Comments Thread For: Photos: Klitschko, Mormeck Go Face To Face in France

[Ravens Fan]

did you read the post?
they get long
you wouldnt be the first to skim it.


i drew the comparison to demonstrate that size alone wouldnt be much of a factor, and it would not.


check out the rest of the post. you can question my knowledge about boxing all you'd like. inquire away. check out the history section and you'll find my thoughts on carnera. ( And wladimir comparatively with other great fighters)



and the "stopped but not out cold" stuff in defense of his chin is honestly downright laughable.

if you cannot continue you are stopped.

by my count (and i could be off) he has been down nine times in his career.
nine times. do you seriously think the criticism of his chin is not deserved?
even he and his trainer have admitted that his chin is not good. hell, just look at the way he fights compared to early in his career.


if 6'2 77" reach lamon brewster can do it i dont see any reason why 6'2 76" reach louis cant



opinions and subjectivity are a part of boxing, and everybody is entitled to them certainly
and i shouldnt be running people down about them

if you read my posts you'd see praise of wladimir's abilities, and me acknowledging not only his greatness but his favorability head to head against other great HW
my assessment of the fight comes from an evaluation of the styles

it has nothing to do with the calendar year
for instance, i would pick wladimir to beat langford, johnson, and probably even marciano, though that one could get messy with rocky's style and 15 round endurance

again, i'll reiterate, i can be found all over the history section defending wladimir klitschko



joe louis was a brutal offensive fighter and wladimir klitschko doesn't have a sterling chin.
i'd pick him to knock wladimir out. and if you talk with learned boxing people (contrary to popular opinion most of the NSB posters do not fit that bill,) you'll find far more who agree with me than agree with you, and it has nothing to do with the calendar year

and with learned boxing people it shouldn't

I don't know how I skimmed over anything because all you said in reference to Carnera was the following, "too big? louis did fight one outright bigger man named primo carnera. he certainly wasnt a boxer on wladimir's level, but he had longer arms and was physically as strong." And as you stated Primo was not on the same level as Wlad but you make it sound as if he really wasn't that far behind. When in reality Primo was one of the worst heavyweight champs in history who's record is so clouded by corruption that it is hard to tell what fights were on the level and when the fix was in. So, there is no comparing Wlad and Primo because they are not even in the same universe when comparing anything about their respective boxing skills or careers. So, I have to ask what other fighter did Louis fight that was as tall and weighed as much and could fire off a jab such as Wlad? The answer would be no one. So, you really have no idea if such a height and weight difference combined with great skills would make a difference.

That is why I believe fantasy fights are silly and I will say it again. The only problem I had with your initial statement was that you said it was a disgrace that someone thought Wlad could beat Louis. Than in the next sentence say why Joe could easily handle Wlad. I personally don't find your statement disgraceful I just don't necessarily agree with it. And sure the fight could have gone either way and Louis could have knocked out the Wlad who fought Brewster. But, I believe that a Wlad who learned to use his height with his jab would have easily handled a much smaller Joe Louis. And I may be wrong but a in his prime Joe Louis looks to have been more so in the 200 pound range. The last thing I am going to touch on is of course Wlad's supposed glass chin.

I just have to ask a question. Tyson was stopped five times and Lewis was knocked cold twice. Do those two have a reputation of having a soft chin? I also find it hard to believe that someone like yourself, who professes to know so much about boxing, doesn't seem to know the difference between an out cold KO and someone in Wlad's corner stepping into the ring to stop the action. And if you really don't know the difference that is whats really laughable.

[BoZz]

wtf how did he get a shot at a klitschko?

[New England]

I don't know how I skimmed over anything because all you said in reference to Carnera was the following, "too big? louis did fight one outright bigger man named primo carnera. he certainly wasnt a boxer on wladimir's level, but he had longer arms and was physically as strong." And as you stated Primo was not on the same level as Wlad but you make it sound as if he really wasn't that far behind. When in reality Primo was one of the worst heavyweight champs in history who's record is so clouded by corruption that it is hard to tell what fights were on the level and when the fix was in. So, there is no comparing Wlad and Primo because they are not even in the same universe when comparing anything about their respective boxing skills or careers. So, I have to ask what other fighter did Louis fight that was as tall and weighed as much and could fire off a jab such as Wlad? The answer would be no one. So, you really have no idea if such a height and weight difference combined with great skills would make a difference.

That is why I believe fantasy fights are silly and I will say it again. The only problem I had with your initial statement was that you said it was a disgrace that someone thought Wlad could beat Louis. Than in the next sentence say why Joe could easily handle Wlad. I personally don't find your statement disgraceful I just don't necessarily agree with it. And sure the fight could have gone either way and Louis could have knocked out the Wlad who fought Brewster. But, I believe that a Wlad who learned to use his height with his jab would have easily handled a much smaller Joe Louis. And I may be wrong but a in his prime Joe Louis looks to have been more so in the 200 pound range. The last thing I am going to touch on is of course Wlad's supposed glass chin.

I just have to ask a question. Tyson was stopped five times and Lewis was knocked cold twice. Do those two have a reputation of having a soft chin? I also find it hard to believe that someone like yourself, who professes to know so much about boxing, doesn't seem to know the difference between an out cold KO and someone in Wlad's corner stepping into the ring to stop the action. And if you really don't know the difference that is whats really laughable.

"obviously not a boxer on wladimir's level."
bigger and physically as strong.
true statements.

on to the bold
you can go through both of their fights and find them taking bombs. good chins.

you cant say the same about wladimir.


you really think wladimir has a good chin, huh?
go right ahead.



if you cant pull anything from a fighters history and film and figure his chances in a fight with another historic fighter, or form an idea of what the fight would look like, that's your issue.
get deep into boxing and you'll need to be able to do it to evaluate people historically.

i've been reading books about boxing since i was in grade school. i dont see any problem with a "fantasy fight" when i actually know what i'm talking about.
neither do almost any of the other posters around here who discuss boxing history

you can do it in prospective contemporary fights as well
it's called ********. not sure if you know this but people forecast and bet on fights.


if you actually read the posts, again, you'd see the argument about the total package wladimir brings addressed. he's a very big boxer who knows how to fight tall at a pace he can sustain.


the jab with nothing behind it (which, like it or not, is the basis of wladimir's game) wouldnt win rounds against louis

it would probably get him knocked out

louis, whether you and the other nsbers have even seen him or not, is usually considered among the top five punchers of all time

far less than what he brings to the table has been sufficient in rendering wladimir totally useless


oh but wait
he's NEVER BEEN OUT COLD

in that case he wins

[Ravens Fan]

"obviously not a boxer on wladimir's level."
bigger and physically as strong.
true statements.

on to the bold
you can go through both of their fights and find them taking bombs. good chins.

you cant say the same about wladimir.


you really think wladimir has a good chin, huh?
go right ahead.



if you cant pull anything from a fighters history and film and figure his chances in a fight with another historic fighter, or form an idea of what the fight would look like, that's your issue.
get deep into boxing and you'll need to be able to do it to evaluate people historically.

i've been reading books about boxing since i was in grade school. i dont see any problem with a "fantasy fight" when i actually know what i'm talking about.
neither do almost any of the other posters around here who discuss boxing history


if you actually read the posts, again, you'd see the argument about the total package wladimir brings addressed. he's a very big boxer who knows how to fight tall at a pace he can sustain.


the jab with nothing behind it (which, like it or not, is the basis of wladimir's game) wouldnt win rounds against louis

it would probably get him knocked out

louis, whether you and the other nsbers have even seen him or not, is usually considered among the top five punchers of all time

far less than what he brings to the table has been sufficient in rendering wladimir totally useless


oh but wait
he's NEVER BEEN OUT COLD

in that case he wins

I might be offended by being called a "nsbers," that is if I knew what it meant. But, onto other things.

I will start by asking how is it possible that you know that Primo Carnera was as strong as Wlad? I know that he weighed more but for all we know it may have been an extra twenty pounds of fat. And Primo's record does not indicate that he was any stronger. And yes he did have some knock outs but so many of his fights were set up for him to win by his mobster buddies that again no one knows how many were on the level so there really is a big question mark when it comes to Primo's entire career. And that is not even taking into account his very short championship reign.

I realize I may have taken the long way around trying to explain myself. But my point was that your statement that Primo and Wlad were not on the same level was an understatement and picking Primo to compare to Wlad was a horrible example. Simply because other than their respective size they had absolutely nothing, zilch, zero in common when it comes to their careers.

As far as Tyson's career, which, I followed closely. You may have to refresh my memory because before Douglas knocked him out I don't remember him taking much, if any punishment from any of his opponents. And after the Douglas fight Tyson fought twenty times. In those twenty fights he was stopped an additional four times and had one disqualification and two no contest. That leaves thirteen fights for a total of thirty nine rounds, or an average of just over three rounds per fight. And other than Botha landing some bombs on him and the fights that he was actually stopped in I really don't remember him taking much punishment at all. As far as Lewis career is concerned. I will have to be honest and say that I never really followed his career that closely so I will leave that alone.

And just to make it clear I am not really questioning whether Tyson has a soft chin. I only used him as an example because he has had about as many fights as Wlad and was actually KOed three times and TKOed twice by some fighters that were considered less than big punchers. Yet, no one really ever says he has a weak chin. Yet, Wlad gets gassed after dominating ever round of two fights and than gets TKOed and he earns the reputation of having a weak chin. Just doesn't make much sense to me.

And as far as Wlad taking bombs. Purity clocked him very early in their fight. I believe it may have even been the first round and Wlad still dominated all the way until his corner man stepped into the ring in the 11th round. He also had his hands full with Brock, who had a little pop. Until Wlad figured him out and stopped him. Haye also caught Wlad with a thunderous clean shot and to all the naysayers disappointment Wlad stood up to it and dominated.

As far as dealing with my "issue" with fantasy fights as you called it, I will give you my opinion. Unlike you who seems a bit obsessive, I pay little to no attention to fantasy fights. So if anything it really would be more so a non-issue on my part, and I will even tell you why. Way to may variables from size to rule changes to nutrition to training. And honestly it just doesn't do anything for me because it is just opinions and conjecture and nothing that can or will ever be proven. And I am a big believer in a great big man always beats a great little man and therefore advantage to most modern fighters.

Now, I want to ask you a question about the following statement that you made, "the jab with nothing behind it (which, like it or not, is the basis of wladimir's game) wouldnt win rounds against louis." Now with all the boxing books you have read and with all the statements you have made you seem to think of your self as a boxing historian, is that an accurate assumption on my part? If it is true and you claim to know so much how is your statement anyway near to being true when the the basic facts of Wlad's record say other wise? Wlad has forty nine stoppage within fifty six wins and has one of the highest KO% in heavyweight history. Wlad has also stopped fifteen of his nineteen opponents in title fights. I may not be as knowledgeable as you claim to be on boxing history by how the hell do you think Wlad pulled all that off by just throwing a jab with nothing behind it?

With that being said don't get me wrong because I know at times Wlad can be a very safety first fighter and he at sometimes frustrates the hell out of me as a fan. And I may even more so agree with if Wlad had twenty three knock outs with some being the fluke variety. But, that is not the case and his record simply speaks for itself. And even though I realize Wlad has one of the best impaling jabs in the history of the division I know for a fact that he did not knock out forty nine men with just his jab, and I may be wrong but I also believe you realize that.

In closing if you want to see a weak chin or glass head, see Roy Jones. I believe that no one realized jut how weak his chin was until Roy slowed down and got caught a few times. And as far as Wlad's chin is concerned if Chambers was out there tagging and hurting Wlad I would say it is true. However, it hasn't happened and my argument just boils down to the fact that I believe Wlad's supposed glass chin has been overrated and blown way out of proportion and I believe the true facts back that up.

[Paclan]

Klitschko fights another tomato can half his size

exciting.

[Xyei]

Can't believe I'm about to type this. I'd rather Wlad fought Holyfield than Mormeck. That's how bad this fight is.

I'm with you on that. This is an utter joke of a fight.