Comments Thread For: Vitali Klitschko States: I Can Leave Boxing at Any Time

[Jedi Vader]

I think they're both A level fighters, the problem is their greatness gets way overrated due to their B level comp. I see no reasonable way to rank them over fighters who simply beat more proven competition whether we ASSUME they would beat that same competition. How can someone logically bump great fighters who actually beat more talented fighters and replace them with the brother's, who while looking good, don't have the same level of fighters to compete against? Head to head I believe they are at the very least top fighters in ANY era. That's just guess work and supposition though. Bottom line is every all time top 10 heavyweight has much of the same type of competition on their resumes, but they also have career defining fights and other all time greats on it as well with most having fought fighters who were more talented than today's crop of contenders who are for the most part inconsistent, out of shape, untested, unskilled or a combination of all those things.

Larry Holmes often gets brought up in comparison to the K bros era. Difference is he had a career defining fight with Norton, 20 consecutive defenses and beat guys like Witherspoon who while not very experienced at the time had tremendous skills in which he displayed that night and many nights after. I don't see the as the K bros fault, but its the contenders of this era who bring their all time status down. If just two or three of them could build some consistency fighting other contenders even if they lost against other rated guys and showed they had the heart to come back and keep fighting the best than the brother's would be that much better off. Instead we got guys like Povetkin, Arreolla and others who are content to sit on their rankings looking for their next shot or payday. The division needs a modern day Jerry Quarry or Sam Langford, guys who weren't afraid to lose but who were always willing to take chances. Just my two cents.

I cannot disagree with that line. It isn't the Klits' fault that we're in such a derisory era of Heavyweight fighters. However, Vitali lost both of the hardest fights he had and never rematched either. Wlad avenged is brothers' loss but those wins doesn't exactly give him the status so many of his nuthuggers bestow him with.

I could give many examples of other fighters with better wins in their careers. Buster Douglas' Tyson scalp is a greater victory than any of the near 100 fights the Klits have fought combined.

[jimmy1569]

Who cares about the non great heavies.. the brother's are alltime greats regardless of opposition. Stick 'em in with anyone & chances are the results will have remained the same..


You all say the division is shet despite the fact you have two alltime great fighters in this era. Go back to all the previous eras & the pattern is the same. The 90's you had Holyfield.. Lewis & Tyson with a bit of Bowe and a Hamburger eating Foreman.. 80's all there was to offer was Holmes.. 70's you had Foreman, Ali & Frazier.. 60's Liston.. 40's & 50's Marciano & Louis.....


How are the Klitschko's not part of this similar equation? They are as dominant as any fighters we've ever seen at heavyweight. There combined numbers are the best ever. It's not a weak era at all.. that's just a fallacy. The Klitschko's are so good they are making a mockery of the heavyweight division & in turn there competition gets downgraded twofold..


The brother's also did alot of there early work in the late 90's when those great heavies were active.. so this is one big fabrication created by the media to lessen the value of these alltime great fighters who'd give ANY fighter of yesteryear a run for there money. How can they not when they have all the physical advantages & an almost impenetrable European style?


You're all fools to focus on there competition.. The competition has NOTHING to do with the brother's success but let's all make believe that they do so we can preserve alltime great fighters before them who were less succesful against there competition.. Keep lying to yourselves.. we're watching two of the greatest heavyweights of alltime & they came from the same womb somewhere in a communist nation back in the day..


No matter how we spin this we're NOT rolling with them because of the country they fight in (Germany) & where they were born (Ukraine).... to put it bluntly... & keep it at it's most real.. what fighter's from those areas are revered here in the States? We assosciate the brother's with old school communism.. we're not going to give them the satisfaction of assessing there skills in the proper context. Believe it or not... it's me that is closer to the truth in grading there talents but it's me that is being ridiculed for it by biased people here on the forums WHO CAN'T EVEN ADMIT HOW GOOD BOTH BROTHERS ARE & HOW FLAWLESS VITALI KLITSCHKO REALLY IS...... YOU'RE ALL PATHETIC & SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR SELVES!

[JAB5239]

I cannot disagree with that line. It isn't the Klits' fault that we're in such a derisory era of Heavyweight fighters. However, Vitali lost both of the hardest fights he had and never rematched either. Wlad avenged is brothers' loss but those wins doesn't exactly give him the status so many of his nuthuggers bestow him with.

I could give many examples of other fighters with better wins in their careers. Buster Douglas' Tyson scalp is a greater victory than any of the near 100 fights the Klits have fought combined.

In Vitaly's defence he did prove he could hang in both those losses. He should have pursued the Byrd rematch though.

Buster Douglas is a great example of past talent. He's better than any contender today in my opinion. Unfortunately he was just as inconsistent as today's contenders though. But boy could he fight when he wanted to!

[JAB5239]

Who cares about the non great heavies.. the brother's are alltime greats regardless of opposition. Stick 'em in with anyone & chances are the results will have remained the same..


You all say the division is shet despite the fact you have two alltime great fighters in this era. Go back to all the previous eras & the pattern is the same. The 90's you had Holyfield.. Lewis & Tyson with a bit of Bowe and a Hamburger eating Foreman.. 80's all there was to offer was Holmes.. 70's you had Foreman, Ali & Frazier.. 60's Liston.. 40's & 50's Marciano & Louis.....


How are the Klitschko's not part of this similar equation? They are as dominant as any fighters we've ever seen at heavyweight. There combined numbers are the best ever. It's not a weak era at all.. that's just a fallacy. The Klitschko's are so good they are making a mockery of the heavyweight division & in turn there competition gets downgraded twofold..


The brother's also did alot of there early work in the late 90's when those great heavies were active.. so this is one big fabrication created by the media to lessen the value of these alltime great fighters who'd give ANY fighter of yesteryear a run for there money. How can they not when they have all the physical advantages & an almost impenetrable European style?


You're all fools to focus on there competition.. The competition has NOTHING to do with the brother's success but let's all make believe that they do so we can preserve alltime great fighters before them who were less succesful against there competition.. Keep lying to yourselves.. we're watching two of the greatest heavyweights of alltime & they came from the same womb somewhere in a communist nation back in the day..


No matter how we spin this we're NOT rolling with them because of the country they fight in (Germany) & where they were born (Ukraine).... to put it bluntly... & keep it at it's most real.. what fighter's from those areas are revered here in the States? We assosciate the brother's with old school communism.. we're not going to give them the satisfaction of assessing there skills in the proper context. Believe it or not... it's me that is closer to the truth in grading there talents but it's me that is being ridiculed for it by biased people here on the forums WHO CAN'T EVEN ADMIT HOW GOOD BOTH BROTHERS ARE & HOW FLAWLESS VITALI KLITSCHKO REALLY IS...... YOU'RE ALL PATHETIC & SHOULD BE ASHAMED OF YOUR SELVES!

Jimmy, competition has EVERYTHING to do with success. Put an average major league pitcher on a high school baseball team and he's going to be the greatest high school pitcher ever. In the big leagues though he's only average because the competition is that much greater. You can't just say ANY fighter would be great because they dominate weak comp. They may or may not be, but its unable to be proven therefore preventing them from being held to the same greatness as others who have actually proven it.

[Jedi Vader]

In Vitaly's defence he did prove he could hang in both those losses. He should have pursued the Byrd rematch though.

Buster Douglas is a great example of past talent. He's better than any contender today in my opinion. Unfortunately he was just as inconsistent as today's contenders though. But boy could he fight when he wanted to!

That's true about Douglas. I'm convinced to this day that his mindset going into that Tyson fight with the death of his mom and his wife having cancer, nobody would've lived with him on that night.

He fought like he was possessed. Surviving that knock down that not many others would've survived the count and brutally finishing tyson leaving him wading arounnd the canvas looking for his shield.

He literally went into that fight not giving an ounce of ****.

[jimmy1569]

I think they're both A level fighters, the problem is their greatness gets way overrated due to their B level comp. I see no reasonable way to rank them over fighters who simply beat more proven competition whether we ASSUME they would beat that same competition. How can someone logically bump great fighters who actually beat more talented fighters and replace them with the brother's, who while looking good, don't have the same level of fighters to compete against? Head to head I believe they are at the very least top fighters in ANY era. That's just guess work and supposition though. Bottom line is every all time top 10 heavyweight has much of the same type of competition on their resumes, but they also have career defining fights and other all time greats on it as well with most having fought fighters who were more talented than today's crop of contenders who are for the most part inconsistent, out of shape, untested, unskilled or a combination of all those things.

Larry Holmes often gets brought up in comparison to the K bros era. Difference is he had a career defining fight with Norton, 20 consecutive defenses and beat guys like Witherspoon who while not very experienced at the time had tremendous skills in which he displayed that night and many nights after. I don't see the as the K bros fault, but its the contenders of this era who bring their all time status down. If just two or three of them could build some consistency fighting other contenders even if they lost against other rated guys and showed they had the heart to come back and keep fighting the best than the brother's would be that much better off. Instead we got guys like Povetkin, Arreolla and others who are content to sit on their rankings looking for their next shot or payday. The division needs a modern day Jerry Quarry or Sam Langford, guys who weren't afraid to lose but who were always willing to take chances. Just my two cents.

Are you listening to yourself... son? You even state the brother's comp is not much different than any of the past greats opposition except for a few names here & there.. I've always stated that 80% of any past alltime greats competition is similar to what the brother's have faced throughout there careers. We are penalizing the bros for 3 or 4 names they didn't face that other greats faced through no fault of there own.

You even state they'd be top fighters in any era. You're NOT making a guesstimation here as you claim. You have 104 Klitschko fights to choose from as evidence. Head to head.. both brothers even by hater standards are top 10 heavies. Head to head is not a guesstimation... it's an estimation based on how they've performed & the skillset they've shown for 104 fights..


You haters EVEN admit how great they are but dismiss it regardless & DISS there competition & therefore the brothers get dissed as the result of this.... It's a form of hypocritical behavior that is disguised as guile.. despite it's downright being in denial of how great the brother's are at boxing.. You're all denying them there just due.

[jimmy1569]

Jimmy, competition has EVERYTHING to do with success. Put an average major league pitcher on a high school baseball team and he's going to be the greatest high school pitcher ever. In the big leagues though he's only average because the competition is that much greater. You can't just say ANY fighter would be great because they dominate weak comp. They may or may not be, but its unable to be proven therefore preventing them from being held to the same greatness as others who have actually proven it.

See... that's your problem right there... you just stated the Klitschko's are boxing in the minor leagues when they have BEEN fighting there entire careers in the major leagues.. same league as any other past great fighters have fought.

It's you that is downgrading the competition to the point where the kLITSCHKO'S have NOTHING to do with there own boxing fate. You make the competition so much more INEPT than they actually are so it can strengthen your views. In no way are the BROTHER'S performing against 6ft 5 white centers like Wilt Chamberlain CLEARLY did to inflate his worth but let's keep pretendin there comp is actually that bad to further the agenda. When i proved Vitali has faced the same EXACT 82% OPPOSITION winning % Lennox Lewis has for there entire careers.. i was laughed at... Ok.. LET'S SAY THERE's 4 or 5 more boxing household names on Lewis's resume... How much different can the overall comp of 44 fighters LL faced compared to 45 fighters Vitali has faced?

Can you REALLY state it's highschool comp vs prfessional comp? Is THAT even being remotely logical... It's the blatant downgrading of the competition that is at the heart of all the haters views. It's unrealistic.. it's opinionated beyond being rational & it's completely illogical.. Same heavyweight division & same rank system... let's just admit that & then go from there... lack of opposition is in the eye of the beholder focusing on it.

I did not say disregard competition to upgrade there worth.. i meant the brothers are superior despite what there opposition has brought to the table.. let's stop blatantly dongrading there overall opposition & we'll be onto something a little more realistic.

[jimmy1569]

That's true about Douglas. I'm convinced to this day that his mindset going into that Tyson fight with the death of his mom and his wife having cancer, nobody would've lived with him on that night.

He fought like he was possessed. Surviving that knock down that not many others would've survived the count and brutally finishing tyson leaving him wading arounnd the canvas looking for his shield.

He literally went into that fight not giving an ounce of ****.

For once.... a post that is keeping it real!

Without all that outside trauma.. i believe Douglas would NOT have had the same mental fortitude & would have gone into that fight in fear just like all the previous Tyson opposition. There was ABSOLUTELY no blueprint to overcoming the jitters & beating Tyson... so there was nothing for Buster to go on.

He went straight to the Lion's den... went toe to toe with Mike from the outset & his thinking was I DON'T GIVE A **** about tYSON'S invincible aura...he'd already went through something that is much more traumatizing by losing his moms.. NOTHING Mike could do to him that hasn't already been done before in terms of suppressing pain. He had to have that mental edge that night to do what he did.. one bout later vs Holyfield & none of that was evident in how he fought & how he prepared.

[JAB5239]

Are you listening to yourself... son? You even state the brother's comp is not much different than any of the pat greats opposition except for a few names here & there.. I've always stated that 80% of any past alltime greats competition is similar to what the brother's have faced throughout there careers. We are penalizing the bros for 3 or 4 names they didn't face that other greats faced through no fault of there own.

You even state they'd be top fighters in any era. You're NOT making a guesstimation here as you claim. You have 104 Klitschko fights to choose from as evidence. Head to head.. both brothers even by hater standards are top 10 heavies. Head to head is not a guesstimation... it's an estimation based on how they've performed & the skillset they've shown for 104 fights..


You haters EVEN admit how great they are but dismiss it regardless & DISS there competition & therefore the brothers get dissed as the result of this.... It's a form of hypocritical behavior that is disguised as guile.. despite it's downright being in denial of how great the brother's are at boxing.. You're all denying them there just due.

Are you listening to yourself? You want to rank them over fighters who have actually proven themselves when thrown into the fire. Spin it any way you want, but when V was thrown into the fire he quit and was stopped. You want us to believe he would unquestionably do better against other great but its not provable. If we elevate fighters based on supposition we might as well declare Lamar Clark an all time great for destroying second rate comp but losing when he stepped up against Ali. So why is it no one does that but we should declare your hero the greatest ever based on the same supposition?

[jimmy1569]

Are you listening to yourself? You want to rank them over fighters who have actually proven themselves when thrown into the fire. Spin it any way you want, but when V was thrown into the fire he quit and was stopped. You want us to believe he would unquestionably do better against other great but its not provable. If we elevate fighters based on supposition we might as well declare Lamar Clark an all time great for destroying second rate comp but losing when he stepped up against Ali. So why is it no one does that but we should declare your hero the greatest ever based on the same supposition?

Because MY EFFIN' hero is a PEER of Ali.. HE'S NO freakin'' Lame Clark.. How about a 3 time champion like Ali for starters.. how about a 13- 2 record in championship bouts... where is that so inferior? You want to focus on twoi abberation losses but NOT focus on EVERY alltime great not named Marciano who has MORE than 2 blemishes on THERE records & they call me delusional.

We're elevating Klitschko BECAUSE he's fokoing elevated already through his work in a boxing ring. He hasn't amassed his numbers in some minor league farm system. I'm SORRY but a fighter who's AMASSED the best numbers bar none in heavyweight history gets the benefit of the doubt EACH & every time. You can CRy WEAK opposition til the cows come home. Vitali Klitschko is the ONLY ranked heavyweight besides Marciano who has never been either outboxed or defeated through 45 bouts.



The fact that he has EVERY conceivable physical advantage against most any other heavyweight that's ever fought ONLY solidifies that stance & in no way diminishes it. It all makes sense.. yet all of you's don't want to put two & two together because you're scared of being wrong about your judgment... trust me when I TELL you that I KNOW i'm a 1000% correct in my views & my assessment of Vitali Klitschko & i laugh at each and every one of all your excuses to dismiss how great he really is including rehashing two fights where he WON 12 OF 15 rds BUT lost. 12 FREAKIN rds LOST in 45 FIGHTS & YOU WANT to tell me that this is opposition weakness? ThAT's absurd how dominant that is..



WE'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THAT IN THE HISTORY OF BOXING & YOU GUYS ALL want to tell me it doesn't COUNT in the standings. Highest STOPPAGE & SCOReCARD rate IN THE ENTIRE HISTORY OF HEAVYWEIGHT boxing & you want to tell me HIS comp is rigged.. Why is his COMP rigged But every other alltime greats isn't? i'LL tell you why.. IT'S because we don't want to hear the truth so we make up a bunch of white lies to make us believe Vitali Klitschko is just a fabrication & a myth. I'd take Vitali Klitschko to win a boxing match OVER any other boxer who's ever lived & not bat an eyelash... That's how confident i am in his boxing abilities