Who is the king of weightbullying? Crawford or Spence?

[PRINCEKOOL]

What you are saying has nothing to do with what I said.

A fighter can be 180 in the off season. That doesn't mean they are 180 on fight night. They could be 160.

Fight night weight is not weigh in weight.
But it's also not the "walk around" weight.

How many fighters these days are 147 pounds or close to on fight night?

Is Canelo Alvarez **** on 160 or 168 pounds on fight night? Or is he 10-15 pounds over that weight limit, being the big man?

The day before weigh in rule, creates a illusion and promotes fighters to be opportunistic 'And exploit the rule with weight cuts'.

Fighters in the 70's and early 80's, where not doing big weight cuts and gaining masses of weight on fight night.

[Citizen Koba]

If you can make the weight that’s all that matters. I don’t believe in weight bullying

I think it's a 'thing' but primarily it's an advantage of younger boxers over older boxers rather than just particular individuals abusing it (unless they're actually cheating through use of diuretics or whatever).. Simply put a young dude of 22 or 23 can probably lose 10+% of their bodyweight (say from 171 to 154) and bounce back to close to optimal performance within 24 hours whereas a 33 year old would be struggling to make 5 or 6% and is likely to suffer more in the ring for it. This is one reason you see so many dudes move up a weight class around the age of 30... not cos they got any bigger, most have filled out as much as they're going to by age 25 - 27, but because they can no longer healthily drain as much for the weigh ins.

Upshot is you often end up with younger guys coming to the ring 5 or even 10Lbs heavier than their older opponents in the medial weightclasses.

On the flip side of course it carries it's own penalties, since rapid and extreme dehydration is a massive physical stressor which will tend to have knock-on effects on mental acuity, endurance and recovery times.

I'm one of those who tends to lean towards same day weigh ins although I acknowledge that ain't really any kinda panacea cos of course dudes will keep seeking every advantage but they just won't have as much recovery time. My personal opinion is that the health of the opponent who could be facing a substantially bigger guy should be valued at least as highly as the health of those who choose to push the limits of rehydration to gain an edge.

[New England]

Day before Weigh In's were introduced in the early 1980's.

So technically historically, most of these fighters you see today trying to be the big man on fight night? Would not be able to opportunistically behave in such ways.

Canelo Alvarez tried to be the big man vs Mayweather and it back fired.

Note: I think they should bring back 'Same day weigh in's'. It would purify the competition in the lower weight divisions, and actually promote better health and safety for the fighters.

i was at the canelo fight. he sat on a chair at the weigh in. he could hardly stand. he was no bully. his stomach was sunken in. it took a lot out of him. again, he sat on a chair after he weighed in. i've never seen that. i told my dad he had no shot and we doubled up on our bets LUL


canelo would use the scale to fight smaller opponents, and also dodge golovkin, later in his career. but against floyd mayweather he was dead in the water. watch the first punch he throws in the fight. watch his facial expressions. he's never been in the ring like that.

[Dakuwaqa]

I think it's a 'thing' but primarily it's an advantage of younger boxers over older boxers rather than just particular individuals abusing it (unless they're actually cheating through use of diuretics or whatever).. Simply put a young dude of 22 or 23 can probably lose 10+% of their bodyweight (say from 171 to 154) and bounce back to close to optimal performance within 24 hours whereas a 33 year old would be struggling to make 5 or 6% and is likely to suffer more in the ring for it. This is one reason you see so many dudes move up a weight class around the age of 30... not cos they got any bigger, most have filled out as much as they're going to by age 25 - 27, but because they can no longer healthily drain as much for the weigh ins.

Upshot is you often end up with younger guys coming to the ring 5 or even 10Lbs heavier than their older opponents in the medial weightclasses.

On the flip side of course it carries it's own penalties, since rapid and extreme dehydration is a massive physical stressor which will tend to have knock-on effects on mental acuity, endurance and recovery times.

I'm one of those who tends to lean towards same day weigh ins although I acknowledge that ain't really any kinda panacea cos of course dudes will keep seeking every advantage but they just won't have as much recovery time. My personal opinion is that the health of the opponent who could be facing a substantially bigger guy should be valued at least as highly as the health of those who choose to push the limits of rehydration to gain an edge.

You make some solid points although it’s interesting that both Crawford and Spence are in or around their mid 30s.

I remember Chavez Jr at MW coming in at CW.

There’s an argument that same day weigh ins would be worse for fighters health as they’d have less time to rehydrate.

[PRINCEKOOL]

i was at the canelo fight. he sat on a chair at the weigh in. he could hardly stand. he was no bully. his stomach was sunken in. it took a lot out of him. again, he sat on a chair after he weighed in. i've never seen that. i told my dad he had no shot and we doubled up on our bets LUL


canelo would use the scale to fight smaller opponents, and also dodge golovkin, later in his career. but against floyd mayweather he was dead in the water. watch the first punch he throws in the fight. watch his facial expressions. he's never been in the ring like that.

All of this is his own fault, he was trying to be the big man vs Mayweather 'And it all backed fired'. He is obviously trying to be the big man, because he did not believe skill for skill he was on Mayweather's level.

The day before weigh in rule, dilutes the competition in the lower weight classes. I don't think you get pure competition. I don't think all the fighters are fighting on a level playing field or sometimes they are not even in their best condition.

I am sure making and staying at 147 pounds, was not easy for Floyd Mayweather 'But he did it, and was never 10-20 pounds over the weight limit on fight night'.

[PRINCEKOOL]

You make some solid points although it’s interesting that both Crawford and Spence are in or around their mid 30s.

I remember Chavez Jr at MW coming in at CW.

There’s an argument that same day weigh ins would be worse for fighters health as they’d have less time to rehydrate.

Why would a fighter do a weight cut, during a same day weigh in? Weight cuts are a new phenomenon in boxing, fighters in the 70's and further back in history were not doing big weight cuts during their fights.

Fighters started to weight drain themselves to exploit the day before weigh in rule etc

The same day weigh in's, would deter fighters from doing big weight cuts. Because it is difficult and dangerous enough, implementing such backwards methods 'Under the day before weigh in rule'.

I am interested in why you think all fighters would weight drain themselves? You clearly for some reason think this is standard normal behavior? Why?

And for the fighters that would attempt to be the big man on fight night, well they would probably be beaten down and lose fights 'So they would learn their lesson real quick'.

[Satir]

As of today the king of weightbulling is Haney; as Sulaiman stated Haney for his last fights came 24 pounds over the limit the fight night, means he rehydrates to 159 lbs, i wonder if WW Lipinets rehydrates to that weight

[Citizen Koba]

You make some solid points although it’s interesting that both Crawford and Spence are in or around their mid 30s.

I remember Chavez Jr at MW coming in at CW.

There’s an argument that same day weigh ins would be worse for fighters health as they’d have less time to rehydrate.

Yeah. My argument would be that neither of em really seek weight advantage now but Crawford used to - especially when he was fighting at 135. Spence is in fact unusual in that he's remained at 147 throughout his career despite turning pro in his early 20s. More common in US fighters to see em move up a division as they fill out into full maturity (between 22/23 and about 26/7) and then again at around 30/1 when the cut gets harder, although there really ain't any hard and fast generalisations.

I kinda addressed the issue of same day weigh ins in the post but sure it's an intractable problem... the issue you raise was of course the argument that led to weigh-ins being shifted to the previous day in the first place, although the unintended outcome was that it ultimately led to even more egregious weight cuts. My position remains though that it's no less important to protect the health of opponents that might end up fighting guys 5 or 10Lbs heavier than them in the ring than it is to protect fighters who choose to drain excessively to gain the slightest edge. Myself I'd say expanding the idea of longer term monitoring - similar to the 28 day weigh-ins but with more checkpoints - might be a solution but obviously would just become a massive pain in the ass for all involved and also run the risk of increasing numbers of fight cancellations.

In general the principle that should be applied, -within the limits of practicability - is that all fights should be conducted between dudes who are as close to the same weight as possible in the ring on the night without compromising their health. The exact details of how that's achieved is absolutely open to discussion and I reckon the sport would benefit greatly from having that particular debate.

[GhostofDempsey]

The weight bully controversy could easily be solved by same day weigh-ins or rehydration clauses.

If you're talking about weight bullies, didn't Fury come in at 277 pounds against Wilder last time out?

[_Maxi]

How many fighters these days are 147 pounds or close to on fight night?

Is Canelo Alvarez **** on 160 or 168 pounds on fight night? Or is he 10-15 pounds over that weight limit, being the big man?

The day before weigh in rule, creates a illusion and promotes fighters to be opportunistic 'And exploit the rule with weight cuts'.

Fighters in the 70's and early 80's, where not doing big weight cuts and gaining masses of weight on fight night.

What the hell are you talking about and why do you quote me? My post has nothing to do with your point.

****** OP doesn't understand the difference between off season walk around weight and fight night weight.

And it seems that you are not very bright either.

Yes I know about same day weigh in in the past and so on. But it's has nothing to do with my response.