Only idiots think fighters 60 years on back would be competitive today

[TheGreatA]

What makes 60 years ago the cut off line? Did anything significant change boxing so much during that period in time that the fighters suddenly got better from that point onwards? I don't think so.

You wouldn't pick a 100m runner from the 80's to beat Usain Bolt, yet it's very hard to argue that today's line-up would beat the early 80's line-up in boxing. Obviously the "evolution" of sports hasn't affected boxing the same way as other sports, seemingly.

I have a difficult time comparing the old timers of the late 1800's and 1900's to today's fighters, with some exceptions. The 1920's and 30's were somewhat of a transitional period with fighters getting adjusted to the modern boxing rules. Less wrestling involved, more activity, techniques improving, shorter fights. By the 1940's, the art was nearly perfect as evidenced by the likes of Ezzard Charles, Archie Moore, Harold Johnson, Sugar Ray Robinson and others who fought around the era.

[Hous]

Makes you even a bigger idiot, fighters fought more frequently and there were less weight classes back then. They also fought 15 rounds, you wouldn't have all these 6'6" HW that weight 250lbs. Speed and power can't be thought either you have it or you don't. Also heart, are you also implicating that we can make somebody more resilient cause of modern times.

Training back then was different but doesn't mean that it was less effective. There a more boxers that don't have all the modern advances in training available to them and they stick with what has worked all these years. We do have evolution cause it has to start somewhere and we are also going to have great boxers in the present and the future. Like I said before it makes you the bigger idiot for posting something without making any real research.

You dont think like a research based person. How would being conditioned to fight 15 rounds be benefitial in a 12 round bout? I never said anything about anyone going back in time to fight... If being conditioned for 15 rounds would be benefitial in a 12 round bout, don't you think some of these trainers whose lively hood is um well conditioning with scientifically proven results would train the fighters for 15 rounds.

[Hous]

Exactly.

What some of the old greats achieved was incredible, and they are legitimately 'great' for what they did. But stick them in a time machine and beam them into 2010 against the current champs and 90% of them get beaten.

Change this to 100% get beaten and i would co-sign this.

[Dead Ringer]

The title of this thread is idiotic. "Only idiots would think"...smarmy bull****. Plus, to reiterate the above comment, what makes 60 the cut-off? So we can agree that Monzon or Leonard would be able to compete but Armstrong and Pep wouldn't? Dumb.

[Hous]

yea, which is why George Foreman became heavyweight champ when he was 45 20 years after his prime
or why Larry Holmes was beating top 5 opponents after having been retired and was 43
or why Holyfield(who had a hard time with both of them) should have gotten the nod when he beat a top 5 fighter today at 45 or something after being medically suspended...

When a fighter can still get big time, relevant wins years and years after their prime, I think that at least says that their era was 'on par' with the next.


people keep talking about all these huge advancements in sports science and health, but if thats the case then why is it that so many champions grew up in **** conditions and can still compete? a large volume of boxers train old-school as well.

boxing isnt nearly as a simple as 'who is the better athlete?', like in track. The mental aspects of the sport are huge.

Your off topic by about 25 years.

And those guys were reaping the benefits of the era aswell, so your double off.

[Ether]

lol so Prime 80's Hulk Hogan would lose to Randy Orton?

edit- kidding, relax.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

The only thing idiotic is this thread. One of the beautiful things about boxing that separates it from other sports is that 140lbs in 1940 is the same as in 2010.

I understand there are more weight classes today but if you take 2 fighters of similar weight, there's no doubt that the great fighters of yesteryear, would be great today.

You cannot tell me someone like Willie Pep wouldn't do well in todays game. Or someone like Joe Lewis or Rockey Marciano. Maybe not against the bigger heavy weights because those guys barely weighed 200lbs but if you put them with comparable fighters of the same weight of today, of course they would do well.

It's just like the same old argument of basketball players of the old days couldn't handle the athletes of today, because they were slow, short and weren't the same athletes.

Then you see someone like Steve Nash DOMINATE and it throws that bulls.hit out the window.


30 years from now someone will say the same thing about Mike Tyson, Julio Cesar Chavez or Pacquaio and you will see it the same way I do, just ****** uninformed young kids that don't know what the *** they are talking about.

[#1Assassin]

given their condition. Our fighters today are bigger, stronger and faster then they ever were. Why? Because they aren't goinghave into it alone now, now they have researchers (nutritionist, fitness experts) who conduct research to find the most positive results. This allows them to find the maximum balance of muscle to body frame / weight for strength and speed. They now have tapes to study and research other fighters methods in detail. Fighters back then didn't have this luxery. Science makes the difference.

Humans make fables about the past neglecting logic, its natural.

you think they didnt record fights sixty years ago and we are the idiots? gtfo you ****ing ******.

if you think there isnt any fight footage from sixty years ago all that proves is you havent watched any of the fighters back then, so how can your opinion on their ability be taken seriously?

boxing training methods havent changed as much as you people make it out to, the vast majority of fighters still train in an old school way and find great results. better nutrition and such is ofcourse an advantage for present fighters, but that can only go so far.

old school fighters make up for that in dedication, sixty years ago boxers trained year round as oposed to todays fighters who take vacations inbetween each fight. at which point they dont stick to that precious diet of theirs and eat ten times more crap then fighters back in the day.

old school fighters were more dedicated, tougher and had way stiffer competition given that there were fewer weightclasses and titles. fighters today might be faster and stronger, but old school fighters were more skilled and smarter. they perfected their craft and had it put to the test every single time they stepped in the ring, thats what boxing is all about.

look at hopkins, a modern throwback. he was never as fast or strong as the competition, especially when he got older. yet he dominated far superior athletes with his skills and boxing IQ. james toney is an even better example, he damn sure didnt have any nutritionist or fitness experts on his team but he brought an old school aproach to the game. lots of sparring in the gym and fighting very often in his prime (compare his number of fights with other modern fighters). he perfected his craft and managed to move up all the way to HW and school several world champions like peter and ruiz who held all the physical advantages over him. not to mention what he did to fighters at the lower weights.

fighters today are better physicly, not as much as you people make them out to be but better none the less. old school fighters were much smarter and more skilled, thats more important. they honed their skills by fighting often and training year round, they didnt have any promoters giving them tailor mad oponents either. thats the real luxury if you ask me.

old school fighters >>> modern fighters

[Hous]

So a 147 lb man from 60 years ago is smaller than a 147 lb man from today?
5'6-5'7 Pacquiao and Mayweather are bigger than the 6 feet tall welterweights of the past eras?
Every fighter today is faster and stronger than the fighters of the past?
There are some slow top fighters today who get by with their strength and toughness, and some fast fighters who lack the physical strength and toughness, as always has been.

I would say that 5'11 bantamweight Panama Al Brown towers over any bantamweight of today, and he's probably faster and more durable than the lot of them too. Boxing is a curious sport because it has actually been in a decline of interest for a while now, and the rules have been changed to accommodate less tough but more athletic fighters. Many fighters today can hardly go 12 rounds let alone 15. Boxers don't really have the option to fight hundreds of times in the PPV era nor are they willing to, and the opposition is carefully selected by matchmakers. I think all this makes it easier for a boxer to be successful in these times.

There are so many misconceptions and myths in this thread that it would take a long time to correct them all. I'll just settle for saying that it's better to stay silent when you obviously don't know what you're talking about.

Well, i used the word bigger to focus more on the HW division, but I see where this is going. Your still not thinking about the benefits of science.

147lb boxers today have a more efficient muscle to fat ratio which helps them become stronger, faster and more efficient with energy (stanima). So yeah 147lbs fighters are superior of those of 60 years ago. Their bodies are more efficient.

[Hous]

Boxers in the old days had better fitness than those today!

20+ round fights weren't uncommon and boxers fought a lot more frequently than they do today.

Yeah, and it makes perfect sense to assume boxers were better fit back then because there was an occasional 20 round fight 100 years ago. Get a grip. Two guys that are equally in bad shape could go 30 rounds. Use your brain.

Boxers today are more efficient. They pace themselves and their bodies are better conditioned because science has improved their workouts.

Its ridiculous t think we improve everything and everyone except for boxers.