Victor Conte talking steroids, Pacquiao and Boxing

[Xcusemymood]

Leave him alone. Seriously. He has ignored every comment that has silenced him. His trick is to regurgitate what the urine test can do while refusing to point out what it can't. He also ignores the purpose of blood testing and pretends the urine test will suffice but if you read between the lines...ehh, what am I saying? You've been reading this thread already!

Well the funny part is he posts that long ass post, and right after what he puts in bold and a larger font, it says they recommend doing blood along with urine.

It totally kills his point.

[Jose Rizal]

Look dude, your opinion is just as invalid as mine. If a Doctor said it would be useless, i have to take his/her words for what its worth. My opinion and yours are invalid.

But that's just the word of one doctor. The governing testing bodies have own quacks and experts too, and they seem to have no problem with Pac's proposal. Who is to say whose opinion among these quacks is the most valid?

If you're gonna say you'd take this non-profit quack's word, then what's the point of the tests being done by the legit organizations responsible for keeping athletes clean if their opinion and conclusions can't be relied upon? The tests Floyd would be asking for would be pointless then, because they're the one's who'd be administering and monitoring all this, not Dr. Catlin.

[Bee Keepz]

Leave him alone. Seriously. He has ignored every comment that has silenced him. His trick is to regurgitate what the urine test can do while refusing to point out what it can't. He also ignores the purpose of blood testing and pretends the urine test will suffice but if you read between the lines...ehh, what am I saying? You've been reading this thread already!

WTF, look man, arguing with you is like talking to a brick wall, because you clearly don't know what you're talking about.

[Xcusemymood]

It would, thus you have the 3 blood tests. If Pacquiao is on EPO there is a lab out there with lab results that has Pacquiao's hgb/hct levels. You can't just put someone on EPO, you have to get a baseline info on their CBC, and monitor it. EPO is dangerous specially for boxers, for one they already dehydrate and train at high altitudes increasing their hct levels, you add EPO to that you run the risk of polycythemia.

Im not pretending to be an expert on PEDs, but Im going to go out on a limb and say that I think it would be alot easier to pass any blood test given to me if I was told I only had to take 3 and I also knew the dates I would be taking them, as opposed to them being random and unlimited.

Jus sayin'

[rao007]

My question must've been very, very difficult to answer. Obviously you never will.

~you like to ignore my posts, that's why. Breathe and reread

Fine.

However...what you have written here is not so fine.

The USADA has never said that blood testing is good for "looking at EPO at a certain time" (what does that even mean?). That's what URINE tests do. They've stated the blood test is good because it tracks the red blood cell count. Read:

~But didn't our Balco friend, Conte, say that 5 days was a good cut off date in the interview for looking for EPO? Did I miss something?

But it looks at a host of parameters or biological markers that are natural to everyone's body. And over time -- if you look at those for an individual -- over time, you can see variability or fluctuations in those naturally occurring markers that we all have. And if you see fluctuations to a certain degree, you can conclusively determine that those fluctuations were caused by nothing other than drug use, and certain categories of drug use. Not necessarily a specific drug, but categories of drug use. I think that it's fair to say that there are several, very potent, performance enhancing drugs that only blood can detect, and there is an entirely different method of detecting broader categories of drug use through parameter testing that is done with the blood.

Read further:

So, while you might not think of EPO being all that appealing to boxers, that's what allegedly Mosely was doing out of BALCO. And that makes perfectly good sense to us, because that's going to give you the kind of endurance you need in a late round in a hotly-contested and fought boxing match.

It's also going to greatly improve your ability to train. So there is also this sort of recovery training issue and what's it going to do for you on fight night. And it's significant.

And finally:

So it's hard for me to understand -- and this is not a specific comment about any of the fighters involved here -- but it's hard for me to understand why any athlete wouldn't want the same program that all of our Olympic athletes have.

That is, if they understand these issues, and they're familiar with the programs, and they're educated on the mild inconvenience, and they appreciate the importance of a level playing field.

Good night.

~I never said urine tests were better for testing for "fluctuations" or RBC levels. I said blood tests would probably be better after the fight where RBC levels would likely be abnormally elevated if they were taking EPO. You were arguing something totally different.

Buenas Noches

.............................

[rao007]

we know you are a *******

I like Mayweather and Paulie...they're awesome.

[Carpe Diem]

What are the differences between a Pacquiao fan and a *******?

[MindBat]

What are the differences between a Pacquiao fan and a *******?

Not much. Same difference.

[Bee Keepz]

Im not pretending to be an expert on PEDs, but Im going to go out on a limb and say that I think it would be alot easier to pass any blood test given to me if I was told I only had to take 3 and I also knew the dates I would be taking them, as opposed to them being random and unlimited.

Jus sayin'

You're right, and that was Conte's take on the matter, also. But the accusations have gone from HGH to EPO now. So, what is the basis of Mayweather's accusations? It went from weight/size and power to now stamina.

These accusations are also beyond Alex Ariza's expertise.

[Soda_Popinski]

Floyd asked for Olympic standard testing and Pac conceded, just not too close to fight night. He can be tested further after the fight to see if he took anything illegal during that window, and if he did juice up he would be found out.

it has been stated by multiple people that such a wide window would allow for an athlete to use PED's for a short period of time, and have enough time to get back off and test clean on fight night...the whole idea of "random" testing is so that you can be tested at any time, on any date, for any reason, or no reason at all...it doesn't allow for ANY splip ups...

I think that's reasonable enough, especially when considering he's never failed a drug test in his whole career and that all this controversy stemmed from baseless allegations by Mayweather's dad that have grown out of proportion because of hearsay and wild speculations, and that these level of scrutiny is unprecedented in the history of the sport.

head back a few years and you would have heard this argument on a baseball forum with people defending Canseco, McGwire, and Bonds..."never failed a test" "baseless allegations" "hearsay" "wild speculations."

Testing for ANYTHING at one time would have been considered "unprecedented in the history of the sport." So does that mean they should have never started testing for PED's to begin with?

Testing MUST evolve as athletes/trainers/doctors/suppliers become more adept at creating and administering drugs that can circumvent current testing methods...

There is nothing more ridiculous about Floyd wanting this testing, than Manny wanting the weight clause...

It's like you're guilty until proven innocent.

Floyd should just ***in sign the contract quit the mind games if he really has the balls for this fight.

one could say the same about Manny...if he is clean, and is so much better than Floyd as many would like us to believe then he should just man up and agree to the testing...

But that's just the word of one doctor.

and your's is "just the word of one random internet poster pretending he knows something about PED's" so who do i trust?

The governing testing bodies have own quacks and experts too, and they seem to have no problem with Pac's proposal. Who is to say whose opinion among these quacks is the most valid?

the same governing testing bodies with "quacks and experts" that turned a blind eye to PED's destroying an entire era of baseball in order to put butts in seats and make money??...How many Olympic WR's do you think could potentially be held by PED users that will never be caught?? How many Tour stage victories have been won through PED's that we will never know about??...

If you're gonna say you'd take this non-profit quack's word, then what's the point of the tests being done by the legit organizations responsible for keeping athletes clean if their opinion and conclusions can't be relied upon? The tests Floyd would be asking for would be pointless then, because they're the one's who'd be administering and monitoring all this, not Dr. Catlin.

because he is from a non-profit organization he is a quack? I say the exact opposite, it is the doctor's that are on payroll that need to be worried about. The right amount of money could cause ANY person to bend facts or distort data if its "in the interest of the sport."

Baseball for example...the sport was in a downwird spiral from the days of the 94 players strike. Then all of a sudden balls are flying over the walls in record numbers...accusations of steriod use are WIDESPREAD but absolutely IGNORED by "officials" "organizations" "governing bodies" and "doctors" alike...why? MONEY...LOTS AND LOTS OF MONEY...

frankly, your face and Bee Keepz's for that matter are so deep in Pac Man's crotch that you can't see enough to know how ridiculous you sound...