Why didn't Dariusz Michalczewski & RJJ ever fight?

[Spray_resistant]

In the ring he came in at 199. Either way, I spoke with a former 175 pound contender and an exercise physiologist who verified what takes place when you lose weight. The 175 contender said it is HORRIBLE losing even body fat, let alone cutting muscle and this ages a fighter, especially one at the end of his prime. Those 2 sources converge on an acceptable fact regarding weight loss for athletes. I'll be happy to debate something that you actually know something about but THIS is not it!
Here is a DOCUMENTED FACT: Five days before the Jones/Tarver match, Jones weighed 183 pounds. He was gaunt and drawn at the weigh-in. He sat slumped on a stool while he waited to step on the scales.

So you honestly believe he "bulked" up to 193 then a day later bulked up another 6lbs?

Also how do you know he had no body fat on him, he didn't look sloppy but didn't look like Steve Cunningham either in the Ruiz fight.

So Roy was drained from having lost 10lbs he had months to lose after the Ruiz fight? Are you under the belief he was walking around at 175 his entire LHW run?

BTW I do know quite a bit about building muscle, its hard to do but taking it off is pretty easy actually.

[richardt]

So you honestly believe he "bulked" up to 193 then a day later bulked up another 6lbs?

Also how do you know he had no body fat on him, he didn't look sloppy but didn't look like Steve Cunningham either in the Ruiz fight.

So Roy was drained from having lost 10lbs he had months to lose after the Ruiz fight? Are you under the belief he was walking around at 175 his entire LHW run?

BTW I do know quite a bit about building muscle, its hard to do but taking it off is pretty easy actually.

You don't realize, when you stop training and you start eating after a weigh in and drinking fluids for the fight, you gain weight. The rehydration process that the muscles demand, retain water, etc. You are no longer in full training which can dehydrate you along the way and up to the weigh in. 6 pounds is nothing if you are trying to keep a certain weight to weigh in that you reached 4-6 weeks earlier. I didn't say he had no body fat, I said he had muscles, very obvious and going back down after gaining muscles is seriously unhealthy. He was ****** for doing that after Ruiz and paid the price. Jones was a natural 168 pound fighter in his prime who walked around between 173 and 178 between LT Heavy fights.

[richardt]

So Roy was drained from having lost 10lbs he had months to lose after the Ruiz fight?

Did you NOT read the part where Jones was 183 FIVE days before the Tarver fight?? That is a FACT! It is on him, but it is what it is.

[richardt]

BTW I do know quite a bit about building muscle, its hard to do but taking it off is pretty easy actually.

No, you are wrong. It is NOT about just body building, it is about performance as a Boxer with regards to muscle loss. I can bring on a 175 pound former contender who can tell you it is HORRID losing body fat, let alone muscle!!!!! According to the former contender, it is the WORSE experience ever as a Boxer, JUST losing body fat.

[Blu]

Can you provide a link to a source or video where roy calls him out

Roy called him out after the Eric Harding fight. I was watching this fight on youtube and after I heard that I looked up to see if Roy and DM ever fought, but they didn't, that's why I made this thread.

[robertzimmerman]

So you honestly believe he "bulked" up to 193 then a day later bulked up another 6lbs?

Also how do you know he had no body fat on him, he didn't look sloppy but didn't look like Steve Cunningham either in the Ruiz fight.

So Roy was drained from having lost 10lbs he had months to lose after the Ruiz fight? Are you under the belief he was walking around at 175 his entire LHW run?

BTW I do know quite a bit about building muscle, its hard to do but taking it off is pretty easy actually.

On HBO's scale before the fight, respected boxing writer Thomas Hauser noted that Roy was 199 pounds. Minus three pounds for clothing etc, he weighed in at 196 pounds.

Mackie Shilstone who had trained Michael Spinks and took him up to HW to fight Holmes etc, cut Roy's body fat percentage before bulking him up.

On the documentary titled - The Sweet Science, the scale is off at the weigh in. Also, he didn't have months to lose the weight, because he kept his physique in the hope of fighting at HW again. He wanted a Tyson fight for huge money. He had a contract on the table to fight Corrie Sanders, but wanted a lot more than what was on offer. In the end he took the Tarver fight, because he wasn't going to take the risk of staying at HW unless he got mega money, and Tarver had baited him all throughout 2003 and had gotten under his skin.

Losing actual muscle can be extremely dangerous. Roy burnt through his muscle fibres. He was nearly 35, he'd fought 50 times, and it was all done in a hurry. He should have had some time off, or eased into a CW fight. Mackie was there to help him gain the weight, but he wasn't there to take it off. He was only back on board for the Tarver rematch.

Roy went from a solid 196, down to 175 for the weigh in, and according to Thomas Hauser, he weighed 181 minus clothes, come fight night. He put his body through a lot. Look at Chad Dawson when he fought Andre Ward? Chad was younger than Roy, with less fights, and John Scully had a nightmare with him in camp.

In the first Tarver fight, Roy was running on fumes for the last three rounds. That had never happened in any of Roy's other fights. The weight loss was a big factor in his performance that night.

[robertzimmerman]

This is a myth about what happened to Roy as he didn't actually put on any significant weight but was rather just not making a cut for 1 fight, also if it was so harmful to his performance explain why he went down to 169 even later to fight Tito and was fine in the fight?

I now realize Roy was a ducker taking safer fights and was threatened by Dariusz who was after all the real LHW champion at the time.

No myth.

Look at Roy's physique against Ruiz, and then compare it to other fights.

Again, Mackie stripped him down and then built him back up. He changed his body fat percentage.

He did the same with Spinks. Spinks used to walk around at almost 200 pounds. Mackie cut his body fat percentage, and then built him back up. At the end of camp, in terms of actual weight, Spinks weighed more or less the same. But his body fat percentage and his physique was completely different.

What has the Tito fight got to do with anything?

That was Jan 2008. That was over 4 years later. That was Roy's 7th fight back at LHW.

With regards to Dariusz M, Richard is correct and he's got great knowledge on the subject.

If you want to know how much Dariusz wanted Roy, go and look at his resume. He fought Griffin, Hall X 2 and Harmon after Roy had destroyed them. He was happy to fight guys like Lakatos etc, while Roy was negotiating to fight at HW. Dariusz didn't want to leave his WBO comfort zone.

[robertzimmerman]

Jones wanted no part of DM. He was more than happy to simply collect the belts that were wrongfully stripped.

HBO didnt call him reluctant Roy without good reason!

Are you saying Dariusz wasn't reluctant? Go and look at his resume. It's not Roy's fault he got stripped, and Dariusz had the opportunity to fight Roy to get them back, but was happy to fight Lakatos and De Grandis etc instead.

[robertzimmerman]

RJJ is happy to go to Russia nowadays and fight a bum,but wouldn't go to Germany to fight a good fighter.Either he was scared of losing or he needs the money now.

Roy's circumstances were obviously very different back then.

Why should the world's best fighter, who was the the unified champ have had to travelled to Germany?

Roy was scarred from the 88 Olympics, and we all saw Dariusz's play acting against Rocchigiani in their first fight.

Roy Jones, 2001 - "I don't think a knockout would be enough over there!"

[robertzimmerman]

If I May the answer is simple. Rjj was making money in the USA regardless and dm was a legitimate threat. Both were happy to ignore each other and keep making money, same with JC. Neither wanted Roy an Roy didn't want then either. Unfortunately missed out on superstar status and mayweather/Tyson money by nit fighting any of these. Rjj lack of career defining or even competitive fights ,
stopped him from being a household name outside of the US.

Roy should have been a bigger star than what he was. If he was prime today, I think he would have been huge. Mayweather is now getting $32m for fighting the likes of Robert Guerrerro. Times have changed.

But Roy had career defining fights, and he wouldn't have got Tyson money for fighting either DM or JC. JC was a nobody until he'd beaten Lacy in 2006.