Andre Ward vs Sergio Martinez

[chiguy91]

Thats what some consider, not me. I make a distinction between best in a division, and actual p4p. P4p is a significant, meaningful phrase, and isnt a word loosely thrown out there. Fighting somebody your own size is just a fair fight. Holding your own against people that are bigger than you is whats significant to me. Sure, one should be able to beat guys their own size, and if they cant then they are just ****ty(ier) fighters. But moving up and murking people is what brings special significance to your size, thus being p4p.

then why say this?

This has less to do with pac, and more to do with sergio. And a p4p ranking hasnt meant **** to me for a while, thus answering your since when question.

This has less to do with pac, and more to do with sergio. And a p4p ranking hasnt meant **** to me for a while, thus answering your since when question.

so because martinez is a good fighter right now he shouldn't face pac, even though him and margarito are the same size when considering fight night weight and being able to do the 150 lb catchweight?

Fighting somebody your own size is just a fair fight. Holding your own against people that are bigger than you is whats significant to me. Sure, one should be able to beat guys their own size, and if they cant then they are just ****ty(ier) fighters. But moving up and murking people is what brings special significance to your size, thus being p4p.

you think pac's murked bigger people? someone needs to see that pic that shows his fight night weight against opponents to show you that he's been pretty much close to the same size as his opponents for a while (excluding margarito). even then, dude challenged a 38 year old lightweight to a WW fight and got outbox. he's truly significant.

[Light_Speed]

Thats what some consider, not me. I make a distinction between best in a division, and actual p4p. P4p is a significant, meaningful phrase, and isnt a word loosely thrown out there. Fighting somebody your own size is just a fair fight. Holding your own against people that are bigger than you is whats significant to me. Sure, one should be able to beat guys their own size, and if they cant then they are just ****ty(ier) fighters. But moving up and murking people is what brings special significance to your size, thus being p4p.

even if manny lost to floyd, i would still probably consider him p4p better than mayweather.

Say what? If it's a close fight and Floyd uses his size to pull off a win then you'd have a point but if Pac gets outboxed silly then Floyd is just the better fighter. He's only slightly bigger than Pac and Pac has destroyed bigger guys.

[Rhyme 4 Rhyme]

Depends who the ref is. If Ward's allowed to fight the way he has recently, then he'll outpoint him pretty easily.

[~AK49~]

then why say this?


so because martinez is a good fighter right now he shouldn't face pac, even though him and margarito are the same size when considering fight night weight and being able to do the 150 lb catchweight?

That was referring to how most peoples p4p list is just a word thrown out there, while i keep special significance to the word. Im not saying there is anything wrong with pac facing sergio, pac is a p4p fighter. Im saying transfer that concept to sergio vs andre, if sergio is any sort of p4p (to me) he should be able to hold his own. Hes a great fighter, no doubt, but he hasnt really proved too much to me in the p4p department.

[Blue Heffner]

Chad Dawson is the biggest threat to Andre Ward.

A huge threat.

[~AK49~]

Say what? If it's a close fight and Floyd uses his size to pull off a win then you'd have a point but if Pac gets outboxed silly then Floyd is just the better fighter. He's only slightly bigger than Pac and Pac has destroyed bigger guys.

I just thought about that, but my opinion still kinda stands. I consider mayweather to be a full 147lber, more than capable of moving up to 154 and competing. I dont consider manny to be a full 147, but more like a 142-144lber. If the fights at 150, ya hell come in at 147, but if its at 147, hell come in at about 142, what he's comfortable at.

[DeadLikeMe]

you think pac's murked bigger people? someone needs to see that pic that shows his fight night weight against opponents to show you that he's been pretty much close to the same size as his opponents for a while (excluding margarito). even then, dude challenged a 38 year old lightweight to a WW fight and got outbox. he's truly significant.

Pacquiao the "giant killer"

[IMG]http://i283.***********.com/albums/kk282/amersdlbrd/PacquiaoWeights.jpg[/IMG]

[~AK49~]

you think pac's murked bigger people? someone needs to see that pic that shows his fight night weight against opponents to show you that he's been pretty much close to the same size as his opponents for a while (excluding margarito). even then, dude challenged a 38 year old lightweight to a WW fight and got outbox. he's truly significant.

Cotto is a much bigger man, and yes he murked him. Clottey is a much bigger man, and yes, he murked him. Im not saying the catchweight b.s. isnt b.s., but pac has murked bigger men.

Now lets just quit b.s'ing and get martinez and andre to 'pretty much the same size'

[Rocky Rode]

Pacquiao the "giant killer"

[IMG]http://i283.***********.com/albums/kk282/amersdlbrd/PacquiaoWeights.jpg[/IMG]

I didn't know Pacquiao fought De La Hoya at 145 pounds. And why did De La Hoya only rehydrate 2 pounds?? Pacquiao was actually the bigger guy that night. He outweighed DLH by a pound

[chiguy91]

That was referring to how most peoples p4p list is just a word thrown out there, while i keep special significance to the word. Im not saying there is anything wrong with pac facing sergio, pac is a p4p fighter. Im saying transfer that concept to sergio vs andre, if sergio is any sort of p4p (to me) he should be able to hold his own. Hes a great fighter, no doubt, but he hasnt really proved too much to me in the p4p department.

you just said in your previous post "p4p ranking hasn't meant shit TO ME" but now "i keep special significance to the word". again, you're not making sense.
not every fighter skips around weight classes and collects belts. just because pacquiao did it doesn't mean everyone should be held to that same basis. if pacquiao has taken on the challenge of fighting a guy who weighs 165 on fight night and completely dominated him, why can't he do it again? not saying he has to, but i mean mayweather just did. both guys are p4p, even better ranked than martinez, so how can that fight be wrong?

Pacquiao the "giant killer"

[IMG]http://i283.***********.com/albums/kk282/amersdlbrd/PacquiaoWeights.jpg[/IMG]

thanks for providing bro, i'd green k if i could.

Cotto is a much bigger man, and yes he murked him. Clottey is a much bigger man, and yes, he murked him. Im not saying the catchweight b.s. isnt b.s., but pac has murked bigger men.

Now lets just quit b.s'ing and get martinez and andre to 'pretty much the same size'

wow, the two you mentioned (cotto and clottey), their fight night weights weren't shown, so i guess you can consider them "bigger" opponents. i kind of consider the same concept to donaire right now. nonito himself said he walks around at 140ish, but he obviously fights at 118 and now 122. so let's say when the time comes he moves up to featherweight or super featherweight (126-130), he necessarily won't be fighting bigger guys (most dudes in that weight class around his height). they'll probably weigh 1-5 lbs apart, i'll bet on it.
same with pac, look at his fight night weight. you can see he's a guy that walks around at 140-150. even ariza said he was 153 a week before his clottey fight.

At the moment, Ariza said Pacquiao weighs 153 pounds, six over the welterweight limit of 147.

http://www.gmanetwork.com/news/story...gainst-clottey

now with martinez/ward, what's ward's fight night weight? i can almost bet martinez doesn't weigh that much if he took a year off boxing.