Who is the most overated overhyped fraud of all-time

[Deja_Vous]

What boxer in any era do you feel is the most overated overhyped frau. If i had to choose id say Joe Calzaghe. But its very hard for me to nail it to one.

Definately Joe.

NEVER in the histroy of boxing has a fighter recieved so much credit for doing so very little.

[strugler]

Definately Joe.

NEVER in the histroy of boxing has a fighter recieved so much credit for doing so very little.

ahem ahem .....p..........ahem.....w.i...l.l.......ahem..... .....

[TheGreatA]

It seems so ironic that I find your comments regarding floyd to be so incredibly accurate, yet I think you are completely wrong regarding dempsey. One of us is certainly wrong. At his peak, I rate dempsey higher pound for pound than even the most pro-dempsey historians. His reign as champion was pathetic and miserable - his abilities at his peak were not. He was a hobo for a long time before winning the championship, and he may have felt he was due a few years of the easy life. Even in the second tunney fight he isn't in top shape.

At his peak, he was a top 10 pound for pound puncher with the hardest left hook, pound for pound, of all time. He threw it like a haymaker from a southpaw stance, and no one else's comes close. Plus, he could move around the ring, on his toes, at a very, very high speed, probably putting him in the top ten movers all time for heavyweights. That's top ten pound for pound power, top ten movement for a heavyweight. Did I mention he had quite a chin, not to mention virtually every other quality a great fighter is supposed to possess? Personally I think that makes him the greatest fighter of all time. What do you think?

While I rate him highly as a fighter, I do not think that he did enough work to be considered among the 10 greatest fighters that ever lived.

There is no excuse for his career after winning the heavyweight title. If Dempsey felt that he was due for easy life then that's is fine but there were many other great champions who won titles and still fought with the same hunger that Dempsey did before winning the title.

It's the same reason why I do not rate Mayweather as highly as some others might. He had a fine career at 130, fought the best man at 135 and looks great in the ring. I can agree with his fans who think of him as a businessman who handpicks fights for the most money. I can agree with it and it's likely what I and most others would do if we ever got to the top.

There were however so many other great fighters that did fight the best from the day they began boxing until the very end of their careers, never avoiding their top ranked challenger. We have to give these men extra credit.

As far as Dempsey's head to head abilities go, I do not rate him quite as highly as you do. He had many qualities that make a great champion, an aggressive nature, an iron chin and the type of head and foot movement that had never before been seen in the heavyweight division and only rarely seen ever since.

He was not a consistent pressure fighter, focusing on taking out his opposition during the early rounds and slowing down afterwards. He could be outboxed, for whatever reason he had little use for the jab which is one of the most important punches in boxing. Dempsey while extremely knowledgeable about boxing often abandoned his gameplan in the ring and was dragged into wild brawls which would have done him no good against the likes of Foreman, Liston and Tyson, bigger stronger hitters.

muhammad ali repeatedly called himself "the prettiest thing that ever lived" and described his fighting style as "float like a butterfly, sting like a bee." His idol, Ray Robinson, claimed to never have enjoyed boxing, retired to become a professional dancer, and returned to the ring only because of financial problems. If that doesn't make them dancing ******, I don't know what does.

Here's a more serious interview with Muhammad Ali all the way from 1964:

"If I were like a lot of guys—a lot of heavyweight boxers, I mean—I'll bet you a dozen doughnuts you wouldn't be reading this story right now. If you wonder what the difference between them and me is, I'll break the news: you never heard of them. I'm not saying they are not good boxers. Most of them—people like Doug Jones and Ernie Terrell—can fight almost as good as I can. I'm just saying you never heard of them."

"Part of my plan to get the fight has made me say some pretty insulting things about Sonny Liston, but I might as well tell you I've done that mostly to get people to talking about the fight and to build up the gate. I actually have a certain amount of respect for Liston; he's the champion, isn't he? That doesn't mean I think he's going to stay champion. I have too much confidence in my own ability to think I'm beaten before we start. I do mean he is a strong, hard puncher, and he's not a fighter anybody can laugh at. When I walk into a room where he is and see him staring at me with that mean, hateful look, I want to laugh, but then I think maybe it's not so funny. I'm pretty sure the way he acts is just a pose, the same way I have a pose, but that look of his still shakes me."

"But when I get a crowd around me, somebody always wants to know if I'm really like the way I act. Well, of course I'm like I act or else I couldn't act this way. But what I have done is to exaggerate the natural way I am. I wouldn't sit around my house shouting and carrying on if it was just me and my folks, but I would if there was anybody else there to hear me. I do that for the reason I've already said: to attract attention and to get rich."

"It was right after I had won the Olympic gold medal in Rome and had turned professional, and I was confident then I could beat either one of them if I had the chance. But I knew I wouldn't get the chance because nobody much had ever heard of me. So I said to myself, how am I going to get a crack at the title? Well, on that bus I realized I'd never get it just sitting around thinking about it. I knew I'd have to start talking about it—I mean really talking, screaming and yelling and acting like some kind of a nut."

"One thing people can't stand is a blowhard, and the more I blew, the more people would come out to see me get beaten. I said I was pretty (I'm not as pretty as I let on), I said I was fast, I said I was terrific and it got so you couldn't keep people away. And those that got in would yell, "Take away his pink Cadillac, the bum," and, "Bash in his pretty nose," and, "Button his fat lip." Well, that's just fine. I don't really care what people say about me personally as long as they buy a ticket to come see me. After they pay their money, they're entitled to a little fun."

http://vault.sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1075663/index.htm

You should not judge a man's fighting abilities based on how they behave outside of the ring. Lets not forget that Jack Dempsey was more interested in becoming a Hollywood star than defending his championship.

Robinson said that but he fought ferociously in the ring. The reason he quit boxing was because he felt he was near death against Maxim and there was no point in continuing so he figured out a less dangerous way to make money which in the end proved to be unsuccessful.

[badnewsbrown]

Ricky hatton

[hemichromis]

What boxer in any era do you feel is the most overated overhyped frau. If i had to choose id say Joe Calzaghe. But its very hard for me to nail it to one.

HA HA HA!!

any evidence or do you just not like him?

[Mike_Dee]

easily, Ricky Hatton

[hemichromis]

Ricky hatton

Of alltime? Nope
in the last couple of years, probably. hate to say thjat as a brit

but we all thought he was great till he stepped up in class. he had good moments against mayweather and pacquiao but would lose again to either.

he had a good heart though and thats important.

[MindBat]

Well, we can only speculate as to what could have been.

Calzaghe was dropped to the canvas by two past prime former world champions.

It sure as heck would've been interesting to see them go at it in their primes.

[MindBat]

Of alltime? Nope
in the last couple of years, probably. hate to say thjat as a brit

but we all thought he was great till he stepped up in class. he had good moments against mayweather and pacquiao but would lose again to either.

he had a good heart though and thats important.

Ricky may have remained champ at 140 if he didn't move up. But he just wanted to challenge himself, so he stepped up and collected some nice checks in the process.

Can't knock him for that.

[glidesmack]

Good point about the maxim retirement, very interesting compelling interview about ali's personality. I agree that dempsey has no excuse for his career after winning the title, but I stand by my belief that he was the best there was at his peak. Also, good point about dempsey's hollywood career.

Another thing. Ali's interview reminded me of how dempsey earned his title shot, which no one thought he deserved either. Instead of talking, he beat the number 1 and number 2 contenders in a combined roughly 30 seconds. He probably couldn't have talked his way into a title shot. He also never needed to talk to attract attention or get rich. His fighting drew the biggest crowds in history.

I agree that you shouldn't judge a fighter on their behavior out of the ring. In the case of ali and robinson, though, I think it crosses over. In the ring, neither seemed to enjoy themselves the way dempsey did and I think it made them lesser fighters.

I do agree that the top places in history should belong to fighters who fought the best for their entire careers, which dempsey didn't do. I wonder, though, who you have in mind when you say that. Certainly Ali and Robinson are high on that list. Who would you have in the top spot? I think of Ali as avoiding a rematch with Foreman and Robinson as having ducked Charley Burley to some extent as well as some other guys. Ali also changed his style to some degree as he got older. As far as career's go, I guess I agree with everyone that Robinson's takes the cake.