Comments Thread For: Pacquiao, Roach: Discuss Marquez Issues, Fourth Fight

[boxingfan76]

hang on there mang, smiles

first , lets name who Jr has fought in the prime elite level of Welter weights in the past 8 years, personally I can't name ONE !!!!!!

So its left up to YOU MANG, smiles go ahead !!

Then reach back into the vastness of your knowledge and think of great fighters who had trilogy's and really didn't look great and then make the same comparisons with Pac.

The ONLY fighter to give Pac trouble past the first Morales fight is JMM. He has Pacs number but will never win if they fought a 1000 times.

Pac has fought all the top elites of his day in the Welter weight divison minus JR. Pac has slaughtered All the elites, where they were good or not they were the best but:

JR ducked them all in his prime , UNLESS you can name just ONE

your even dead wrong there too pac hasnt fought anybody at the top at welterweight at allllll hes fought a buncha faded 'NAMES' coming off decisive losses in some cases total destructions, Mayweather doesnt exactley face the best either but he fights slightly better opp.he fought hatton when hatton was undefeated, he fought mosley when pac wanted no part of mosley he absolutley ducked mosley, he fough ortiz pac ducked ortiz too, because ortiz was badly whupping pac in sparring as roach attested to.then he wanted to rematch cotto really??? woulda been the most unwanted unwarranted non-competetive cherry pick in history but thats what pac does he seeks the weakest most winnable comp, he did that with JMm also only it completley backfired on him.

dude its one thing to be a fan another to be completley blind just looks at floyds last 4 Performances then look at pacs last 4 THATS SUPPOSED TO BEAT MAYWEATHER???? I DONT THINK SO BUDDY PAC IS A WHOLE LEVEL BENEATH JR IN THE RING.WHOSE DOMINATING MORE? WHO HAS BETTER DEFENSE? WHOS FASTER? WHOS OFFENSE IS BETTER? WHOS CONNECT PERCENTAGE ACCURACY /CONNECT % IS HIGHER?WHO HAS BETTER FOOTSPEED/WORK?WHOM HAS SUPERB BOXING SKILSS? ITS MAYWEATHER! DUDE MAYWEATHER HAS HARDLY EVEN LOST A ROUND SINCE HIS UNRETIREMENT AN THATS ALONG TIME AGO! AND YOUR WELTERWEIGHT ARGUMENT IS MOOT BECAUSE PAC JUST LOST TO A LITEWEIGHT! PROVING ONCE AND FOR ALL HIS WELTERWEIGHT FOES WERE ALL 2ND OR 3RD RATE BUMS!

I DONT EVEN LIKE MAYWEATHER BUT ITS LONG OVERDUE TO BE HONEST ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE DUDE MAYWEATHER WOULD DOMINATE THAT CLOWN, AND ITS NO ACCIDENT THAT THEY HAVENT FOUGHT, ARUM AND MANNY ARENT READY TO GET HUMILIATED AGAIN OR WORSE.

[treason1]

manny is right the fans would get tired of hearing marquez cry and complain about being cheated if a fourth fight was to happen and manny whoops marquez ass yet again !!!!!!! truth is maarquez had a slim chance to win but he listened to that idiot nacho and it cost him the fight !!!!!! what freedy said truely illustrates the diffrence in a atg triner of the yr trainer like freddy and a good coach like nacho !!!! freddy gets the most out of his fighter , if hes winning he wants him to winn by a larger margrin !!!! while nacho is just hapopy to be there and good is good enough !!!! he doesnt demand excellence from his fighter and it shows !!!!! thats why angulo lost !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[commandant]

your even dead wrong there too pac hasnt fought anybody at the top at welterweight at allllll hes fought a buncha faded 'NAMES' coming off decisive losses in some cases total destructions, Mayweather doesnt exactley face the best either but he fights slightly better opp.he fought hatton when hatton was undefeated, he fought mosley when pac wanted no part of mosley he absolutley ducked mosley, he fough ortiz pac ducked ortiz too, because ortiz was badly whupping pac in sparring as roach attested to.then he wanted to rematch cotto really??? woulda been the most unwanted unwarranted non-competetive cherry pick in history but thats what pac does he seeks the weakest most winnable comp, he did that with JMm also only it completley backfired on him.

dude its one thing to be a fan another to be completley blind just looks at floyds last 4 Performances then look at pacs last 4 THATS SUPPOSED TO BEAT MAYWEATHER???? I DONT THINK SO BUDDY PAC IS A WHOLE LEVEL BENEATH JR IN THE RING.WHOSE DOMINATING MORE? WHO HAS BETTER DEFENSE? WHOS FASTER? WHOS OFFENSE IS BETTER? WHOS CONNECT PERCENTAGE ACCURACY /CONNECT % IS HIGHER?WHO HAS BETTER FOOTSPEED/WORK?WHOM HAS SUPERB BOXING SKILSS? ITS MAYWEATHER! DUDE MAYWEATHER HAS HARDLY EVEN LOST A ROUND SINCE HIS UNRETIREMENT AN THATS ALONG TIME AGO! AND YOUR WELTERWEIGHT ARGUMENT IS MOOT BECAUSE PAC JUST LOST TO A LITEWEIGHT! PROVING ONCE AND FOR ALL HIS WELTERWEIGHT FOES WERE ALL 2ND OR 3RD RATE BUMS!

I DONT EVEN LIKE MAYWEATHER BUT ITS LONG OVERDUE TO BE HONEST ITS NOT EVEN CLOSE DUDE MAYWEATHER WOULD DOMINATE THAT CLOWN, AND ITS NO ACCIDENT THAT THEY HAVENT FOUGHT, ARUM AND MANNY ARENT READY TO GET HUMILIATED AGAIN OR WORSE.

bums that arum has total control of or can easily be bought. he even got vegas judges in his pocket just look at what happened in the scooling pac got from JMM but JMM still lost. It exposed how crooked vegas and arum are.

[commandant]

manny is right the fans would get tired of hearing marquez cry and complain about being cheated if a fourth fight was to happen and manny whoops marquez ass yet again !!!!!!! truth is maarquez had a slim chance to win but he listened to that idiot nacho and it cost him the fight !!!!!! what freedy said truely illustrates the diffrence in a atg triner of the yr trainer like freddy and a good coach like nacho !!!! freddy gets the most out of his fighter , if hes winning he wants him to winn by a larger margrin !!!! while nacho is just hapopy to be there and good is good enough !!!! he doesnt demand excellence from his fighter and it shows !!!!! thats why angulo lost !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

trainer of the year but still didnt have one word or a clue to say to pac in the JMM fight in between rounds lmao!!

[boxingfan76]

MANG , yer gittin mad mang

If JMM whupped him so badly why didn't he just KO PAC ?

IF JMM whupped Pac so badly why didn't Pac have a mark on his face that wasn't from a head butt ( cut )?

Did you look at JMM's face ?? Poor mang looked like a swelled up feed barrel , what he did, hahahaha

answer the question I have asked to ALL with no response:

Who has JR fought among the elite prime welter weights over the past 8 years ???????

IF U WATCHED THE FIGHT THAT SWELLING ON JMM CAME FROM A PAC HEADBUTT IN THE 4TH ROUND, PACS BEST PUNCH OF THE FIGHT, ALSO KATSIDIS EFFED UP JMM 10X WORSE AND STILL GOT KOED, TO PACS CREDIT HE HAS A GOOD CHIN THATS KOD MORE GUYS THAN PAC HAS KOED, PAC WAS BLEEDING FROM TEH MOUTH JMM DIDNT BLEED AT ALL! YOU ARGUING JMM LOST BECAUSE HE COULDNT KO A DUDE WITH THE HEAD THE SIZE OF A GIANT MELON??? RIDDICULOUS! jmm WHUPPE PAC AND IT WASNT EVEN CLOSE BRO, ROACH: WE NEED A KO MANNY IN THE 10TH ROUND,ARIZA:"MANNY WAS EXPOSED" ROACH: WE OWE THIS GUY A 4TH FIGHT HE HAS PACS NUMBER" if they truly felt they won why would they owe anyone a 4th fight?? its crazy i understand this guy is supposed to be this god but face it hes been exposed as a hypejob and pretty damn clearly too.

[boxingfan76]

manny is right the fans would get tired of hearing marquez cry and complain about being cheated if a fourth fight was to happen and manny whoops marquez ass yet again !!!!!!! truth is maarquez had a slim chance to win but he listened to that idiot nacho and it cost him the fight !!!!!! what freedy said truely illustrates the diffrence in a atg triner of the yr trainer like freddy and a good coach like nacho !!!! freddy gets the most out of his fighter , if hes winning he wants him to winn by a larger margrin !!!! while nacho is just hapopy to be there and good is good enough !!!! he doesnt demand excellence from his fighter and it shows !!!!! thats why angulo lost !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

lets compare what these "great" trainers told their pupils in between rounds- Roach-" what the eff are u doing manny go to his left your following him around!" "manny we need a knockout in order to win this fight" going into the 10th round did they score one ???not even close. Beistain - Dont take any unnecessary chances your well ahead" and in an honest setting jmm wouldve won quite easily but since everyone bet their house on pac and vegas has their eye on mayweather theres absolutley no way in hell jmm was going to get a decision there unless he ko'd the guy.judges be damned the fight was a loss for manny his rep and cover has been badly badly damaged at the fists of JMM

[WholeSoul75]

pacman and marquez = warriors.

first they felt it was right to give an instant rematch then not now?? too many opinions and statements out of emotion. boxing as we know it.
i had the belief before the fight that i wouldn't mind if pacman lost just to humble a lot of fanatics.
pacman weaknesses were exploited but still pulled through. expectations tilted some views. i think marquez adds that mental challenge to his skills which make him difficult for pacman to dominate.

[commandant]

lets compare what these "great" trainers told their pupils in between rounds- Roach-" what the eff are u doing manny go to his left your following him around!" "manny we need a knockout in order to win this fight" going into the 10th round did they score one ???not even close. Beistain - Dont take any unnecessary chances your well ahead" and in an honest setting jmm wouldve won quite easily but since everyone bet their house on pac and vegas has their eye on mayweather theres absolutley no way in hell jmm was going to get a decision there unless he ko'd the guy.judges be damned the fight was a loss for manny his rep and cover has been badly badly damaged at the fists of JMM

hahaha i think those are the only rounds roach even spoke to be honest.
Boboi in pacs ear telling him " run , stay away from him" in tagalog lmfao

[GRUSTLER]

So basically Roach is saying that he can't get Pacquiao to beat Juan Manuel Marquez if he is saying that the fight will be the same out come.

[S IP U IR S xII]

How was Miguel Cotto the best option? Do you know how many people were willing to fight Pacquiao? This is back when Mayweather, Berto, Williams and Margarito were on top and winning. Pacquiao CHOSE to fight the lesser man.

That how it applies.

Cotto was and still is bigger draw than anyone you mentioned there, and you know it. Floyd would be the only draw out of the ones you mentioned. Thats such a cop out when people say that everyone is mentally beaten when it makes their argument sound better. Thats NOT a fact, but an opinion. Nothing you can say will prove otherwise. Oscar was not same after his robbery against Tito...damaged goods. Zab upset loss to Carlos...damaged goods....i dont buy any of that. Now do some fighters mentally lose it after a devastating loss...yes, but to assume its EVERYONE that your fav fighter rivals fights just shows biased.

Who cares who challenged who?!?!?

I'll bet you that it wasn't DLH's idea to come in at 145lbs!!!!!!

That was a b!tch move. If you're going to compare yourself to Floyd, you should at least try and match what he did and not just load the deck and pretend you're on a winning streak.

I have no idea what you are talking about here....Pac and Oscar fought at 147. Pac even came in heavier that night. Again.....this was Oscars call, and choice not the other way around. Would you take this fight to make a huge payday? Comon now.....

Wrong. Both became accessible to non-fans AFTER they fought DLH. Floyd was already P4P#1. Once Roy Jones fell off, Floyd was the clear heir apparent. Its sure the fcuk wasn't Manny Pacquiao!

You just agreed with me but you say im wrong? Hmmmmm. As for P4P. That doesnt mean you sell. I dare you to compare RJJ PPV to Floyd, Pac, Oscar, or even Tyson....P4P does not mean you are a cash cow, and attracting even the non boxing fan. RJJ had his music and brief movie career to help, but it never put him on the level from a popularity standpoint as any of the names i mentioned.

Maybe they began to enjoy PPV success, but Floyd was boxing's star prior to his DLH fight. Maybe that's when YOU found out about Floyd and Pacquiao. That's your business.

This is just so fan boyish im not even going to respond this one

However, Morales beat Pacquiao by OUTBOXING him!!! Is it a coincidence that before the fight the blood work got lost and Pacquiao had to resubmit a clean sample? And in order to do that, Pacquiao would have to be or at the very least get clean fast enough to submit a clean sample. Did you see his performance?
HE GOT OUTBOXED BY A GUY NOT KNOWN FOR HIS BOXING SKILLS!!!!!!!!!!

Here we go with the guilty till innocent because Floyds camp said do....not even going to respond to this, as its played out and dead.

I think not. Then afterwards, Pacquiao came back and blasted Morales in a rematch WITHOUT CHANGING ONE FCUKING THING!!!!

You mean the same way Floyd did against Castillo...or Punisher did against Quintana? (Ill wait for the injury excuse though ) Or Lennox against Hasim?

JMM arguably beat Pacquiao three times. In the first match, Pacquiao won the first round BIG TIME. JMM came back to teach him a boxing lesson and get a draw.

I agree the JMM couldve gone either way, and that JMM just might be what Vernon Forrest was to Shane

The second fight was more lopsided than the first. Yet Pacquiao got the nod.

Comon man....it was close...lets not pretend it was a Williams Lara. Thats getting overplayed already.

The third was a clear win for JMM and nearly every writer/blogger/pundit went on record to say so. JMM is a better fighter than Manny Pacquiao. Manny Pacquiao simply has a better promoter.

Again....clear? I had the fight a draw, and would not argue had JMM gotten the call. Again....lets not pretend it was a Chavez Whitaker fight. People natural reaction is to favor the underdog....especially when the fight does not go as many predicted. One over achieved and the other under achieved by most accounts that night.

Diaz and Solis????? I won't begrudge Manny Pacquiao from having tune ups, but put them in their proper context. They were tune ups ... meaning that they had absolutely no champion quality legacy value whatsoever.

Again.....if not, then WHO shouldve he fought to satisfy you?

Now you might have the desire to argue, but the facts won't support you. Pacquiao had every opportunity to face these men when they were coming off wins, were confident and more importantly ... they WERE RANKED IN THE TOP 3!!! Instead, Manny waited on 6 different occasions for someone else to beat them before he was willing to face them in the ring.

When they came off career wins? Uhhhhh he went from Oscar at 147, back to 140, to 145, to 147, to 150 back to 147. This is from 2008-Now. After DLH, who shouldve been his not fight? Point is that, you want to bash someone because you favor one fighter over the other, but are unable to be objective and do the same for another. Example being...had Pac fought Ortiz, yall wouldve said..."hes fighting a no heart fighter that quit and is overrated, that got the win of his life against Berto" Floyd fights him, then its...."Floyd fighting a hungry lion coming off a huge win". Its all bull s.

You also cannot dispute that Manny has attempted to beat several men on the scales as a way of gaining an unfair advantage.

Pac has almost 60 fights, and 3 catch weight fights, but hes the king of catch weight? Hmmmmm......

You also cannot dispute that Pacquiao has on several occasions sought vacant titles instead of facing champions for the title. This is how he became the 8 division titlist.

Like you said earlier, its a business. Arum is a good promoter, and knows how to market. At this point its all about dollars now. Bradley is a high risk low reward fight for Pac. Same for Floyd vs Cotto. There is no other fight for either guy to take on. Sergio is NEVER going to happen. Titles dont mean crap. Theres 6 belts in every division...EVERYONE HAS A BELT.

If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, its a duck.

When i hear statements like that, all that is shown is fan boyism. Im not trying to argue nor am i going to name call anyone. I am simply offering a form of objection, and showing a lack of consistency by most on here. Biggest example being is when people say, Floyd DOMINATED Oscar, and for them to go look at compubox, but when Pac out lands JMM, then its "well compuox dont tell the whole story". Again....this is the inconsistency that is displayed on here more times than not.