vitali has truley never been beaten

[Mr. Ryan]

Flat, you know, like lacking interest or excitement; dull.

People do gain slightly as years pass but at that point he had been out of the ring for a year and two weeks and took awhile to get into the fight. I didn't see him bouncing around and pumping his jab, he was just brawling. That isn't the Lewis I'm used to seeing.

I don't think anyone was giving Kirk Johnson much of a chance to beat Klitschko. The man was closer to a coronary than competitive shape.

Flatter, or fatter? I thought he was performing pretty well. He was active, throwing bombs, seemed like he was all there in every way. He tired a little, but that's because Vitali was pressing the action and Lewis was throwing more in every round than he had previously in his career that I remember.

He was, however, a little big heavier than usual, but remember....he was 39, and people do gain slightly as years pass. Whichever way this fight had gone, Lewis would've retired anyway. The only way he wouldn't have retired was if Johnson had beaten Vitali and he had a chance to take on Johnson for one more big payday before he retired. He never, ever had any intention of rematching Klitchko, and all the bull**** he spilled saying otherwise was just that. Why do you think he waited so long before finally announcing retirement? He was hoping someone would take Vitali out so he could get another payday before he gave it up without having to face the big Ukraine again to do it.

[Naps]

Surely being an out of shape 50+ former amateur does not qualify you to beat ex-con professional world champions, does it?

I'm sure a 50+ George Foreman could take B-Hop on the tiles, so why the hell couldn't Steve Bunce?

[Kastrioti]

It's not that TheManchine doesn't have "a slant toward Euro-favoritism" it's that he shows a strong anti-European, pro-American bias.

Even most other Klitschko haters wouldn't claim that Vitali quit because Byrd put a beating on him and injured him.

That has nothing to do with him being american. I was born in europe, raised in europe, and same with my father, my father always sides with the Americans, because he grew up watching only American boxers, so he believes that the past guys would destroy the current HW division.

[Mr. Ryan]

It's not that TheManchine doesn't have "a slant toward Euro-favoritism" it's that he shows a strong anti-European, pro-American bias.

Even most other Klitschko haters wouldn't claim that Vitali quit because Byrd put a beating on him and injured him.

Coming from someone with a strong pro-European bias, it's hard to really invest much in those accusations, ya dig?

[SpArKeD-CoLd]

****head he got stopped by Lennox Lewis

[Stickman]

Flat, you know, like lacking interest or excitement; dull.

People do gain slightly as years pass but at that point he had been out of the ring for a year and two weeks and took awhile to get into the fight. I didn't see him bouncing around and pumping his jab, he was just brawling. That isn't the Lewis I'm used to seeing.

I don't think anyone was giving Kirk Johnson much of a chance to beat Klitschko. The man was closer to a coronary than competitive shape.

I think the reason he seemed a little off is because he was used to controlling the fight, and for maybe the first time, the pace was being controlled by his opponent, and at a faster pace than he was comfortable with. Even when he'd been KO'd in the past, he was in control of the pace of the fight itself, until he pulled a boner and got caught....the ******est moment of his life was when he was showboating against Rahman and caught that right hand when he was bouncing off the ropes. I bet he still feels like an idiot over that. And the first McCall fight....he had an idiot for a trainer, 'nuff said.

[The Hammer]

That has nothing to do with him being american. I was born in europe, raised in europe, and same with my father, my father always sides with the Americans, because he grew up watching only American boxers, so he believes that the past guys would destroy the current HW division.

Or if he really is Finnish, it could have something to do with the old Finland-USSR animosity. Finland and the Soviet Union were on different sides in WW II, Finland being a German ally, and the USSR took some Finnish territory at the end of the war.

Some American anti-Klitschko bias may be because the influence of the Cold War and movies like Rocky IV.

[Jim Jeffries]

I haven't seen the Byrd fight, but if you're up by 5 points on two cards, and 7 on the other, and there's 3 rounds to go, I don't care if your arm is falling out of the socket, finish the damn fight. It's not like Byrd was going to knock him out, there was a title on the line, no excuse. He redeemed himself somewhat in the Lewis fight, and he was ahead on points, but the guy's face was a mess, so it is what it is. Two losses anyway you look at it. Two fights he could and should have won, if he had more heart in the first and kept his hands up more in the second, but two losses nonetheless.

[Mr. Ryan]

I haven't seen the Byrd fight, but if you're up by 5 points on two cards, and 7 on the other, and there's 3 rounds to go, I don't care if your arm is falling out of the socket, finish the damn fight. It's not like Byrd was going to knock him out, there was a title on the line, no excuse. He redeemed himself somewhat in the Lewis fight, and he was ahead on points, but the guy's face was a mess, so it is what it is. Two losses anyway you look at it. Two fights he could and should have won, if he had more heart in the first and kept his hands up more in the second, but two losses nonetheless.

Very solid post. Spinning the truth doesn't change it, you take your loss like a man, come back and redeem yourself. That's how a true fan, not a fan of particular fighters, would look at it.

About keeping his hands up, I don't think that's his particular style, he's so long that just pulling away from punches accomplishes that goal.

[larryx]

****head he got stopped by Lennox Lewis

was that even neccassary??? and no lewis didnt stop him..the ring doctor did