If Tony beats Pac, will it damage his standing a top 5 ATG?

[£-4-£]

This thread is a joke. Pac is not in the top-5 ATG, he is not greater than SRR, JCC, Willie Pep, Henry Armstrong, Ali, Archie Moore.

I'd rank Pacman somewhere between 8-10, beating Margarito would not break him into the top5 ATG imo, the only way he can break in to it is by beating Mayweather.

I rank Mayweather in the top-15 ATG amongst the likes of SRL, Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Joe Louis, Roy Jones Jnr.

I think that if Mayweather and Pacman fight, the winner takes his place in the top 3 ATG.

[HaglerSteelChin]

Here is the absurdity and ignorance of the argument that people say this guy of today would murder a guy from that era. Rod Laver or Roy Emerson were tennis greats, yet a top 50 player today with modern conditioning, trainning, and size likely would beat them. Athletes get faster, bigger, and stronger. You need to compare what guys accomplish in their eras.

You look at music. Eddie Van Halen was like a god in 1978 for what he did, he help influence the shape for guitar playing, years later guys were running circles around his tapping techinique, does that take away what he accomplished?

Look at how music evolved from Barque, Classical, and ROmantic eras. Handel's Opera,s Mozart Opera, and than Wagner. Wagner makes the formers sound like a joke in comparison, does that take away from what they achieved and accomplished. Beethoven advanced the symphony from what Haydn did, does that take away from haydn?

Just on the defensive side look at how these guys shaped defensive boxing
Daniel Mendoza(bare knuckle era)-Corbett-Tunney-Pep-Locche-Benitez-Whitaker-Mayweather. In many ways, Mayweather is more advanced than the older fighters, still cant take away from what the past guys did.

[Ragnar Lothbrok]

Lets put this in perspective while we're at it.

George Mikan was a "great" player back when the game was played in Chuck Taylors between a bunch of white guys.

But I guarantee you he would be a bench warmer in todays NBA. Even someone like Chris Kaman would abuse Mikan.


Garry Hreb=Mikan

Antonio Margarito=Shaq

george mikan was a beast....

until the nba instituted a shot clock. it basically made mikan obsolete overnight because he couldnt keep up with the faster pace. Much like most athletes from the 40s 50s & 60s when up against modern fighters & athletes.

babe ruth's fat asss couldnt make it pass triple a if his fat ass played in todays age.

Old fighters are over rated. Have you seen greb fight? Not saying Pacquiao is the greatest of all times, just that old (especially really old) fighters are way over rated. The guys of modern times could hang with anyone.

Uhh... heres an "impressive" sample.

the golden age of boxing = the most fraudulent age in boxing.

Mob controlled the outcomes of fights by frankie carbo, black fighters not given title shots, black fighters robbed on a daily basis, referees being in charge of refereeing & SCORING THE FIGHT (how ridiculous).

The only reason why old school fighters are made out to unbeatable gods, is because the people WHO THINK THEY DECIDE WHO RANKS WHERE are all OLD PEOPLE thus they want to PRESERVE THEIR HISTORY. They want THEIR HEROES & BOXERS to stay on top so they marginalize any modern fighter coming up in the all time rankings.

Its all about PRESERVING THEIR HISTORY.

To rank a boxer like greb who has NO VIDEO FIGHT FOOTAGE, well that highly reeks of ignorance, ******ity, & dishonesty.

[Bastian Loc]

Bert Sugar and Brian Kenny said he's top 20 not top 5 stop with the BS.

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4656584
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4656560

Those guys are both old. Old guys always overrate their era's cuz' that's when they grew up.

This thread is a joke. Pac is not in the top-5 ATG, he is not greater than SRR, JCC, Willie Pep, Henry Armstrong, Ali, Archie Moore.

I'd rank Pacman somewhere between 8-10, beating Margarito would not break him into the top5 ATG imo, the only way he can break in to it is by beating Mayweather.

I rank Mayweather in the top-15 ATG amongst the likes of SRL, Hagler, Hearns, Duran, Joe Louis, Roy Jones Jnr.

I think that if Mayweather and Pacman fight, the winner takes his place in the top 3 ATG.

Another hotshot.

JCC couldn't even beat that sissy era DelaHoya.

Here is the absurdity and ignorance of the argument that people say this guy of today would murder a guy from that era. Rod Laver or Roy Emerson were tennis greats, yet a top 50 player today with modern conditioning, trainning, and size likely would beat them. Athletes get faster, bigger, and stronger. You need to compare what guys accomplish in their eras.

You look at music. Eddie Van Halen was like a god in 1978 for what he did, he help influence the shape for guitar playing, years later guys were running circles around his tapping techinique, does that take away what he accomplished?

Look at how music evolved from Barque, Classical, and ROmantic eras. Handel's Opera,s Mozart Opera, and than Wagner. Wagner makes the formers sound like a joke in comparison, does that take away from what they achieved and accomplished. Beethoven advanced the symphony from what Haydn did, does that take away from haydn?

Just on the defensive side look at how these guys shaped defensive boxing
Daniel Mendoza(bare knuckle era)-Corbett-Tunney-Pep-Locche-Benitez-Whitaker-Mayweather. In many ways, Mayweather is more advanced than the older fighters, still cant take away from what the past guys did.

You're talking about musicians. That doesn't take muscle.

[Bastian Loc]

How many ppv's did Harry Breg sell?


That's what I thought.

[£-4-£]

Here is the absurdity and ignorance of the argument that people say this guy of today would murder a guy from that era. Rod Laver or Roy Emerson were tennis greats, yet a top 50 player today with modern conditioning, trainning, and size likely would beat them. Athletes get faster, bigger, and stronger. You need to compare what guys accomplish in their eras.

You look at music. Eddie Van Halen was like a god in 1978 for what he did, he help influence the shape for guitar playing, years later guys were running circles around his tapping techinique, does that take away what he accomplished?

Look at how music evolved from Barque, Classical, and ROmantic eras. Handel's Opera,s Mozart Opera, and than Wagner. Wagner makes the formers sound like a joke in comparison, does that take away from what they achieved and accomplished. Beethoven advanced the symphony from what Haydn did, does that take away from haydn?

Just on the defensive side look at how these guys shaped defensive boxing
Daniel Mendoza(bare knuckle era)-Corbett-Tunney-Pep-Locche-Benitez-Whitaker-Mayweather. In many ways, Mayweather is more advanced than the older fighters, still cant take away from what the past guys did.

Repped, good post

[HaglerSteelChin]

You're talking about musicians. That doesn't take muscle.

I talked about how defensive boxing has changed and evolved. Music is a science and boxing is often called the "sweet science."

Modern fighters due to advances in technology and conditioning tend to be bigger and stronger. Most importantly, they have learned and advances from what others have left behind. To look at a fighter who fought 80 years ago and laugh shows ******ity in the classic sense. Are cars the same as they were 80 years ago? Do you think 80 years in the evolution of the "sweet science" impact the way fighters fight?

[Bastian Loc]

I talked about how defensive boxing has changed and evolved. Music is a science and boxing is often called the "sweet science."

Modern fighters due to advances in technology and conditioning tend to be bigger and stronger. Most importantly, they have learned and advances from what others have left behind. To look at a fighter who fought 80 years ago and laugh shows ******ity in the classic sense. Are cars the same as they were 80 years ago? Do you think 80 years in the evolution of the "sweet science" impact the way fighters fight?

I'm not laughing at him personally, I laugh at those that overrate them because they're basically just speculating about mythology.

Harry Breg is the Keyzer Soze of boxing. Anytime someone brings up present fighters, some joker pops in and says his name to try and scare you with it.

[led]

Harry Greb probably lost at least 10 times, probably had no facebook, twitter, youtube and I guarantee you he had no trash talking skills.

lol@ Garry Hreb.

lmao **** u!

[Pudgemeister]

Here is the absurdity and ignorance of the argument that people say this guy of today would murder a guy from that era. Rod Laver or Roy Emerson were tennis greats, yet a top 50 player today with modern conditioning, trainning, and size likely would beat them. Athletes get faster, bigger, and stronger. You need to compare what guys accomplish in their eras.

You look at music. Eddie Van Halen was like a god in 1978 for what he did, he help influence the shape for guitar playing, years later guys were running circles around his tapping techinique, does that take away what he accomplished?

Look at how music evolved from Barque, Classical, and ROmantic eras. Handel's Opera,s Mozart Opera, and than Wagner. Wagner makes the formers sound like a joke in comparison, does that take away from what they achieved and accomplished. Beethoven advanced the symphony from what Haydn did, does that take away from haydn?

Just on the defensive side look at how these guys shaped defensive boxing
Daniel Mendoza(bare knuckle era)-Corbett-Tunney-Pep-Locche-Benitez-Whitaker-Mayweather. In many ways, Mayweather is more advanced than the older fighters, still cant take away from what the past guys did.

You can listen to a Beethoven Symphony and then to a Wagner Opera. You can dissect the form and see how perfectly constructed a Beethoven piece is and compare it to a later musician. You can analyze each note since we have scores of the music. You KNOW that he was incredible.

The best footage you have of some old time guys is some black and white footage that looks more like two pasty white college kids sparring in their garage.