The difference between simple elite & business elite, in my opinion however unpopular

[BoxingGenius27]

It's not though.

On Boxrec, it's highlighted if the win is by TKO or KO.

I.e the Ricky Hatton example I used.

He lost the Pacquaio fight by KO 2 and the Mayweather fight by TKO 10.

According to Boxrec.

True, but if you look at Hatton's boxrec profile, in his profile, you'll see it lists Hatton as having 2 KO losses even though one was a TKO.

If you look at Cotto's boxrec, he has 2 losses as KO's even though they were obviously TKO's.

Under the main headline, boxrec spells out what type of loss or win it was (i.e TKO, KO, UD, ect). But in the main headline, it's listed as either a win (KO %), loss (KO %) or draw. It doesn't differenciate.

[IronDanHamza]

Tru, but if you look at Hatton's boxrec profile, in his profile, you'll see it lists Hatton as having 2 KO losses even though one was a TKO.

If you look at Cotto's boxrec, he has 2 losses as KO's even though they were obviously TKO's.

Under the main headline, boxrec spells out what type of loss or win it was (i.e TKO, KO, UD, ect). But under the main fighters name, it's listed as either a win (KO %), loss (KO %) or draw. It doesn't differenciate.

Oh, yes. I get you.

That's the problem with using that as your source instead of actually knowing how the fights went.

Because then you have people claiming Castillo was KO'd 4 times prior to fighting Mayweather.

[BoxingGenius27]

Oh, yes. I get you.

That's the problem with using that as your source instead of actually knowing how the fights went.

Because then you have people claiming Castillo was KO'd 4 times prior to fighting Mayweather.

I understand.

Larry said Roy has been KO'd 4 times, while I didn't comment, I'm thinking to myself Roy has only been KO'd twice, but TKO'd twice as well, but whatever lol

I also ran into someone that told me Roy lost to Griffin because that's what the record said. But I don't consider that a loss. It was a DQ, not a loss. I guess it comes down to playing with words in this case.

[IronDanHamza]

I understand.

Larry said Roy has been KO'd 4 times, while I didn't comment, I'm thinking to myself Roy has only been KO'd twice, but TKO'd twice as well, but whatever lol

I also ran into someone that told me Roy lost to Griffin because that's what the record said. But I don't consider that a loss. It was a DQ, not a loss. I guess it comes down to playing with words in this case.

I don't know about anyone else but to me, a KO is exactly what it states. Getting knocked out.

A fighter may have been stopped but it doesn't mean he was KO'd.

Like you highlighted with Roy. I guess the lingo is changing these days and specific's aren't a thing of much matter anymore.

[BoxingGenius27]

I don't know about anyone else but to me, a KO is exactly what it states. Getting knocked out.

A fighter may have been stopped but it doesn't mean he was KO'd.

Like you highlighted with Roy. I guess the lingo is changing these days and specific's aren't a thing of much matter anymore.

Another example is when the announcer is introducing a guy before the fight.

He spells out how many wins he has then says "with 40 knockouts", even though 30 of those knockouts were TKO's, they still don't differenciate for some reason. Although we know the difference, it's still announced before the fight as a KO as oppose to TKO

[Bushbaby]

My point is this, I never said a tko & a ko are the exact same thing. They are still both ko losses though. Just like there are 3 types of decision losses. I'm not differentiating between them. By split, majority or unanimous.
Just seems like some want to force that into the topic when that's not what I'm trying to discuss.

To me Floyd can fight whomever & people will be ok with that.

But no matter the caliber of fighter Ward beats, he won't recieve the same praise.

[B Phontain]

Floyd could unify 147. The Khan-Floyd fight is simply a moneymaker, nothing more.We shouldn't mention Martinez who is the most dangerous fighter out there therefore Floyd won't fight him. He'll just beat on the Khans of the world.

After reading all 13 pages of this thread i finally see what u were getting at the whole time........ you kno u coulda saved a lot of time and typing by just putting this here first.

you see i couldnt figure out what your point was in saying that ward and dawson are the two best separated by one weight class, when essentially after tomorrow night So will Floyd and Khan (assuming floyd cant get a top rank fighter: brad/pac and khan beats garcia convincingly). It just didnt make sense. It also became clearer when you wouldnt answer who u think floyd should fight 140/147 if not khan. Hell even 154 who should he fight if not khan. But yet the only fighter i seen u mention is 160 martinez. So basically floyd is not in your good graces because you dont think he'll fight a guy two weight classes above him at this juncture in his career? That would be like me saying Khan is more elite than ward because khan is willing to go up in weight to fight mayweather while ward is good having a guy come down to his weight class. Thats not really fair statement to make imo.

[B Phontain]

No, you can't be this stupid.

A ko loss is when a fighter goes down & is unable to beat the count.

A tko is when the ref or doctor determines a fighter unable to continue.'

They are still both ko losses. When just has technicalities. I never said they were the same meaning that there were no differences. It still counts as a ko loss. The big Technical being the difference doesn't change that that fight was unable to continue.

But I could see how an idiot such as yourself could be stupid enough to try & bend the conversation to serve your purpose. If Castillo is Floyd's best win, that says a lot about Floyd.

question: would u feel any different about a tko if it happened because a ref or doctor deemed a fighter unable to continue even if the fighter wanted to still fight? i.e doctor stoppage due to cut from a headbutt or elbow. just curious

[Phenom]

Ok, 2 elite fighters. Floyd Mayweather & Andre Ward. Both are indeed elite fighters & both are very good. But there is an obvious difference between the 2 fighters. Floyd is business elite & Ward is simply elite.

Right now there are rumors that Floyd may be fighting Amir Kahn at 147. Most Floyd fans & probably fight fans in general seem ok with this fight. But the fact is that Khan has not ever fought at 147 & there are fighters that deserve a fight with Floyd more than he does & those fighters probably will never be considered opponents for Floyd because they do not draw.

Meanwhile Ward will be fighting Dawson next Dawson is the recognized best fighter at 175. Yes they are fighting at 168, but the fight is between the 2 best fighters of there respective weight classes. There are some that call the fight boring. There are some that say the fight does not deserve it's 1 show 24/7. But this fight is between the 2 best fighters of a weight class separated by a weight class.

It is relatively safe to assume, or presume that you cannot say that there is a better fighter at 168 than Dawson. In stark contrast you cannot say the same about Khan at 147. There are fighters there right now ranked higher, with better welterweight wins over an undeserving Khan.

The difference between Ward & Floyd is that Floyd can fight whoever & put it on ppv, while Ward has to struggle to get draws, even if he's fighting the best fighters in the world. And for some reason, pfp will see Floyd as the better fighter even if it is Ward that's fighting the better fighters of the 2.

what the fuck are you *****ing about Floyd just fought the #1 at 154 and didn't make him come down to 147 Ward is fighting Dawson at 168 his 1st fight at that weight in 8 years and at wards home town.

matter fact Ward the only fighter at super 6 who had home advantage in every fight

[Bushbaby]

After reading all 13 pages of this thread i finally see what u were getting at the whole time........ you kno u coulda saved a lot of time and typing by just putting this here first.

you see i couldnt figure out what your point was in saying that ward and dawson are the two best separated by one weight class, when essentially after tomorrow night So will Floyd and Khan (assuming floyd cant get a top rank fighter: brad/pac and khan beats garcia convincingly). It just didnt make sense. It also became clearer when you wouldnt answer who u think floyd should fight 140/147 if not khan. Hell even 154 who should he fight if not khan. But yet the only fighter i seen u mention is 160 martinez. So basically floyd is not in your good graces because you dont think he'll fight a guy two weight classes above him at this juncture in his career? That would be like me saying Khan is more elite than ward because khan is willing to go up in weight to fight mayweather while ward is good having a guy come down to his weight class. Thats not really fair statement to make imo.

I've never mention Floyd fighting a 160lb Martinez. The fight is completely make able at 154. 160 are Floyd fans because they don't want Floyd in danger so they go overboard saying people want the fight at 160. If I'm not mistaken Martinez has never made 160. This shows that 154 is doable.

what the fuck are you *****ing about Floyd just fought the #1 at 154 and didn't make him come down to 147 Ward is fighting Dawson at 168 his 1st fight at that weight in 8 years and at wards home town.

matter fact Ward the only fighter at super 6 who had home advantage in every fight

What's a more competitive fight, Floyd/Cotto or Floyd/Martinez at 154??

But also would Ward have lost those fights anywhere else on the planet?? If so how??