No Way Sturm Vs Macklin Was A Roberry!

[S.G.]

obviously the guard deflects some of the damage, but in reality that doesnt mean the punch doesnt hurt or do damage. its pretty clear youve never boxed before, otherwise youd know that.

not to mention Macklin's body weight was behind a lot of those clubbing shots, and if theyre strong enough to push through the side of the guard(which incidently was situated in front of Sturm's face, a truly clean block would have had completely different hand positioning to block those kind of shots) then theyre still strong enough to do plenty of damage.

Scoring flush punches is certainly nice, but Sturm flat out didnt do it often enough. When he did do it, which he did in some rounds, I gave him the round. but more often than not his punches werent even perfectly clean either, and even then he didnt land enough of them. Damage is the name of the game, and an accumulation of blows very often is more effective than one flashy looking punch, particularly one that didnt have full weight behind it, which often was the case with Sturm's shots.

claiming that this was a case of a guy only winning on volume is ludicrous. Mackin did more damage with his multitude of punches. look at the visual damage on Sturms left side and face, and his physical reactions when hit with punches. look at how exhausted he got even with a low workrate, due to Macklin's attack on his body.

not all blocks are equal. a true clean block is supposed to diffuse the punch completely, and deflect the punch at the point of impact. Sturm's blocking very often didnt do that, and the punch would just graze his guard and still land.

I dispute that Macklin inflicted more damage on Sturm than vice versa. Sturm may have superficially looked like he was being hurt with those nicks and marks, but the actual action and impetus of the fight suggests otherwise. Macklin was the one who faded. Macklin was the one who was visibly shaken at least once. Macklin was the one who looked like he wouldn't have lasted another round. You say Sturm was exhausted, but Macklin was doubly so.

He occasionally strong-armed Sturm around the ring, but Sturm never looked particularly uncomfortable or distressed for any notable period of time. And we don't judge fights according to demeanor anyway; otherwise we might as well crown Marcos Maidana P4P champion and Supreme Ruler of Boxing right now and call the whole thing off.

[starjammer]

I found it really hard to score. I had it a draw.

[Steak]

I dispute that Macklin inflicted more damage on Sturm than vice versa. Sturm may have superficially looked like he was being hurt with those nicks and marks, but the actual action and impetus of the fight suggests otherwise. Macklin was the one who faded. Macklin was the one who was visibly shaken at least once. Macklin was the one who looked like he wouldn't have lasted another round. You say Sturm was exhausted, but Macklin was doubly so.

He occasionally strong-armed Sturm around the ring, but Sturm never looked particularly uncomfortable or distressed for any notable period of time. And we don't judge fights according to demeanor anyway; otherwise we might as well crown Marcos Maidana P4P champion and Supreme Ruler of Boxing right now and call the whole thing off.

thats just silly, Sturm was getting outpunched in a number of rounds, and continually withdrew to the ropes and had to catch his breath throughout the fight. And not through pushing, through his punch flurries that were landing.

and its NOT demeanor Im talking about, its body language, which is involuntary and completely different. when you get hurt, even a little, your body stiffens up and you invariably tense the part of your body that is bothering you. Im not acting like Sturm was constantly rocked throughout the whole fight or anything ******, but if you actually watch closely you can tell he was hurt at times, sometimes to the body and sometimes to the head.

the only time Macklin was rocked was in the last round, and possibly very briefly when he ate that one clean right hand uppercut type of punch. And Sturm clearly won those rounds in my mind. but that doesnt mean he won the whole fight.

all youre doing is looking at the last round and saying 'oh, Sturm won that one, so he was doing more damage'. thats wrong. Macklin was exhausted mostly due to his huge workrate, not Sturm's punches.

[-Antonio-]

You don't score a fight by punch stats. There's nowhere in the unified rules or whatever that say that. It's simply used as a tool to review fights.

In fact whether a punch landed or not is a matter of opinion. There is no machine, there is no sensors on the gloves.

It's clear as day Macklin landed more punches than they credited him. People want to say Sturm landed the cleaner punches. Macklin landed plenty of clean shots to the left side of Sturm's body and behind both ears. I don't need to be reassured by stats. I saw it myself. Sturm won no more than 6 rounds. To say he won 8 is wrong.

Like I said before. I bet ON Sturm. I needed him to win. After round 8 I was nervous and thought he might need a kd or KO to win.

[S.G.]

thats just silly, Sturm was getting outpunched in a number of rounds, and continually withdrew to the ropes and had to catch his breath throughout the fight. And not through pushing, through his punch flurries that were landing.

You say withdrew, I say repositioned. Those occasional readjustments are just a part of his way of fighting. He must have been hurt because he refused to brawl with a brawler? He was merely, and mostly successfully, disallowing Macklin to smother him.

and its NOT demeanor Im talking about, its body language, which is involuntary and completely different. when you get hurt, even a little, your body stiffens up and you invariably tense the part of your body that is bothering you. Im not acting like Sturm was constantly rocked throughout the whole fight or anything ******, but if you actually watch closely you can tell he was hurt at times, sometimes to the body and sometimes to the head.

I clearly lack your Mehrabian-like ability to detect these minute bodily distress signals, because Sturm looked ready and willing to engage in the fight throughout to me-- he just wanted to do it his way rather than Macklin's.

all youre doing is looking at the last round and saying 'oh, Sturm won that one, so he was doing more damage'. thats wrong. Macklin was exhausted mostly due to his huge workrate, not Sturm's punches.

I'm not at all. I've already made reference to the whole dynamics of the fight and asserted that it snowballed in Sturm's favour. As the fight drew on Sturm's success rate steadily increased, Macklin's steadily dropped. Sturm's offense dampened Macklin's appetite to engage, along with sapping the sting out of his punches and stripping him of whatever semblance of a defense he had had at the start of the fight.

[-Antonio-]

I dispute that Macklin inflicted more damage on Sturm than vice versa. Sturm may have superficially looked like he was being hurt with those nicks and marks, but the actual action and impetus of the fight suggests otherwise. Macklin was the one who faded. Macklin was the one who was visibly shaken at least once. Macklin was the one who looked like he wouldn't have lasted another round. You say Sturm was exhausted, but Macklin was doubly so.

He occasionally strong-armed Sturm around the ring, but Sturm never looked particularly uncomfortable or distressed for any notable period of time. And we don't judge fights according to demeanor anyway; otherwise we might as well crown Marcos Maidana P4P champion and Supreme Ruler of Boxing right now and call the whole thing off.

He didn't look like he faded until the final round. Sturm looked bothered plenty of times by Macklin's flurries. Landing a few counters in between flurries doesn't win you rounds. It won Sturm some rounds not most.

[Steak]

You say withdrew, I say repositioned. Those occasional readjustments are just a part of his way of fighting. He must have been hurt because he refused to brawl with a brawler? He was merely, and mostly successfully, disallowing Macklin to smother him.

I clearly lack your Mehrabian-like ability to detect these minute bodily distress signals, because Sturm looked ready and willing to engage in the fight throughout to me-- he just wanted to do it his way rather than Macklin's.

I'm not at all. I've already made reference to the whole dynamics of the fight and asserted that it snowballed in Sturm's favour. As the fight drew on Sturm's success rate steadily increased, Macklin's steadily dropped. Sturm's offense dampened Macklin's appetite to engage, along with sapping the sting out of his punches and stripping him of whatever semblance of a defense he had had at the start of the fight.

what fight were you even watching? Sturm wasnt fighting his fight at all, he was forced into exchanges at closer range constantly and barely threw punches. and he wasnt able to stop Macklin at all from getting off his shots.

and I guess you clearly do lack any ability to recongnise when a punch is bothering an opponent if you cant see Sturm stiffen up after a particularly good head flurry and body attack. body language is a big indicator of how punches effect an opponent.

and Sturm's attack only increased once Macklin stopped atacking...aka Macklin got tired from throwing so many punches. good job from Strum for fighting it out in the last rounds when Macklin was tired, but those are only a few rounds, Sturm was just getting hit too often to win most the others.

if you call falling back to the ropes after a number of head shots land 'repositioning', then you have an odd idea of how boxing works. especially because Macklin would seize that opportunity to attack him on the ropes as well, so there was no benefit for Sturm for that action.

Im done here, youre pretty much watching a fight that didnt happen.
quote]You don't score a fight by punch stats. There's nowhere in the unified rules or whatever that say that. It's simply used as a tool to review fights.

In fact whether a punch landed or not is a matter of opinion. There is no machine, there is no sensors on the gloves.

It's clear as day Macklin landed more punches than they credited him. People want to say Sturm landed the cleaner punches. Macklin landed plenty of clean shots to the left side of Sturm's body and behind both ears. I don't need to be reassured by stats. I saw it myself. Sturm won no more than 6 rounds. To say he won 8 is wrong.

Like I said before. I bet ON Sturm. I needed him to win. After round 8 I was nervous and thought he might need a kd or KO to win. [/quote]bingo.