Ending the Myth of Castillo and Mayweather Jr.

[Roy Hobbs]

Why does everybody keep bringing up the Castillo fight when they KNOW he had a torn rotator cuff. I say he beats Duran. Then the dumbasses say "well look at what Castillo did" He had ONE ARM ******s. What did castillo do i the re-match? Get his head boxed off his shoulders.

SO STOP THAT CASTILLO-DURAN-MARGARITO COMPARISON ****.



"Repeated mantra among “experts” is that the way to beat Mayweather (who, ironically, has never been beaten) is to pressure him a la Jose Luis Castillo. It is well documented that many feel that Castillo should have won his first fight with Mayweather (though 3 judges saw it differently) and point to this as the blueprint for Mayweather’s fistic Waterloo. More importantly, Hatton’s fans point to the fact that while Mayweather went the distance with Castillo (twice), Hatton crushed him in four.

Mayweather-Castillo I has served as a flashpoint of controversy between Mayweather’s fans and those who insist that the pound-for-pound champ should have taken a loss that night. The outcry following the match prompted Floyd to call for an immediate rematch, which was another unanimous decision, by an even wider margin that before. These facts are not up for dispute.

While fans constantly point to Mayweather-Castillo I as the Rosetta Stone of a Mayweather defeat, few care to admit (or are even aware) that Mayweather fought Castillo with a torn rotator cuff that night and still managed to win a wide-margin unanimous decision.

The question that has not often been asked is this: If Castillo possessed the tools to defeat Mayweather so resoundingly as alleged, why was he not able to summon the same performance in the second match? Further, why was he beaten even more convincingly in the rematch? Indeed it may be that Castillo’s performance in the first fight was impressive precisely because Mayweather was injured and the reason that the effort he turned against a healthy Mayweather seemed nothing more than pedestrian."

Young man you are out of control with these threads. As a previous poster said earlier, a lot of fighters fight with injuries. You go through a hard training camp by the time fight night comes around you are gonna have injuries.

As for the mythical duran fight, duran is one of the greatest pressure fighters in the history of the sport. He just does not compare to castillo, corrales, or anybody in floyd's resume. Not only is duran a great pressure fighter, he is a smart/cerebral pressure fighter complemented with great athleticism feints & head movement. People say that floyd has speed, he does, but he is prone to getting caught in the ropes & relying on his shoulder roll technique & basically infighting.

Major advantage duran. Watch duran vs carlos palomino, you could see duran's incredible infighting skills & his feint jab coming with his precise, heavy straight right hand which would land against floyd whose left side is open due to his shoulder roll technique.

If ricky hatton could get to floyd in the early rounds, what is duran gonna do? 135 or 147 Duran is going to get a majority decision at the very least & possibly get a tko or ko at the most.

[SAN D13GO VILLAN]

He said "Mayweather money" not running **** head. Stay off BET.

I fixed it!

[LiLNipsFatal]

Let's be real here. I don't care if you're a Mayweather fan or not - Mayweather lost the first fight torn rotator cuff or not. After hearing about this fight for a while, I had to go back and watch it to see it for myself.

It was close, but Castillo should have won by UD. I personally had the fight 115-112 Castillo (I scored a 10-10 third, a 9-9 8th (-1 Castillo) & a 9-9 10th (-1 Mayweather). Mayweather did come back and beat Castillo decisively in the second fight, but that shouldn't take away from the first fight, which Castillo should have won.

[-Reflexes-]

Young man you are out of control with these threads. As a previous poster said earlier, a lot of fighters fight with injuries. You go through a hard training camp by the time fight night comes around you are gonna have injuries.



As for the mythical duran fight, duran is one of the greatest pressure fighters in the history of the sport. He just does not compare to castillo, corrales, or anybody in floyd's resume. Not only is duran a great pressure fighter, he is a smart/cerebral pressure fighter complemented with great athleticism feints & head movement. People say that floyd has speed, he does, but he is prone to getting caught in the ropes & relying on his shoulder roll technique & basically infighting.




Major advantage duran. Watch duran vs carlos palomino, you could see duran's incredible infighting skills & his feint jab coming with his precise, heavy straight right hand which would land against floyd whose left side is open due to his shoulder roll technique.


If ricky hatton could get to floyd in the early rounds, what is duran gonna do? 135 or 147 Duran is going to get a majority decision at the very least & possibly get a tko or ko at the most

How did Vitali look with his Torn rotator cuff? Or how about Lacy?

You forgot to mention that Floyd is one of the GREATEST defensive boxers of all time. You forgot to mention hes rarely hit flush. You also forgot to mention his smarts, reflexes, foot speed and ring generalship Oh and his accuracy . If the only thing in Floyd you see is speed you have 40 fights of his to go watch.

His left side aint open man....lololololol. He picks the punches to the left side of his face with his SHOULDER...Hence the name. The other punches he deflects with his right hand. Where did you get that Floyd is wide open?

So now Duran is a wild, hugging, wrestler. Why did you ONLY mention the EARLY rounds when he was feeling Hatton out. Why not mention the rest of the rounds when he Adjusted and gave Hatton a taste of his own medicine. He was setting traps against Hatton since the first round. He was throwing that check hook since Round 1. Then BOOM lights out.

[TheGreatA]

The thing with Duran is that just pressure is not going to beat Floyd. Floyd has proven that in EVERY fight. They all try to pressure him and end up just looking ******. Duran had good boxing skills but no where near the boxing ability of Mayweather Jr. I mean lets just be real here.

Duran was not a defensive fighter by any means but he was as skilled a pressure fighter as you'll ever see. Do you think Mayweather could take the fight to Ray Leonard and outfight him on the inside? That takes skill too because Duran certainly wasn't bigger than Leonard. It takes an extra-ordinary amount of skill to be able to fight as well as Roberto Duran or James Toney did in close.

Unlike a James Toney however, Duran was also skilled at making his opponents fight his fight. Often it's said that his opponents just brawled with him but who in their right mind would willingly brawl with Roberto Duran?

This is a 21 year old Duran against lightweight champ Ken Buchanan:



You may not think much of Buchanan after watching Duran beat him down but he was a classy all-around boxer who was made to look like nothing versus Duran:

Now against Mayweather. Duran would have to be ready to be moving for 12-15 rounds. MENTALLY he would have to come in the ring and be ready to BOX. Because Floyd UNLIKE SRL is not going toe to toe with him. Like in the first fight. SRL fought Durans fight.

I think Mayweather would soon find out that at times there would be no other choice than to go toe to toe with Duran. He did this with Castillo and even Hatton. Ernesto Marcel, Ken Buchanan, Vilomar Fernandez, Edwin Viruet, all notable movers, all were beaten down by Duran. He was not some fighter who was just going to quit if you showed him some movement and speed, only once in his career did he quit. One fight should not define a career, much like the Castillo fight should not define Mayweather's career.

He wont be in the same place more then 2 seconds. He will be moving, slipping punches, countering, clinching and more moving. Duran will be chasing and will be getting a boxing lesson. He does not have the boxing ability to out box Floyd and Floyds movement and counter punching will prevent Duran from bull rushing him. If he does try to bull rush his night will end early.

What does Mayweather have to stop Duran's rushes that Ray Leonard did not? Again, Leonard did not willingly brawl with Duran, he clearly wanted to keep the fight in the middle of the ring but could not. Duran has an all-time great chin that only failed him once against one of the hardest punchers of all time.

You're also underrating Duran's boxing ability. While he was mostly an aggressor and a pressure fighter, the man could also box. How else could he have beaten the likes of Davey Moore and Iran Barkley who were much bigger and stronger than he was?

Here's what Marvin Hagler had to say about Duran's skills:

If Hagler learned anything in the Duran fight, it was not to lie back and let the rounds pass by. Pat and Goody Petronelli, Hagler's handlers, learned a lot that night, too. "Who would have thought that Duran could outbox a Marvin Hagler?" Pat Petronelli asks. "We told Marvin, 'Lay back and counter-punch.' He's going to come at you. Duran took us to school."

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...7003/index.htm

Quotes after the fight:

"People think I'm going to go crazy in there, like against Leonard," Duran said before the fight. "But, no."

"I knew that Hagler was waiting for me to get inside to fight with him," Duran said afterward, "so he could get his punches in with force."

"I fought him at half-distance," Duran said. "I was waiting for him to unload so I could score on him. Whichever hand he unloaded, I was ready to counter. He didn't confuse me with anything. I was beating him without mixing it up too much."

Petronelli's foreboding deepened. "Duran waited and waited and waited for Marvin to lead," he said. "We had to change our tactics and go on the offensive, which isn't really Marvin's style." So at the end of the third, Petronelli told Hagler, "This ain't going too well. Put the pressure on him."

"He'd slip and counter, slide back and wait for me," Hagler said. "When you're trying for a knockout, it's the hardest thing to get. That's what I was after, but you have to let them come. He wasn't there. Duran is too crafty to go after for a knockout. You leave yourself open, and he takes advantage of it."

"I turned my head to be careful of his right because it's his most dangerous hand. His left is dead. The hand he most relied on was his right," Duran said.

"I wasn't getting my jab off the way I generally do," said Hagler, who was more effective when he switched from a lefty to a righty stance, which brought him two feet closer to Duran. "It seemed everybody was disappointed that I didn't knock him out. I felt that way myself. But he wasn't that vulnerable to a knockout. It was hard to hit him with a solid punch. I didn't catch him with a solid shot."

"I was a little scared because he was coming in straight up," Duran said. "I could reach him with any right, but actually I was scared to throw the right hand."

"He came to tear my head off," says Duran, "but when he saw that I could hit him hard, with strength, he got scared and became a coward. That's why he didn't take too many chances and mix it up with me. Everyone was saying he was a destroyer, but when he hit me, he didn't do anything to me. His punches absolutely did me no damage. He got scared every time he threw a jab because I could get my right in under it. That's why he held off so much."

"I'm not a fool either," Hagler would say, "going in to get hit. You don't barrel in there on a guy like Roberto Duran. Why take unnecessary punishment unless you have to? I'd been effective and was winning the fight, so it isn't like I had to go in there and take the punishment to bomb him out."

"The better man won," Duran said, after two judges had given Hagler the victory by one point, the other by two.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...76/1/index.htm

[-Reflexes-]

Duran was not a defensive fighter by any means but he was as skilled a pressure fighter as you'll ever see. Do you think Mayweather could take the fight to Ray Leonard and outfight him on the inside? That takes skill too because Duran certainly wasn't bigger than Leonard. It takes an extra-ordinary amount of skill to be able to fight as well as Roberto Duran or James Toney did in close.



Unlike a James Toney however, Duran was also skilled at making his opponents fight his fight. Often it's said that his opponents just brawled with him but who in their right mind would willingly brawl with Roberto Duran?



This is a 21 year old Duran against lightweight champ Ken Buchanan:



You may not think much of Buchanan after watching Duran beat him down but he was a classy all-around boxer who was made to look like nothing versus Duran:





I think Mayweather would soon find out that at times there would be no other choice than to go toe to toe with Duran. He did this with Castillo and even Hatton. Ernesto Marcel, Ken Buchanan, Vilomar Fernandez, Edwin Viruet, all notable movers, all were beaten down by Duran. He was not some fighter who was just going to quit if you showed him some movement and speed, only once in his career did he quit. One fight should not define a career, much like the Castillo fight should not define Mayweather's career.



What does Mayweather have to stop Duran's rushes that Ray Leonard did not? Again, Leonard did not willingly brawl with Duran, he clearly wanted to keep the fight in the middle of the ring but could not. Duran has an all-time great chin that only failed him once against one of the hardest punchers of all time.




You're also underrating Duran's boxing ability. While he was mostly an aggressor and a pressure fighter, the man could also box. How else could he have beaten the likes of Davey Moore and Iran Barkley who were much bigger and stronger than he was?



Here's what Marvin Hagler had to say about Duran's skills:



http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vau...76/1/index.htm

The way Mayweather would fight SRL would be different then what Duran in the first fight. Against Floyd SRL would have to be the aggressor because Floyd aint budging. I think Duran was very skilled. I just dont think he is AS skilled as Floyd Mayweather.

The thing with this is that Floyd doesnt have to engage when rushed. He simply just clinches and goes to work on the inside. Even when opponents are thisclose to him hes still hard to hit. I think his strength and inside fighting is very underrated. Oscar said he was one of the strongest fighters he ever faced. Not to mention Oscar has fought some strong dudes like Hops, Mayo, Tito, Sturm, etc.

I agree that one fight shouldnt define a career. I just feel that Mayweather is a guy that Duran would not be looking foward to fighting. Mayweather moves wayy more then SRL does. He engages less. And has better defense and reflexes. And IMO is smarter inside the ring and makes less mistakes and takes less risks in the ring.

When I watch that fight and the second one. I think its clear that Leonard tried to prove he was as tough as Duran and he wanted to stand up to him only to lose his belt in the process. In the second fight Leonard was having none of it. He danced his ass off. Sure Duran got him on the ropes a few times but Leonard was spinning off of him and getting back on his bike.

I think he was a good boxer. To be fair his power did him alot of favors against bigger dudes. Mayweathers smarts and his ability to adjust to any style is severely underrated on these boards.

[lewis lloyd]

Why is it floydbots always say well he won the 2nd fight? Who cares!!!!!!! Castillio won the 1st fight and that is all that matters. castillo has always been a inconsistant guy and doesnt have the career gayweather has but thats not a issue. the issue is castillo won the 1st fight so screww the corrupt paid off judges.

[Iceta Lives]

When I downloaded the You Tube video of that fight, and I saw Vic Draculich take a point away from Castillo, that to me just messed up Castillo's rythym and even though he tried to be fair and take a point away from Mayweather, it still could've thrown Castillo off his game and cause him to get hit with shots from Floyd that he normally wouldn't get hit with. But the judges already had it determined that they were gonna give Floyd that decision no matter what. And I thought it was funny how Merchant complained about the officiating, and it was well warranted.

[ModernTalking]

There's only one myth and that is that Floyd lost that fight. He won the second fight no doubt but he lost that one.

[-Reflexes-]

When I downloaded the You Tube video of that fight, and I saw Vic Draculich take a point away from Castillo, that to me just messed up Castillo's rythym and even though he tried to be fair and take a point away from Mayweather, it still could've thrown Castillo off his game and cause him to get hit with shots from Floyd that he normally wouldn't get hit with. But the judges already had it determined that they were gonna give Floyd that decision no matter what. And I thought it was funny how Merchant complained about the officiating, and it was well warranted.

What does that have to do with the thread?