Comments Thread For: David Haye: I'm Expecting Wladimir To Fight, Not Vitali

[Dirk Diggler UK]

Yes he is you idiot, tell me who the lineal champ is so its not my fault you can't understand simple English or should I say "He cant get seem to understand that".

The lineal champion is the man who beat the man. Just because there are some dud champs doesnt mean the title is meaningless. Do you want me to go through how many dud champs there have been for other belts? Didnt think so.

Berto is a paper champ like Haye. He is nowhere near being lineal champ. You are a joke mate.

[LeadUppercut]

I didn't once complain about Briggs being a world champion plus the lineal champion is literally a made up title by boxing fans so the value of the title itself is questionable. The real title most people go by is the RING title as you can't debate who holds that title.

Yes you can, The Ring is not definitive either.

[LeadUppercut]

The Ring is not definitive, and neither is the lineal title. There are many examples where the lineal champ was not the best in the division, and styles make fights.

[Dave Rado]

The Ring is not definitive, and neither is the lineal title. There are many examples where the lineal champ was not the best in the division, and styles make fights.

You are confusing being the champion with being the best. The lineal champion IS always THE world champion, and provided that there is general agreement among boxing experts about who the lineal champion is, then that IS definitive. But the lineal champion is not always the best in the division, any more than the #1 ranked tennis player at any given time is necessarily the best tennis player. At present Caroline Wozniacki is the #1 ranked woman's tennis player, but she certainly isn't the best - either Williams sister would beat her nine times out of 10. But Wozniacki is still definitively the #1 ranked tennis player. And when Briggs beat Foreman, however controversially, he was definitively THE world Heavyweight champion, even though he wasn't the best. It didn't matter in his case, because his "reign" only lasted for one fight. Same with Boldomir.

To be considered definitively the best, you not only need to win the lineal title, but to defend it against the top contenders for a reasonably long period. Which was why Haye was never definitively the best Cruiserweight, even though he was the lineal champion. But he WAS definitively THE world Cruiserweight champion. And had he fought and beaten Adamek and Cunningham before moving up, he'd have become definitively the best as well. But he didn't, so he wasn't. But he was still definitively THE champion.

[taste]

Oh thats good!!

[Bad Boy Dazza]

ha ha ha kid you are ******ed

So he is undisputed champion and has cleaned out the division even though he is too scared to face his brother.

[cklmaced]

ha ha ha kid you are ******ed

How can he be undisputed champion if he doesn't have the WBA or WBC belt? he is the No.1 HW in the world Lewis was the undisputed champ cos he held all the belts Wlad doesn't hold all the belts there is a difference between lineal and undisputed champ.

[*OG Wenger*]

Rephrase-"I'm Praying Wladimir fights and not Vitali."

[cklmaced]

You are confusing being the champion with being the best. The lineal champion IS always THE world champion, and provided that there is general agreement among boxing experts about who the lineal champion is, then that IS definitive. But the lineal champion is not always the best in the division, any more than the #1 ranked tennis player at any given time is necessarily the best tennis player. At present Caroline Wozniacki is the #1 ranked woman's tennis player, but she certainly isn't the best - either Williams sister would beat her nine times out of 10. But Wozniacki is still definitively the #1 ranked tennis player. And when Briggs beat Foreman, however controversially, he was definitively THE world Heavyweight champion, even though he wasn't the best. It didn't matter in his case, because his "reign" only lasted for one fight. Same with Boldomir.

To be considered definitively the best, you not only need to win the lineal title, but to defend it against the top contenders for a reasonably long period. Which was why Haye was never definitively the best Cruiserweight, even though he was the lineal champion. But he WAS definitively THE world Cruiserweight champion. And had he fought and beaten Adamek and Cunningham before moving up, he'd have become definitively the best as well. But he didn't, so he wasn't. But he was still definitively THE champion.

Exactly, that was pretty much the point I was trying to make even though you probably expained much better. You can be the No.1 even though everybody could think someone else is better than the person at the top. The fact that so many people have different views on how to decide the lineal title pretty much proves my point that it is hard to define.

[Dave Rado]

The fact that so many people have different views on how to decide the lineal title pretty much proves my point that it is hard to define.

Rubbish. There is no disagreement whatsoever about how to decide the lineal title. There are only two ways that someone can become the lineal champion. Either by beating the lineal champion, or, if the title is vacant, by the #1 and #2 fighting each other, or in exceptional circumstances, the #1 and #3. That's it. Anyone who has views different from that simply doesn't know what the lineal title is. That's all there is to it.

The only time there is disagreement among boxing experts about who the lineal champion is is when they disagree about the rankings when the title is vacant, as happened in the case of Mosley-Mayweather. Some experts ranked Mosley #1 and Mayweather #2 and therefore now regard Mayweather as the lineal champion; others, including The Ring, ranked Pac at #1 at that time, and therefore still regard the title as vacant.

Should Pac and Mayweatheer ever fight, the winner would be the lineal champion according to every credible boxing expert, even if he holds no alphabet belts.

And there is rarely any disagreement about who the lineal champion is. The current situation with Mayweather is an exception. And the lineal title is the ONLY title that is worth shit, at least in the context of knowing who THE world champion is.