Santiago: "Cotto has more tools than Juan Manuel Marquez, there is no comparison"

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Well said man! I understand the beating up the little man thing, but the problem is that almost everyone thinks that Pac does not qualify (mostly cause of what he did to ODLH and Hatton), but I do think that Cotto would have to beat more than just Pac so that peepz agree that he his better than JMM.

I just feel that I am one of the few that really believe Cotto is underrated. Hey I might be wrong, but everyone is entitled to their opinion. One of my close friends is Puertorican and he is going for Pac, and we always argue about who is better overall...JMM or Cotto!

The problem is most people are extremist in their thinking. It's one or the other. Saying Cotto is not as good a fighter as JMM is like saying Dwayne Wade is not as good as Kobe. It's no disrespect to Wade, it's just that Kobe is that good. Now I'm not saying that JMMis the Kobe of boxing but you understand my point.

I would not at all be surprised if Cotto beats Pac. If he finds a way to impose his natural size on him, then he will have a big advantage.

Again though, JMM to me is a major overachiever. Think about it, what do people talk about when mentioning JMM? Is it his speed? His power? His strength or size? NO....it's his INTELLIGENCE. Some think that's just something people say but it's the truth. He adjusts on the fly probably better than any fighter I have ever seen.

His fight with Juan Diaz was a prime example of that. he stood in front of Diaz in the early rounds and got rocked by the bigger man. Then he made some adjustments and cmae out and KO'd him.

The dude is a beast...

Cotto is a very, very good fighter. I just can't call him great just yet.

[Ri-Coqui]

Not too many skill fighters like mosley, but yet the CottoQui beat him.

[D-Omonist]

The problem is most people are extremist in their thinking. It's one or the other. Saying Cotto is not as good a fighter as JMM is like saying Dwayne Wade is not as good as Kobe. It's no disrespect to Wade, it's just that Kobe is that good. Now I'm not saying that JMMis the Kobe of boxing but you understand my point.

I would not at all be surprised if Cotto beats Pac. If he finds a way to impose his natural size on him, then he will have a big advantage.

Again though, JMM to me is a major overachiever. Think about it, what do people talk about when mentioning JMM? Is it his speed? His power? His strength or size? NO....it's his INTELLIGENCE. Some think that's just something people say but it's the truth. He adjusts on the fly probably better than any fighter I have ever seen.

His fight with Juan Diaz was a prime example of that. he stood in front of Diaz in the early rounds and got rocked by the bigger man. Then he made some adjustments and cmae out and KO'd him.

The dude is a beast...

Cotto is a very, very good fighter. I just can't call him great just yet.

I understand your points! I also agree that JMM has ring intelligence (not looking at his last performance though), but I really do believe that Cotto is a great fighter. He has a lot of tools it's just that he doesn't use them all the time.

[Equinox]

Speed - Even/Slight edge to Cotto
Body Punching - Cotto
Counterpunching - JMM
Foot Work - Cotto
Timming - Even/Slight Edge to JMM
Defense - Cotto
Chin - Cotto
Stamina - JMM
Strength - Cotto
Power - Cotto
Pressuring - Cotto
Leading - Cotto
Back foot - Cotto
Jab - Cotto
Heart - Even
Straight right hand - JMM
Uppercuts - JMM
Hooks - Cotto

how can you say that cotto has a better chin? when marquez gets rocked or knocked down he immediately starts throwing straight punches right back. he has amazing recovery and out of his losses, 0 have been by knock out. and how can you say that they are even in the heart department? cotto has quit jmm has not. and you can say hes a warrior because of that gash he fought with in the clottey fight by try getting knocked down 3 times in the first round, getting your nose broken, and then continue to whoope ass for the next 11 rounds and a very high work rate. heart: JMM>Cotto

[Beater_of_ass]

The problem is most people are extremist in their thinking. It's one or the other. Saying Cotto is not as good a fighter as JMM is like saying Dwayne Wade is not as good as Kobe. It's no disrespect to Wade, it's just that Kobe is that good. Now I'm not saying that JMMis the Kobe of boxing but you understand my point.

I would not at all be surprised if Cotto beats Pac. If he finds a way to impose his natural size on him, then he will have a big advantage.

Again though, JMM to me is a major overachiever. Think about it, what do people talk about when mentioning JMM? Is it his speed? His power? His strength or size? NO....it's his INTELLIGENCE. Some think that's just something people say but it's the truth. He adjusts on the fly probably better than any fighter I have ever seen.

His fight with Juan Diaz was a prime example of that. he stood in front of Diaz in the early rounds and got rocked by the bigger man. Then he made some adjustments and cmae out and KO'd him.

The dude is a beast...

Cotto is a very, very good fighter. I just can't call him great just yet.

Yea, Diaz got cut some adjustment. All Marquez did was let Diaz come to him, there was no adjustment, there never is in a Marquez fight except for the Mayweather fight and look what happened there. Just like you, no disrespect to Marquez, but the guy is only good if the opponent comes to him, period. There were countless times he could have well knocked Manny out, but instead of pressing the issue he still waited for Manny and it very well may have cost him both fights.

[Left2body]

The problem is most people are extremist in their thinking. It's one or the other. Saying Cotto is not as good a fighter as JMM is like saying Dwayne Wade is not as good as Kobe. It's no disrespect to Wade, it's just that Kobe is that good. Now I'm not saying that JMMis the Kobe of boxing but you understand my point.

I would not at all be surprised if Cotto beats Pac. If he finds a way to impose his natural size on him, then he will have a big advantage.

Again though, JMM to me is a major overachiever. Think about it, what do people talk about when mentioning JMM? Is it his speed? His power? His strength or size? NO....it's his INTELLIGENCE. Some think that's just something people say but it's the truth. He adjusts on the fly probably better than any fighter I have ever seen.

His fight with Juan Diaz was a prime example of that. he stood in front of Diaz in the early rounds and got rocked by the bigger man. Then he made some adjustments and cmae out and KO'd him.

The dude is a beast...

Cotto is a very, very good fighter. I just can't call him great just yet.

Yeah, exactly, however the same can be said for Cotto. Anyway, I believe Cotto has more tools and my reasons why are on page 2 or 3 of this thread.

Cotto is very similar in that respect with the biggest difference being that he is more offensive minded than JMM. Too many people equate defensive minded fighters with being smarter fighters.

[Cuauhtémoc1520]

Then we are the same age.

Overated by you not in general. Look I think Marquez is a very good fighter, I enjoy watching him and have for many years. Yes he's has a very good skillset but he's not leaps and bounds better than Cotto like you want to make it out to be. I do think Cotto is a better fighter overall but I don't think it's sacrilage for you to think that Marquez is. Like you seem to think

Cotto can do more he's very versatile and has won fights can win fights in many different ways. Marquez wins or loses doing what he always does, Cotto can find other ways to win.

Really? You honestly think so? Because all BS aside, I think it's clear to me that JMM is the much more versatile fighter.

Let's go step by step.

Speed: Even. I say even because Cotto doesn't carry blazing speed and neither does JMM

Chin: JMM. I have never seen JMM stopped once, ever. He was hit by the hardest puncher at 130 in Pac and got up, not once but 3 times.

Power: Cotto. Not by much though. Remember we are judging based on size. Man to man Cotto is stronger and bigger but weight for weight, JMM packs a decent punch as well.

Boxing ability: JMM. To me this isn't even close. It's not that I don't think Cotto isn't a good boxer, he is but JMM can fight going forward, backward, counter or be aggressive. Cotto cannot counter punch or go backwards like JMM can, sorry man he just can't.

Jab: Cotto. It's his best punch no doubt. He controls fighters with the jab (when he uses it) and keeps speed fighters off balance with it like he did Zab and Mosley.

Body Punching: Cotto. He's an excellent body puncher and throws with mean intentions. JMM is also a very good body puncher but not at the level of Cotto.

To me the biggest difference is in the pure boxing skill. What JMM does is mastery, seriously. If you can't see that, I don't know what to tell you but hey, everyone has an opinion.

[Doctor_Tenma]

Not too many skill fighters like mosley, but yet the CottoQui beat him.

Since when has Shane been skilled? Very athletic, strong speedy brawler but that's it.

[Beater_of_ass]

how can you say that cotto has a better chin? when marquez gets rocked or knocked down he immediately starts throwing straight punches right back. he has amazing recovery and out of his losses, 0 have been by knock out. and how can you say that they are even in the heart department? cotto has quit jmm has not. and you can say hes a warrior because of that gash he fought with in the clottey fight by try getting knocked down 3 times in the first round, getting your nose broken, and then continue to whoope ass for the next 11 rounds and a very high work rate. heart: JMM>Cotto

Well... Cotto fought Margarito with a broken nose since the 2nd round and 11 rounds with bricks in his mitts. Clottey... cut in round 3. Judah, massive cut on the lip round 3, Torres put him on the mat and Cotto came back to win. Urkal headbutted Cotto about 5 times in their fight and Corley had Cotto on wobbly legs... and lets not forget Corley took 3 knees in one round with Cotto, but I'm sure he has more heart than Cotto too? And you even comparing chins are completely ******ed. Marquez got knocked down more in the first Manny fight than Cotto has in his career. Both guys have massive heart, people bringing up the Marg fight is garbage... Cotto admitted he quit for the benefit of his kids. Essentially he said "Fawk this and all the fans, my family is more important than my pride." It takes a MAN with HEART to admit that.

[D-Omonist]

Since when has Shane been skilled? Very athletic, strong speedy brawler but that's it.

^^^^ Wow! Are you serious?