Manny Pacquiao: Skills or smart MATCH MAKING?

[CarlosG815]

Totally agree. And he was just WAYYY out of his league against Calzaghe so in that respect, you have to give Joe his props.

Agreed. If Lacy was as good as people thought, he'd have had a better performance against Joe. But the fact is, once he stepped up his comp, he lost, even to Taylor and an old shot Jones.

[CarlosG815]

In other words, you are making things up on your claim that Pac ducked Rahim.

For one, Rahim beat Morales at LW. Second Rahim didnt give a bloated Morales a beating. He outslicked Morales.. In other words, it was a style mismatch for Morales who was fighting in a new weight.. Third, Morales was never KO'd in any of his previous fights, and Pac did it to him twice. Fourth, Morales other loss with Barrera was a FOTY with Morales showing that he still has the skills..

If you want to say Morales was shot at the 3rd fight then I agree with you. But the second fight, Morales was a little past prime and it was a good win for Pac...

I respect your opinion, but we will just have to agree to disagree. I believe Morales had a little left going into his first fight with Pacquiao, and had nothing left going into his fight with Rahim. His career should have ended with his first fight with Pacquiao, and after that fight with Pacquiao, he was not a live opponent and is unable to compete on a world class level. That is my opinion, I know it's different than yours, so we will have to disagree. I like to use what I see on film, and you like to use rankings and the fact that Morales wanted a rematch. We analyze fights differently, that's all.

[THE REED]

Where did I say you claimed him to be the "real deal?"

I said he is not the real deal, I put nothing in your mouth, those were MY words.

And you never answered my questions as to which is the best opponent he faced and what his most impressive performance was.

Please do so before you claim that Calzaghe ended his career with his pitter patter.

And I also like how you use "hindsight" to support your case, but when it goes against it you throw it out the window.

Looking at what these guys do after a certain fight says a lot about who they were in their last fight.

You say Lacy lost something to Joe, I say he never had it and what he went on to do afterwards proved that.

Because any opponent I name isn't going to be as good as Joe.

I already know your retort.

I am saying his in ring performance... his trigger, his speed, he never looked the same to me after that fight.

You can disagree all you want.

What you are saying is he was never the real deal... I am not disagreeing.

But he had more trigger, more speed, more power before that fight compared to after that fight.

The Peter Manfredo post Calzaghe, or the Mendoza fight... were absolutely pitiful performances, or the horrific Taylor performance.

He didn't look that bad against equal opposition before that fight.

I think Pemberton is better than Manfredo.. and the Sheika from 6 years ago was better as well.

Anyways, my point wasn't to get into a ****in Jeff Lacy dispute, because I dont give a **** about him.

My point was... if the fighters that Pac beat the hell out of, dont go on to do greater things in the future, doesnt take away from their capability going into the Pac fight.

[Gino Ros]

I'm leaning to the matchmaking and catchweight ****... what about you?

BOTH.

He is one of the fastest fighters of our generation. He also has a terrific engine. And very good power.

But he has been matched with guys who fit that style to a tee.

Imagine how Kelly Pavlik would look if youonly matched him against guys with poor defense or weak chins.

[straightleft]

I am praying for Pac to KO Floyd.

When Mosley landed that shot on Floyd I jumped up and about flipped my coffee table over.

I can not wait to see Floyd eat canvas.

The *****s believing Floyd can beat any boxers Pac fought without fighting them actually. Pac before he came up at welterweight...Floyd were surrounded by legit welterweights that he should fought anyway. Younger prime Mosley, Cotto, Margarito, Williams and Clottey but he cherry picked lightweight JMM and junior welterweight Hatton and fought them at welterweight. Pac by ko'ing Floyd will erase any doubt this *****s theory about smart match making idea but then most probably it doesn't matter at all. They only hate Pac more.

[Team Vitaminas]

lol yea manny cherry picked all 40+ of his opponents.

of course not! they just happen to be top rank fighters and coincidentally they where comming off a bad loss.

[CarlosG815]

Because any opponent I name isn't going to be as good as Joe.

I already know your retort.

I am saying his in ring performance... his trigger, his speed, he never looked the same to me after that fight.

You can disagree all you want.

What you are saying is he was never the real deal... I am not disagreeing.

But he had more trigger, more speed, more power before that fight compared to after that fight.

The Peter Manfredo post Calzaghe, or the Mendoza fight... were absolutely pitiful performances, or the horrific Taylor performance.

He didn't look that bad against equal opposition before that fight.

I think Pemberton is better than Manfredo.. and the Sheika from 6 years ago was better as well.

Anyways, my point wasn't to get into a ****in Jeff Lacy dispute, because I dont give a **** about him.

My point was... if the fighters that Pac beat the hell out of, dont go on to do greater things in the future, doesnt take away from their capability going into the Pac fight.

I can not think of an opponent Pacquiao has faced that look impressive in performances leading up to their fight with Pacquiao. Marquez is the last guy I can think of who looked good going into his fight with Manny.

Do you agree or disagree? If you disagree, who looked good to you before going in with Manny?

[fugu]

A combination of both.

Myself, I'm more impressed with his pre-David Diaz W's than his current ones.

[Gino Ros]

A combination of both.

Myself, I'm more impressed with his pre-David Diaz W's than his current ones.

oh, agreed.

Manny's best win remains the domination of a prime-ish (although distracted) Barrera the first time.

[THE REED]

I can not think of an opponent Pacquiao has faced that look impressive in performances leading up to their fight with Pacquiao. Marquez is the last guy I can think of who looked good going into his fight with Manny.

Do you agree or disagree? If you disagree, who looked good to you before going in with Manny?

Yeah man I agree..

Hatton didn't quite look the same, but he didn't look terrible in the Paulie fight...

But Paulies style and his speed was going to give Hatton trouble, I knew that going into the fight... but he still got the TKO there... So he went into the Pac fight coming off a TKO...

Cotto, coming off that Clottey fight.. definitely didn't look great... I also think that was Clotteys best performance to date.

I also think the cut that Cotto had in that fight made it look a lot worse than it actually was... but.. it still wasnt good..

Either way, I go back to my original post in this thread.

None of these guys were bums... and if Pac didn't have skills, he would not of been able to overcome the size difference... he would of lost to these guys.

But I do not defend the matchmaking going on in-house at TR.. I am not ignorant to it, and I won't defend it.

This is why I want a Berto match up.

Because even though he leaves something to be desired... he is a young, prime undefeated title holder, who actually is coming off an impressive performace.

Performance moreso than win.. because he hasnt beaten anyone either.