Joe Calzaghe Vacates WBO Title After a Ten-Year Run

[deanrw]

As an amateur Joe Calzaghe won the British ABA title three years consecutively, in three consecutive weight divisions. As a professional, he is currently the Ring champion of two weight divisions simultaneously, the first boxer ever to achieve this. He is undefeated in a fifteen year professional career, including 11 years as world champion, during his reign at which he amassed 21 title defences, defeated the former WBA, IBF and WBC (twice) champions. He then went on to unify the 'division by beating two young, prime champions while he himself was in his thirties. He then stepped up and won the already mentioned LHW Ring belt in his first fight at LHW against a P4P top ten boxer. If he defeats Roy Jones he will join Marciano as one of the very few elite boxers to retire undefeated.

To say Joe Calzaghe is 'nothing special at all' is absolutely ludicrous.

90% of what you posted, are just stats. Stats are meaningless without real Meat in them. 21 defenses over 11 years? Sure and 15 of them were tomato cans. Suddenly it is not so impressive is it?

When Joe won the title, the 168lb division had a couple decent resident fighters, and a couple once very good fighters who were buoyant mainly because the supporting base was nothing but a bunch of journeyman with padded records. Everyone else used the division as a stepping stone. The division slowly and continues to improve, but you will still see the Sartisan's get thrown into the mix without ever fighting a live opponent and will never amount to anything. Kessler basically had to risk injuring himself and fight a journeyman to grab a strap. Is that good for Kessler or Boxing? Hell no! Kessler is still stuck waiting for another opportunity by wasting his time.

I'm not slamming Joe, but I will never consider him great with what he has accomplished so far. Stats do not equal automatic greatness. If it was Ottke would be considered an all time great also. You want greatness? You have to go after greatness.

[abadger]

90% of what you posted, are just stats. Stats are meaningless without real Meat in them. 21 defenses over 11 years? Sure and 15 of them were tomato cans. Suddenly it is not so impressive is it?

When Joe won the title, the 168lb division had a couple decent resident fighters, who were buoyant mainly because the supporting base was nothing but a bunch of journeyman with padded records. Everyone else used the division as a stepping stone. The division slowly and continues to improve, but you will still see the Sartisan's get thrown into the mix without ever fighting a live opponent and will never amount to anything.

I'm not slamming Joe, but I will never consider him great. Stats do not equal automatic greatness. If it was Ottke would be considered an all time great also. You want greatness? You have to go after greatness.

I know you think that you are being fair and even handed, but you aren't. If you wish to dismiss Calzaghe's 21 defences as being padded, you also have to dismiss Hopkins 19 for the same reason. You would also have to disregard the vast majority of opponents Roy Jones fought. Where you see other fighters using SMW as a stepping stone, I see them choosing the easier option. Nigel Benn, Chris Eubank, Steve Collins and Gerald McLellan at SMW would be better than Virgil Hill, Montell Griffin and Mike McCallum IMO. I would suggest that you take the 'greatness' of those you believe to be great too much for granted without actually looking at the facts, and in Calzaghe's case ignore the facts in favour of believing a stereotype.

[Chase8400]

He is the undisputed champion of the LHW is he now??? Just like Buster over Tyson just like Baldomir over Judah

If he wears the Ring belt, he owns the weight class. Undisputed is acually almost impossible to obtain. But If he beats Joe, I will have no doubt about who the best is.

[deanrw]

I know you think that you are being fair and even handed, but you aren't. If you wish to dismiss Calzaghe's 21 defences as being padded, you also have to dismiss Hopkins 19 for the same reason. You would also have to disregard the vast majority of opponents Roy Jones fought. Where you see other fighters using SMW as a stepping stone, I see them choosing the easier option. Nigel Benn, Chris Eubank, Steve Collins and Gerald McLellan at SMW would be better than Virgil Hill, Montell Griffin and Mike McCallum IMO. I would suggest that you take the 'greatness' of those you believe to be great too much for granted without actually looking at the facts, and in Calzaghe's case ignore the facts in favour of believing a stereotype.

I don't consider Hopkins an all time great fighter. He was a very good Middleweight Champion though and somewhere on the all time middleweights list. On Hagler's level though? Not even close. Hopkins got caught in somewhat of a weak era for Middleweights and it has extended to Pavlik's current reign. Pavlik has jumped up to fight Hopkins because besides Abraham, well 160 is close to being a ghost town.

Pavlik has the potential of being a "good" champion, but I won't even place him with that designation, untill he proves himself much more. Until then he is just a champion who earned respect for getting it the hard way, which is a good foundation to build on. If Pavlik fought 20 Gary Lockett's from this point forward in title defences, it will mean he wasted his career.

My point is, too many people like to throw around the term "greatness" these days. I find that offensive to the ones who are cemented there and actually eared their badges the correct way, by fighting the best they could get, fought hard, took their losses along with great wins and never ducked an opponent.

[BetterCallSaul]

Calzaghe's haters truly are pathetic. What on earth causes you all to dislike Joe so much? Its bizarre. I can only conclude most of you are literally such homers that you actually cannot stomach having a UK boxer who is as good or better than your illustrious 'legends', and 'greats'. Well suck it up, ******s, they may not come along often, but Calzaghe is the real deal, the best SMW champ there's ever been. It'll be a long time before the USA or anywhere for that matter produces a fighter as good as him, I shall look forward with great anticipation to the day it happens.

Good post. I will rep you later.

[abadger]

I don't consider Hopkins an all time great fighter. He was a very good Middleweight Champion though and somewhere on the all time middleweights list. On Hagler's level though? Not even close. Hopkins got caught in somewhat of a weak era for Middleweights and it has extended to Pavlik's current reign. Pavlik has jumped up to fight Hopkins because besides Abraham, well 160 is close to being a ghost town.

Pavlik has the potential of being a "good" champion, but I won't even place him with that designation, untill he proves himself much more. Until then he is just a champion who earned respect for getting it the hard way, which is a good foundation to build on. If Pavlik fought 20 Gary Lockett's from this point forward in title defences, it will mean he wasted his career.

My point is, too many people like to throw around the term "greatness" these days. I find that offensive to the ones who are cemented there and actually eared their badges the correct way, by fighting the best they could get, fought hard, took their losses along with great wins and never ducked an opponent.

I agree with almost everything you say. I personally don't claim that Calzaghe is the greatest boxer in history. Skillswise I rate him below Mayweather and Jones of this generation alone, and he achieved less too. All time I've only made it as far as Ray Leonard in any detail and Calzaghe isn't better than him either, when I get round to watching all Hagler's fights I won't be surprised if he comes out on top too. There are an awful lot of boxers in history...

[deanrw]

I agree with almost everything you say. I personally don't claim that Calzaghe is the greatest boxer in history. Skillswise I rate him below Mayweather and Jones of this generation alone, and he achieved less too. All time I've only made it as far as Ray Leonard in any detail and Calzaghe isn't better than him either, when I get round to watching all Hagler's fights I won't be surprised if he comes out on top too. There are an awful lot of boxers in history...

Finally you see my point!! I am not slamming Joe but I am just giving him the designation I feel he deserves, which is a good champion. He could have went much further, but he wasted much of his potential. When I call a guy a good champion, I consider it a compliment.

This is why I wanted Pavlik to fight Joe, because whoever wins, the winner has earned more in the big scheme of things. It would not have hurt Joe to have a win over a current lineal Middleweight Champ notched into his belt and it would have helped Pavlik big time reputation wise if he beat Joe. You know what would be even greater? The loser of the two loses nothing but the fight and still gets credit for fighting a tough SOB. It adds to their reputation when the best available square off.

If Pavlik fights Abraham and loses, I am still a fan of both.

I am still a huge fan of Taylor and still a huge fan of Miranda. They got some L's now, but dammit they went down fighting against good opposition.

[them_apples]

Calzaghe isn't going to be remembered that well, his resume isn't good enough.

Calzaghe never had that unbeatable status because I always feel he was picking and choosing oponents. If Calzaghe walked through a bunch of elite fighters I could see the hype, but his record seems like its ment for paper only.

I see him losing to all the middleweight greats, but putting up a good fight.

[dstew]

Finally you see my point!! I am not slamming Joe but I am just giving him the designation I feel he deserves, which is a good champion. He could have went much further, but he wasted much of his potential. When I call a guy a good champion, I consider it a compliment.

This is why I wanted Pavlik to fight Joe, because whoever wins, the winner has earned more in the big scheme of things. It would not have hurt Joe to have a win over a current lineal Middleweight Champ notched into his belt and it would have helped Pavlik big time reputation wise if he beat Joe. You know what would be even greater? The loser of the two loses nothing but the fight and still gets credit for fighting a tough SOB. It adds to their reputation when the best available square off.

If Pavlik fights Abraham and loses, I am still a fan of both.

I am still a huge fan of Taylor and still a huge fan of Miranda. They got some L's now, but dammit they went down fighting against good opposition.

Excellent post.

[Chase8400]

Roy Jones beat one pound for pound fighter in his entire career too.

Acually: More than one , bud.

1: Hopkins
2: Toney
3: Trinidad
4: Tarver

All on the lb4lb top 10 list at one point or another.