A Cuban Discipline Crisis?

[Mikhnienko]

btw great article, wish we had more in depth discussion and analysis in here like this. I do think the writer was not impartial enough and too quick to alleviate the fighters of all responsibility for their shortcomings, using the culture differences as a scapegoat. It plays a role but personal responsibility over their own fates can't be forgotten.

[Evil Abed]

btw great article, wish we had more in depth discussion and analysis in here like this. I do think the writer was not impartial enough and too quick to alleviate the fighters of all responsibility for their shortcomings, using the culture differences as a scapegoat. It plays a role but personal responsibility over their own fates can't be forgotten.

Excellent post.

I agree.

I believe the writer knows the fighters and trainers personally so he can't help but be a little judgmental.

That's not a good excuse though.

[aldiansyah]

Interesting read, also interesting to note this young guy giving Rigondeaux problems in sparring isn't the first time it's happened apparently, I heard a lot of talk about exciting prospect Rico Ramos giving Rigondeaux all sorts of problems in sparring too, and Ramos himself said a while ago the guys problem was while being great on the outside he (Rigondeaux) just can't fight on the inside. It kind of makes sense if you think about it, despite the guys extensive amateur experience there's little call for inside fighting there, generally, and it can't be the easiest thing to pick up at his age. It surprised me how many people were ragging on the guy after he split with Roach; I felt at the time that a lot of people didn't appreciate how hard it can be to make that transition from amateur to pro fighter, and between the talk of struggling with guys on the inside, the practice at Roachs gym of putting prospects in with heavier guys, and his splitting his attention between a lot of fighters when Rigondeaux really needs someone dedicated to him to help with the transition. Add to it the guys already advancing age for a boxer with his number of pro fights, he just can't afford to waste any time or make any mistakes along the way. Obviously from the article it now sounds like there were other factors involved too though... I just hope this guy can get it together and live up to his potential for future fights.
It's a bit off topic but I can't help but feel Gamboa is getting a bit mishandled as well, his last few fights it seemed his trainer has gone a long way toward fixing some of his flaws, but watching his last fight I realized it only seemed that way because his opponents were right in front of him, or coming at him like he prefers; in his last fight he was forced to go on the offence and often left himself wide open while doing so, to the point he got fed a big right hand and was badly hurt. He did look more disciplined in some of those fights bug again in the last one he ate a lot of jabs too and given his fiery temperament I can't help but wonder how long that discipline would hold up vs a guy who has good movement and really snaps that jab at him over and over.
I can't help but feel for these guys, with everything they've gone through with living in Cuba then the defection and trying to adjust to such a different culture and lifestyle and trying to make themselves elite fighters in the process... I hope it all works out for them.
And one last thing, Murray vs Buckland was indeed a fantastic fight, do yourself a favor and track down a copy, personally I think it's definitely FOTY so far.

[Heru]

@ aldiansyah

Better than Escalante-Roman? I predicted that Murray-Buckland would be a war, my mild betting habit has me breaking down styles for a lot of different matchups, so I saw a few rounds of each of their fights and could tell that it would not turn out as easy as the odds (Murray at -1800) predicted.

My habit also has me closely analyzing weaknesses and strengths of a fighter and trying to accurately predict which will be the most prevalent for winning/losing.

I also saw the flaws of Gamboa against Barros (though his much improved defense stuck out the most) and from what I've seen of his upcoming opponent, he will be in for a harder night than people expect. Elio Rojas has the good movement and solid jab you want to see if Gamboa can hold up against. Rojas is also taller, longer, has a great sense of distance, and maintains a solid workrate throughout a fight. His change of trainers to the underrated Kevin Cunningham (Devon Alexander's and former Cory Spinks trainer), might be the necessary change to shore up Rojas' most prevalent weakness (his loss of stamina down the stretch).

Now that you mention a prospect saying that Rigondeaux can't fight on the inside, it stands out now that he always needs room and resorts to pushing back when he doesn't have it. It will be a problem in the future (if it's not fixed) because there will be fighters that will be able to take his power or maneuver their way inside and stay on the inside.

[aldiansyah]

I'm sure there will be people who disagree and it's really a matter of opinion since both are very good fights, but I do think that Murray-Buckland was the better fight of the two. I don't remember Escalante-Roman too well, but while both fights were all action I think Escalante-Roman was more competitive, and probably had less finesse on display; Murray-Buckland was fairly one sided score-wise but Buckland never lay down for a moment, and took everything Murray could give. I couldn't believe the way he kept going round after round after all those body punches... don't listen to me though, if you enjoy action packed fights and displays of courage under fire (and who doesn't?) do what you gotta do to watch the fight, you won't be disappointed. I'm hoping we see Katsidis vs Murray some time in the future, this would be a fantastic scrap too.

I haven't actually seen Rojas fight myself, but from what I hear he'll make an ideal opponent to see where Gamboa is at, it's interesting to hear you say he has some stamina issues late in a fight, I don't think I've ever seen Gamboa show signs of gassing so even if Rojas is able to control him early with the jab Yuri will probably really put it on him late, should make for an interesting fight.

Sorry to get off topic =)

[Evil Abed]

I'm sure there will be people who disagree and it's really a matter of opinion since both are very good fights, but I do think that Murray-Buckland was the better fight of the two. I don't remember Escalante-Roman too well, but while both fights were all action I think Escalante-Roman was more competitive, and probably had less finesse on display; Murray-Buckland was fairly one sided score-wise but Buckland never lay down for a moment, and took everything Murray could give. I couldn't believe the way he kept going round after work after all those body punches... don't listen to me though, if you enjoy action packed fights and displays of courage under fire (and who doesn't?) do what you gotta do to watch the fight, you won't be disappointed. I'm hoping we see Katsidis vs Murray some time in the future, this would be a fantastic scrap too.

I haven't actually seen Rojas fight myself, but from what I hear he'll make an ideal opponent to see where Gamboa is at, it's interesting to hear you say he has some stamina issues late in a fight, I don't think I've ever seen Gamboa show signs of gassing so even if Rojas is able to control him early with the jab Yuri will probably really put it on him late, should make for an interesting fight.

Sorry to get off topic =)

its kool.

You guys know your sh$t.

Good stuff.

[GoogleMe]

Rigondeaux, 2 time Olympic champion. Don't believe anything you read.

[Evil Abed]

Rigondeaux, 2 time Olympic champion. Don't believe anything you read.

What do you mean?

[Mikhnienko]

bump............

[Forza]

2 weeks and I get to go back to that south florida party scene. If you let coke and hoes get inbetween a potentially million dollar boxing pay days you're dumb though.