Comments Thread For: Daily Bread Mailbag: Haney-Loma Debate, Stevenson, Ryan Garcia, More

[Elboriqua]

Excellent explanation of what it means to be “privileged”

[Shadoww702]

My old boss was was South African white and a slut

jenna and I busted nuts all over her.

I imagined I was a slave and master was outta the house

she prolly imagined I was Antonio Baderss or some hood looking Spaniard

I agree someone brings that swarmming style he will fold. Very chinny and no power. I think Pro washes him.

[SteelFist01]

And Bread stresses it was a razor close fight, but it was a razor close fight in general with Loma winning the two clearest rounds. There were no such obvious rounds in favour of Haney. Nor was Loma hurt or rocked at any point. Haney's head was snapped back cleanly several times; I don't recall Haney landing clean head shots against Loma like that. Haney had to give up his early strategy and get on the back foot after a few rounds. Haney was befuddled in the 10th. Loma was nearly always in control. Loma got better as the fight progressed. Haney got worse.

I agree. The only things that Haney did well were his body shots, which were pretty good, and a couple right hands that didn't amount to anything, and the post weigh in shove, lol. But, I think that all of the 'swing' rounds should have been scored even, if that's possible, especially because those rounds were so close and could have gone either way, so it's only fair that they were scored 'even', and I am admittedly ignorant about scoring fights, if that's not obvious, but if there has to be a 'winner' of each round in the 10 point must system, then the system needs to be overhauled or scrapped for something more accurate. And, the only rounds that were dominant for either fighter was the 10th and 11th rounds, which Lomachenko clearly won. That said, even though I think it was close, I think that Lomachenko did enough to win. But, obviously it doesn't matter now. I wish that Haney had the balls to run it back, but clearly that won't happen.

[crimsonfalcon07]

I agree. The only things that Haney did well were his body shots, which were pretty good, and a couple right hands that didn't amount to anything, and the post weigh in shove, lol. But, I think that all of the 'swing' rounds should have been scored even, if that's possible, especially because those rounds were so close and could have gone either way, so it's only fair that they were scored 'even', and I am admittedly ignorant about scoring fights, if that's not obvious, but if there has to be a 'winner' of each round in the 10 point must system, then the system needs to be overhauled or scrapped for something more accurate. And, the only rounds that were dominant for either fighter was the 10th and 11th rounds, which Lomachenko clearly won. That said, even though I think it was close, I think that Lomachenko did enough to win. But, obviously it doesn't matter now. I wish that Haney had the balls to run it back, but clearly that won't happen.

The system allows for 10/10 cards, and in fact Moretti was just getting called out for a bizarre 10/10 in Davis v Garcia. So he clearly knows they exist. Swing rounds shouldn't exist. They're supposed to be called even. Dominant rounds could even be called 10/8 for the winner, or more if there were knockdowns.

The system that's corrupt is that there is zero accountability for the judges. There's no video review and having sketchy decisions overturned. They could easily do that for any and all close fights. The tech is there, and if YouTubers can go back and rewatch fights and see what punches scored or didn't, and if they can see ON live broadcast during the break between rounds that a so-called knockdown wasn't anything of the sort, that could easily be used to take a lot of the controversy out of the "sport." Controversial decisions could be reviewed by a larger panel of judges and overturned if the cards on the day are far apart. The judges could have access to see the action from the screen and place markers to do a quick review at the end of the round to get it right, because what's clear on screen may not be clear from ringside, and vice versa. There's tons of things that could be easily done to address these issues.

Why don't they though? Because people are making money through corruption. It's not in the interests of the powerful to make the fights harder to fix. And the public and clean fighters suffer for it.

[SteelFist01]

The system allows for 10/10 cards, and in fact Moretti was just getting called out for a bizarre 10/10 in Davis v Garcia. So he clearly knows they exist. Swing rounds shouldn't exist. They're supposed to be called even. Dominant rounds could even be called 10/8 for the winner, or more if there were knockdowns.

The system that's corrupt is that there is zero accountability for the judges. There's no video review and having sketchy decisions overturned. They could easily do that for any and all close fights. The tech is there, and if YouTubers can go back and rewatch fights and see what punches scored or didn't, and if they can see ON live broadcast during the break between rounds that a so-called knockdown wasn't anything of the sort, that could easily be used to take a lot of the controversy out of the "sport." Controversial decisions could be reviewed by a larger panel of judges and overturned if the cards on the day are far apart. The judges could have access to see the action from the screen and place markers to do a quick review at the end of the round to get it right, because what's clear on screen may not be clear from ringside, and vice versa. There's tons of things that could be easily done to address these issues.

Why don't they though? Because people are making money through corruption. It's not in the interests of the powerful to make the fights harder to fix. And the public and clean fighters suffer for it.

Very well said and that makes a lot of sense. So, by that criteria it sounds like Loma should have won. The swing rounds should have been 10-10, and the 10th round should have been a 10-8 round. But, sadly you're right about the corruption. As much as I love boxing, every time something like this happens, I question why I put so much energy, and money into such an unfair sport at times. And, that fight showed both extremes; a good, entertaining fight that for me surpassed what I was expecting (I was rooting for Loma, but feared that he was indeed past it, so was pleasantly surprised by his performance), but then it was a brutal reminder that the corruption runs deep, and despite the fight being good, it's hard to overlook the decision.

[Zaroku]

I agree someone brings that swarmming style he will fold. Very chinny and no power. I think Pro washes him.

I grew up with Yllanta and many were like meldrick Taylor…

flashy and a punch—cabronaso away from folding

hard on the outside soft on the inside

[The D3vil]

Man, I am so sick of people whining about this Haney-Lomachenko fight.

I've been one of Loma's biggest defenders from the Tank nutriders, but seriously, Haney outlanded or tied Loma in punches landed in 5 of the first 6 rounds. Statistically, he could've EASILY been given 5 of the first 6 rounds.

When you start a fight out like that, it's hard to win.

It's real simple, like Kovalev/Ward, the guy who lost had big rounds that everybody remembers, while the guy who won just put rounds in the bank by barely eeking out rounds.

Boxing isn't scored by who you think "won the overall fight". It's won by who scored the most points by winning each individual rounds by 1 or 2 points.

[crimsonfalcon07]

Very well said and that makes a lot of sense. So, by that criteria it sounds like Loma should have won. The swing rounds should have been 10-10, and the 10th round should have been a 10-8 round. But, sadly you're right about the corruption. As much as I love boxing, every time something like this happens, I question why I put so much energy, and money into such an unfair sport at times. And, that fight showed both extremes; a good, entertaining fight that for me surpassed what I was expecting (I was rooting for Loma, but feared that he was indeed past it, so was pleasantly surprised by his performance), but then it was a brutal reminder that the corruption runs deep, and despite the fight being good, it's hard to overlook the decision.

You put the time and energy in because you love the sweet science. It's really crappy when we get invested in outcomes, and we certainly feel for fighters who have made an impact in advancing the science of the sport. I think it's inarguable that Loma has done so. His footwork and Papachenko's training methods were revolutionary, and have inspired a whole new generation of fighters, just as Mayweather really hugely popularized the Philly shell, along his many other contributions to the sport.

And one thing to be said for Haney v Loma is that, in terms of a demonstration of skill in the sweet science, we got one heck of a show on both sides. Loma had a very good performance, and Haney's pivots and counters were on point. From that perspective, and corrupt outcome aside, we got a fight worth watching and rewatching. It's a pity that the cards overshadowed that, because I think Haney would have gotten a ton of respect if the cards had reflected that he lost the fight because of how well he really did do. It's easy to overlook that given the controversy, and honestly it sucks for everyone the way it turned out.