Comments Thread For: Measured Against All Time: Rafael Marquez

[crold1]

is chad dawson an all time great? he has a better resume than calzaghe. actually beat hopkins legit as well. or does the fact that calzaghe barely fought anyone give him some sort of a fantasy advantage?

Sorry dude, you'll have to go back through numerous old threads on this and dig through those. I'm so bored having the same arguments. I see Calzaghe in much the same fashion I see Holmes or Lopez, both of whom I also consider great.

You don't. I'll live.

[daggum]

Sorry dude, you'll have to go back through numerous old threads on this and dig through those. I'm so bored having the same arguments. I see Calzaghe in much the same fashion I see Holmes or Lopez, both of whom I also consider great.

You don't. I'll live.

but then you don't think hoya or rafa are great. so i don't get it? better wins don't matter? just long streaks of mediocrity?

[crold1]

but then you don't think hoya or rafa are great. so i don't get it? better wins don't matter? just long streaks of mediocrity?

Again, we've discussed our disparate views on Calzaghe's career ad nauseum in the past. The rationale for how I come to each conclusion is explained in detail in the pieces. On those you disagree with, we just disagree.

[Sttuddahboy619]

I agree with the assessment.

[daggum]

Again, we've discussed our disparate views on Calzaghe's career ad nauseum in the past. The rationale for how I come to each conclusion is explained in detail in the pieces. On those you disagree with, we just disagree.

calzaghe wasn't even the best in his division for half the time he was champ. he was second fiddle to sven ottke. how is that great? ward's been legit champ for longer than calzaghe. he's an all time great too right? well as long as he retires right now and doens't lose of course.

why didn't you answer if chad dawson is also an all time great? did he need 20 defenses against bums? if only he hid away for ten years fighting nobodies that would have made him great? if only he beat hopkins and adamek then retired that would have made him great? why does calzaghe get extra credit for not doing things? for not fighting people? for not taking risks? for sitting back and waiting? stupid dawson. fighting dangerous fighters over and over. he should have done nothing for ten years then fought guys who can't punch and move like kessler and lacy. then hopkins. then retirement. then all time great. then lol!

[damit305]

calzaghe wasn't even the best in his division for half the time he was champ. he was second fiddle to sven ottke. how is that great? ward's been legit champ for longer than calzaghe. he's an all time great too right? well as long as he retires right now and doens't lose of course.

why didn't you answer if chad dawson is also an all time great? did he need 20 defenses against bums? if only he hid away for ten years fighting nobodies that would have made him great? if only he beat hopkins and adamek then retired that would have made him great? why does calzaghe get extra credit for not doing things? for not fighting people? for not taking risks? for sitting back and waiting? stupid dawson. fighting dangerous fighters over and over. he should have done nothing for ten years then fought guys who can't punch and move like kessler and lacy. then hopkins. then retirement. then all time great. then lol!

[daggum]

please explain to me how calzaghe is great while at the same time saying rafa marquez is not great. seems impossible doesn't it?

better fighters beaten-marquez
better fighters faced-marquez
great fighters faced in or near their primes-marquez
willingness to face fighters-marquez

calzaghe does dominate the superficial and corrupt categories though...

title defenses-calzaghe(but against who?)
longevity-calzaghe(but against who?)
early stoppages-calzaghe
gift decisions-calzaghe

[crold1]

I agree with the assessment.

Thanks. It's a fun career to watch at peak. Rafa was a genuine gunslinger.

[bojangles1987]

I always consider Rafael Marquez great just for giving us the trilogy against Vazquez.

[IronDanHamza]

I don't consider Rafa Marquez an ATG but he's certainly above Calzaghe.

I wouldn't even vote Calzaghe into the HOF.

If/when Calzaghe get's into the HOF he will be right next to Pastrano, McGuigan, Chalkey Wright, Gatti etc as the most underserving HOF'ers of all time.