Comments Thread For: Deontay Wilder comes off the shelf ? this time all for himself

[NihonJim]

Well, That's going to be a debate for a very long time I'm afraid. I've seen many of their fights in person, I have a solid grip on assesing fighters, and my thoughts always centered around never giving much legitimacy to media blips regarding ongoing negotiations; believing that if geriatric Wladimir, late replacement opponent Ruiz and Daniel Dubois can fell you that hard, and in the case of the latter two, slay you outright; it wouldn't take more than a single shot from Wilder to do you worse. Joshua would get caught at least once by a guy who put Fury down hard again and again. It really is just a matter of styles, competencies and liabilities.
When fans say things like "Wilder is nothing, always was nothing", I know fairly quickly what I'm dealing with.
Sadly, it's too late now for us to find out.

Wilder would have probably beaten AJ but Haymon and co (not wilder) DID swerve the fight.

It was for politics reasons not fear, Haymon was desperate to freeze hearn and matchroom out of the US market and wasn't prepared to take any risk that AJ beat Wilder. It was the same reason Luis Ortiz wasn't allowed to take the AJ fight for a career high payday because Haymon was not willing to risk AJ looking better than Wilder vs wilders best career win.

Haymon was trying to make wilder the big US heavyweight star and all decisions around his career were based on minimizing risk of that failing (which it eventually did because they underestimated fury)

[Willow The Wisp]

Do you always cheer losers lmao

The icing would be if robotic AJ sparks him
Better dig deep to hide
I hope all three fugh nuts disappear ; AJ , Wilder and Fury

Saying something like that, the question pops up, Are you a bigot or a Brit?


After all; Wilder was an Olympic medalist, made more defenses of his belt than anyone else in his era, scored more career knockouts than any other title holder of his era, earned a higher KO percent rate than any of his contemporaries, had a longer winning streak (43) than any other heavyweight title holder in history, save for Gene Tunney (47), Rocky Marciano (49), and Larry Holmes (48), and never, ever lost a fight against someone he didn't at least Draw with, until his featherduster decision loss to Joseph Parker, when Wilder was 38 years and 2 months old. To snap you out of your fan fog; Anthony Joshua is only 35 years and 8 months old TODAY!


Another 2 and a half years, Joshua will certainly be in position to lose to all manner of heavyweight with that glass jaw of his, I suspect. If he's even still around, which is doubtful.


Conversely; Deontay Wilder has fought 48 pro fights, lived in the top 3 in the Heavyweight Division for 7 years, and fought top ranked WBC opponents for a decade.


The fact that Joshua and perhaps several others in the era met a higher quality of opposition, factoring in the mid-career losses taken by them, is a single metric that doesn't come close to nullifying all the accolades that "The Bronze Bomber" can lay claim to.


Against the 100 best heavyweights of the 21st centrury, Wilder is 11-4-1 (10), which stacks up well against Tyson Fury's accomplishments, just 37 fights, going 10-2-1 (6), and Oleksandr Usyk's 23 total fights, just 7 of them at heavyweight; 6-0-0 (1); Joseph Parker with 39 fights, 11-3-0 (4), and the fragile Anthony Joshua, who's fought just 32 fights, and went 13-4-0 (10) against the top 100.


Top 100 of the 7,784 professional heavyweights who have campaigned in this timeframe represents the top 1.28469% of the men for whom a career in Kickboxing, MMA or BKFC was deemed inadequate, due to the comparatively low potential for wealth generation in the B-side combat sports.


So, people who really know boxing don't use the term "bum" when referring to those who earned title shots, even if those came against non-linear titleholders.


If fans like to root for Wilder, or Fury, Usyk, Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis, Zhilei Zhang, Anthony Joshua, Daniel Dubois, Joseph Parker, Vitali Klitschko, Andy Ruiz Jr., David Tua, Chris Byrd, Hasim Rahman or Luis Ortiz as being the best of the 21st century, they're welcome to do that, and shouldn't be ridiculed for it. They climbed what is arguably the tallest mountain in all of sports, and got very near the top. Even while being less than perfect.


Respect the athletes!

[Curtis2]

Saying something like that, the question pops up, Are you a bigot or a Brit?


After all; Wilder was an Olympic medalist, made more defenses of his belt than anyone else in his era, scored more career knockouts than any other title holder of his era, earned a higher KO percent rate than any of his contemporaries, had a longer winning streak (43) than any other heavyweight title holder in history, save for Gene Tunney (47), Rocky Marciano (49), and Larry Holmes (48), and never, ever lost a fight against someone he didn't at least Draw with, until his featherduster decision loss to Joseph Parker, when Wilder was 38 years and 2 months old. To snap you out of your fan fog; Anthony Joshua is only 35 years and 8 months old TODAY!


Another 2 and a half years, Joshua will certainly be in position to lose to all manner of heavyweight with that glass jaw of his, I suspect. If he's even still around, which is doubtful.


Conversely; Deontay Wilder has fought 48 pro fights, lived in the top 3 in the Heavyweight Division for 7 years, and fought top ranked WBC opponents for a decade.


The fact that Joshua and perhaps several others in the era met a higher quality of opposition, factoring in the mid-career losses taken by them, is a single metric that doesn't come close to nullifying all the accolades that "The Bronze Bomber" can lay claim to.


Against the 100 best heavyweights of the 21st centrury, Wilder is 11-4-1 (10), which stacks up well against Tyson Fury's accomplishments, just 37 fights, going 10-2-1 (6), and Oleksandr Usyk's 23 total fights, just 7 of them at heavyweight; 6-0-0 (1); Joseph Parker with 39 fights, 11-3-0 (4), and the fragile Anthony Joshua, who's fought just 32 fights, and went 13-4-0 (10) against the top 100.


Top 100 of the 7,784 professional heavyweights who have campaigned in this timeframe represents the top 1.28469% of the men for whom a career in Kickboxing, MMA or BKFC was deemed inadequate, due to the comparatively low potential for wealth generation in the B-side combat sports.


So, people who really know boxing don't use the term "bum" when referring to those who earned title shots, even if those came against non-linear titleholders.


If fans like to root for Wilder, or Fury, Usyk, Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis, Zhilei Zhang, Anthony Joshua, Daniel Dubois, Joseph Parker, Vitali Klitschko, Andy Ruiz Jr., David Tua, Chris Byrd, Hasim Rahman or Luis Ortiz as being the best of the 21st century, they're welcome to do that, and shouldn't be ridiculed for it. They climbed what is arguably the tallest mountain in all of sports, and got very near the top. Even while being less than perfect.


Respect the athletes!

I’m sure every heavyweight fighter hears the same as I do when Wilder’s name is mentioned as Allan Iverson says it best, “we talking about practice, we talking about practice, not the game, practice, we talking about practice” there you go, I simplified it for you!

[MulaKO]

Saying something like that, the question pops up, Are you a bigot or a Brit?


After all; Wilder was an Olympic medalist, made more defenses of his belt than anyone else in his era, scored more career knockouts than any other title holder of his era, earned a higher KO percent rate than any of his contemporaries, had a longer winning streak (43) than any other heavyweight title holder in history, save for Gene Tunney (47), Rocky Marciano (49), and Larry Holmes (48), and never, ever lost a fight against someone he didn't at least Draw with, until his featherduster decision loss to Joseph Parker, when Wilder was 38 years and 2 months old. To snap you out of your fan fog; Anthony Joshua is only 35 years and 8 months old TODAY!


Another 2 and a half years, Joshua will certainly be in position to lose to all manner of heavyweight with that glass jaw of his, I suspect. If he's even still around, which is doubtful.


Conversely; Deontay Wilder has fought 48 pro fights, lived in the top 3 in the Heavyweight Division for 7 years, and fought top ranked WBC opponents for a decade.


The fact that Joshua and perhaps several others in the era met a higher quality of opposition, factoring in the mid-career losses taken by them, is a single metric that doesn't come close to nullifying all the accolades that "The Bronze Bomber" can lay claim to.


Against the 100 best heavyweights of the 21st centrury, Wilder is 11-4-1 (10), which stacks up well against Tyson Fury's accomplishments, just 37 fights, going 10-2-1 (6), and Oleksandr Usyk's 23 total fights, just 7 of them at heavyweight; 6-0-0 (1); Joseph Parker with 39 fights, 11-3-0 (4), and the fragile Anthony Joshua, who's fought just 32 fights, and went 13-4-0 (10) against the top 100.


Top 100 of the 7,784 professional heavyweights who have campaigned in this timeframe represents the top 1.28469% of the men for whom a career in Kickboxing, MMA or BKFC was deemed inadequate, due to the comparatively low potential for wealth generation in the B-side combat sports.


So, people who really know boxing don't use the term "bum" when referring to those who earned title shots, even if those came against non-linear titleholders.


If fans like to root for Wilder, or Fury, Usyk, Wladimir Klitschko, Lennox Lewis, Zhilei Zhang, Anthony Joshua, Daniel Dubois, Joseph Parker, Vitali Klitschko, Andy Ruiz Jr., David Tua, Chris Byrd, Hasim Rahman or Luis Ortiz as being the best of the 21st century, they're welcome to do that, and shouldn't be ridiculed for it. They climbed what is arguably the tallest mountain in all of sports, and got very near the top. Even while being less than perfect.


Respect the athletes!

Wisp I like your posts and I must add they are quite informative and insightful but sorry I just don’t see it with Wilder
I'm not gonna sit here and tell you he’s this or that but luck was on his side and hoping you agree , a very fughin weak bunch of heavyweights
There was a time when I wanted to see the mega fight but that has passed and honestly , atm I’d rather much not see it ; two have beens and no point now
I hated what all three brought to the table which was more like a soap opera than anything else
I’ve never used the word bum or thrash for that matter , I show respect to all boxers no matter what my heart thinks of them
And by the way I ain’t no fughin bigot and even less a Brit
Wilder brings out the worst of me and that is it but because I don’t agree with you don’t necessarily make you right or even wrong if you truly love the spor5 like your suggesting
You make great points and bring many facts to the table AND I still believe he got lucky with the bunch of no hopers
And if you can’t agree to that then you are the one doing a disservice to all previous warriors

[Willow The Wisp]

Wisp I like your posts and I must add they are quite informative and insightful but sorry I just don’t see it with Wilder
I'm not gonna sit here and tell you he’s this or that but luck was on his side and hoping you agree , a very fughin weak bunch of heavyweights
There was a time when I wanted to see the mega fight but that has passed and honestly , atm I’d rather much not see it ; two have beens and no point now
I hated what all three brought to the table which was more like a soap opera than anything else
I’ve never used the word bum or thrash for that matter , I show respect to all boxers no matter what my heart thinks of them
And by the way I ain’t no fughin bigot and even less a Brit
Wilder brings out the worst of me and that is it but because I don’t agree with you don’t necessarily make you right or even wrong if you truly love the spor5 like your suggesting
You make great points and bring many facts to the table AND I still believe he got lucky with the bunch of no hopers
And if you can’t agree to that then you are the one doing a disservice to all previous warriors

I hear you buddy.

[MulaKO]

I hear you buddy.

We all got fighters which we can’t digest so to say and those three made the division a soap opera to say the least

[Bennyleonard99]

Well, That's going to be a debate for a very long time I'm afraid. I've seen many of their fights in person, I have a solid grip on assesing fighters, and my thoughts always centered around never giving much legitimacy to media blips regarding ongoing negotiations; believing that if geriatric Wladimir, late replacement opponent Ruiz and Daniel Dubois can fell you that hard, and in the case of the latter two, slay you outright; it wouldn't take more than a single shot from Wilder to do you worse. Joshua would get caught at least once by a guy who put Fury down hard again and again. It really is just a matter of styles, competencies and liabilities.
When fans say things like "Wilder is nothing, always was nothing", I know fairly quickly what I'm dealing with.
Sadly, it's too late now for us to find out.

He was nothing. His duck record proves it. He had the opportunities to fight Wladimir, Povetkin, AJ, Usyk, Whyte (his long time mandatory) and found reasons to duck them all. Haymon and Finkel knew Wilder was nothing and protected him in house by matching him vs PBC controlled set ups. They took one risk - Fury - because they calculated the big fat oaf was shot from drugs, bad diet and abuse of his body. But even a shot Fury was able to handle Wilder easily. Fury was shot that he knew he could not beat Joshua and it was Fury's ducking and fake negotiations that always aborted the Fury vs AJ showdown which should have happened. It still should happen but Fury still doesn't want it... Because he knows the result... KO loss early easy win for AJ. Fury might be more shot than Wilder.

[Bennyleonard99]

You don't hear Fury or Wilder talking up a future showdown with AJ which should strike you as odd. It's the biggest money fight out there for each. But they won't go near AJ. That tells you everything about Wilder and Fury. They are psyched out by AJ but of course they have to disguise it and cover it up.

[Willow The Wisp]

He was nothing. His duck record proves it. He had the opportunities to fight Wladimir, Povetkin, AJ, Usyk, Whyte (his long time mandatory) and found reasons to duck them all. Haymon and Finkel knew Wilder was nothing and protected him in house by matching him vs PBC controlled set ups. They took one risk - Fury - because they calculated the big fat oaf was shot from drugs, bad diet and abuse of his body. But even a shot Fury was able to handle Wilder easily. Fury was shot that he knew he could not beat Joshua and it was Fury's ducking and fake negotiations that always aborted the Fury vs AJ showdown which should have happened. It still should happen but Fury still doesn't want it... Because he knows the result... KO loss early easy win for AJ. Fury might be more shot than Wilder.

It's fun to post outlandish things when your identity is hidden. I get it. Boxing fans are the silliest fans there are, except for fans of MMA and Professional wrestling I suppose. If only just.

I hate posting insults hurled at A.J., because that reflects very poorly on ME, and because he's a good man, a great heavyweight and trust me when I tell you, a strong candidate for the Hall of Fame.
I use him only as a measuring stick in defending his co-claimant Wilder. To A.J., I apologize.

To you, I simply educate.
I've known Shelly Finkel since his music partnership with Jim Koplik way back in the 70's at the Oakdale. His objectives are intuned with the interests if his clients.

"But even a shot Fury was able to handle Wilder easily". That's just a troll. Fighting a draw and suffering four hard knockdowns; one a knockout under all but those miraculous circumstances? That doesn't sound easy to anyone who's been in the ring. You might have been thinking of Klitschko instead. 116-111, 115-112. That was a conprehensive demonstration of superiority. Easy work there.

"......Wladimir, Povetkin, AJ, Usyk, Whyte"?
What would Wilder need them for?
They had no world title that Deontay needed. Wilder already had an Alpha-belt. And the most prestigious one at that! (and I apply the term loosely).
Two of them were somewhat chinny relics of the previous era, another a perennial contender who fell short of championship level, and that leaves A.J., and if you get blasted to bits by an Andy Ruiz coming in on short notice, you're nobody for Wilder to worry about.

Wilder had higher aspirations than those guys. He twice defended against Ortiz, who stacks up well against your heroes there; and everyone the WBA could place across from him, and he went after the real title, and fought to a draw in pursuit of it.

Following that, A.J. simply kept getting beat, and followed that with recovery periods, making a fight against Wilder impractical right up until Wilder, as the older fighter, aged out during his trillogy fighting for the actual title; which A.J., sadly never earned a shot at.

You've gained nothing from this, I know; but the banter is kinda fun.

Assuming that Usyk can top Dubois a second time, The era of 2015 - 2025 will wrap up like this in the history books:


1. Oleksandr Usyk, Ukraine 24-0-0 (14)
2. Tyson Fury, England 34-2-1 (24)
3. Deontay Wilder, USA 43-4-1 (42)
4. Daniel Dubois, England 22-2-0 (21)
5. Anthony Joshua, England 28-4-0 (24)
6. Joseph Parker, New Zealand 36-3-0 (24)
7. Zhilei Zhang, China 27-3-1 (22)
8. Agit Kabayel, Turkey 26-0-0 (18)
9. Andy Ruiz Jr., USA 35-2-1 (22)
10.Luis Ortiz, Cuba 34-3-0 (29)
11.Dillian Whyte, England 31-3-0 (21)
12.Martin Bakole, Congo 21-2-0. (16)
13.Wladimir Klitschko, Ukraine 64-5-0 (53)
14.Joe Joyce, England 16-3-0 (15)
15.Jarrell Miller, USA 26-1-2 (22)


....Learn it, love it, live it.

[Willow The Wisp]

You don't hear Fury or Wilder talking up a future showdown with AJ which should strike you as odd. It's the biggest money fight out there for each. But they won't go near AJ. That tells you everything about Wilder and Fury. They are psyched out by AJ but of course they have to disguise it and cover it up.

Wilder's 40 and he's still calling out Joshua.
They'll NEVER let their cah cow near the Bombs.

Google 'wilder calls out Joshua'.