! The MAJORITY of fighters don't even make a name for themselves, yet alone have a chance to be put into the ATG category. Thats how hard prizefighting is, so when you talk about the aforementioned fighters, they achieved a TON, way more than the average fighter.

Next time you call people bums or jokes think about what they accomplsihed and compare that to what most fighters accomplish.

**restless_438** · 02-16-2006, 01:13 AM

Liston has always been one fighter i've wanted to read more about..

huh, two tony's in a row posting..

**ChrististheAnswer2** · 02-16-2006, 01:15 AM

Originally posted by restless_438

Liston has always been one fighter i've wanted to read more about..

huh, two tony's in a row posting..

Your damn right. The Sopranos are coming back in a couple of weeks, YES! Best TV show ever!

**hollister** · 02-16-2006, 02:39 AM

Liston is a disapointment to some who have only heard of his power, and then are surprised when they see some of his footage that he didn't rely on his power nearly as much as his reputation implies. The guy was much slower than most of his opponents as many of them only weighed 190 lbs., but he was technically sound and had a jab that landed like a ton of bricks. Foreman had the skills that Sonny had, but was much less diciplined in the ring and usually wouldn't stick to using them for more than a round or two, whereas Sonny would fight a whole fight behind the jab if he didn't get an opening. IMO Sonny is definitely underrated by most of the younger hard-core fans simply because they haven't seen his fights outside of the Clay and Patterson fights. CITA, I agree wholeheartedly that we do get carried away with the "bum" and "Joke" labels. These guys aren't bums, they beat bums to get to the level they achieved.
Edit: Just wanted to say that I can't get over how much bigger Liston was than Clay, despite only being announced as 8 lbs. heavier than Clay. If you watch their fights, there isn't a single part of Clay that appears as big as Liston's. I know Clay was an inch or two taller than Liston, but damn lol

**wmute** · 02-16-2006, 03:14 AM

Originally posted by restless_438

Liston has always been one fighter i've wanted to read more about..

huh, two tony's in a row posting..

I read "the devil and sonny liston" by nick tosches

it's a good book: very well written documnentary on a very interesting life, but it is a very sad life

**hitmanhomey** · 02-16-2006, 05:44 AM

Thanks for the input guys. I'd love to see some of the other Liston fights. There MUST be something behind everybody's awe about this guy, and regardless of ability he has to be the coolest fighter of all time. Those stories about him skipping rope to Night Train are just too hepcat.

RE "bums" I assume you're referring to my "great or ****e" headline. That was just to fire you guys up to respond. Liston is obviously up there, or we'd never have heard of him.

**Boxclever** · 02-16-2006, 05:46 AM

Liston must have had something to be such a huge favourite to beat Ali?

**catskills23** · 02-16-2006, 05:33 PM

What i dont understand about liston isa some people say he was slow and clumsy and others say he was quick and powerful . Which was it ? .

Sonny Liston - great or ****e?