Mikkel Kessler-Daniloa Haussler Moved To Oldenburg

[MWMerlino]

First - Lacy was considered great by the Yanks. Denial isnt a river in Egypt

No, he was considered a promising prospect by some.

Second - your lame argument is based on something hypothetical - Kessler's next fight. We're not even close to knowing who it is yet but you're already writing him off.

My "lame" argument really isn't even an argument. I wasn't trying to prove/disprove anything other than this: If Kessler keeps fighting weak competition then people should hold him accountable for his padded record and complacency.

And BatTheMan is spot on, its not as if any high profile Yanks were willing to step up and tempt Kessler into dropping his strap. Its telling that Kessler is actually criticising his own fight yet Taylor is trying to sell his as an attraction whilst admitting he's avoiding stiffer comp.

The two variables in this land solely on Kessler's marketability--which is very low and was the same as Calzaghes for most of his career. The biggest paydays come from fighting in America--Kessler hasn't accomplished anything to get the attention necessary to fight the big fights. He was in 39 pro fights before taking on Calzaghe (the worst HBO numbers of all time). His previous fight was against Librado Andrade--a boxer relegated to Wednesday Night Fights in the states. American prospects have faced stiffer competition in 20 fights than Kessler has in 40. He needs to step up and get on with it.

[Kris Silver]

I believe Kessler has publicly announced that his goal is a fight with Pavlik. Don't have a quote, but I'm pretty sure that that is correct.

Your quite right sir, all from this very site:

"I would like to fight Pavlik in the fall"

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=14476

And as a special bonus...

"I will kick Joe Calzaghe's arse"

http://www.boxingscene.com/?m=show&id=9554

[abadger]

No, he was considered a promising prospect by some.

This is attempting to rewrite history, I'm sure Lacy had his critics but he was widely expected to destroy Calzaghe and was a heavy betting favourite in the fight.

My "lame" argument really isn't even an argument. I wasn't trying to prove/disprove anything other than this: If Kessler keeps fighting weak competition then people should hold him accountable for his padded record and complacency.

Kessler's record is not padded, his career thus far represents 1) rise through the ranks, 2) title win, 3) elimination of pretty much all viable contenders plus another title, 4) failed attempt at unification 5) capture of another title, 6) upcoming mandatory defence. If Kessler continues fighting boxers of Hausslers stature then it will start to become padded, until then it isn't.

The two variables in this land solely on Kessler's marketability--which is very low and was the same as Calzaghes for most of his career. The biggest paydays come from fighting in America--Kessler hasn't accomplished anything to get the attention necessary to fight the big fights. He was in 39 pro fights before taking on Calzaghe (the worst HBO numbers of all time). His previous fight was against Librado Andrade--a boxer relegated to Wednesday Night Fights in the states. American prospects have faced stiffer competition in 20 fights than Kessler has in 40. He needs to step up and get on with it.

Kessler is a three time world champion and ranked as the #1 SMW on earth. His only loss is to the P4P #2. If this does not qualify him for big fights, what does?

[MWMerlino]

This is attempting to rewrite history, I'm sure Lacy had his critics but he was widely expected to destroy Calzaghe and was a heavy betting favourite in the fight.

The expectation to destroy Calzaghe had more to do with no one paying attention to Calzaghe because his career was spent fighting shut-outs against nobodies. At any rate, Lacy was unproven though regarded.

Kessler's record is not padded, his career thus far represents 1) rise through the ranks, 2) title win, 3) elimination of pretty much all viable contenders plus another title, 4) failed attempt at unification 5) capture of another title, 6) upcoming mandatory defence. If Kessler continues fighting boxers of Hausslers stature then it will start to become padded, until then it isn't.

Ok--padded is the wrong word. I'll call it "pulp" until he continues to fight Hausslers. You are completely correct here.

Kessler is a three time world champion and ranked as the #1 SMW on earth. His only loss is to the P4P #2. If this does not qualify him for big fights, what does?

When you say that--it sounds really good. "Three time world champion". World Champion means you beat the best the world had to offer. Well, in the SMW division the best isn't that great. Its been a very thin division and Kessler hasn't made moves to fight at higher/lower weights to draw in better competition.

His only loss is to #2 P4P but the HBO numbers were bad and Calzaghe is just now himself getting big money fights.

[Kris Silver]

His only loss is to #2 P4P but the HBO numbers were bad and Calzaghe is just now himself getting big money fights.

I know money's a factor and all that, but you make out like it's the only one. Some boxers are driven by the sport itself you know, and the respect, reputation, career growth it gives them and so on. Ok they might take a bigger paid fight at certain points in their career but you can't every time. They lose respect and reputation if that happens, which ultimately can effect their earnings.

You can't avoid top guys non stop for several years when they've called you out and everything else is near saturated. Kessler has called Pavlik out, and Hopkins once I think. He's had pretty much no response, now that's ducking, which ironically is what you kinda criticise Calzaghe for. I spot a slightly double standard, and, as if we need to be over emphasising the money as a factor in boxing today, they do it on their own just fine and it's often not good for the sport.

[abadger]

When you say that--it sounds really good. "Three time world champion". World Champion means you beat the best the world had to offer. Well, in the SMW division the best isn't that great. Its been a very thin division and Kessler hasn't made moves to fight at higher/lower weights to draw in better competition.

His only loss is to #2 P4P but the HBO numbers were bad and Calzaghe is just now himself getting big money fights.

Immediately after losing to calzaghe, Kessler announced willingness to move up OR down to make big fights.

There is little difference in the strength of MW and SMW right now, and LHW is full of old men who will never fight Kessler in a month of Sundays. The top and 'name' boxers Kessler could face are Pavlik, Abraham, Taylor, Miranda, Lacy, Froch, Bute. All are either SMWs or have boxed there in the guise of a catchweight very recently. Kesler is at the right weight for making fights.

[BattlingNelson]

The expectation to destroy Calzaghe had more to do with no one paying attention to Calzaghe because his career was spent fighting shut-outs against nobodies. At any rate, Lacy was unproven though regarded.




Ok--padded is the wrong word. I'll call it "pulp" until he continues to fight Hausslers. You are completely correct here.





When you say that--it sounds really good. "Three time world champion". World Champion means you beat the best the world had to offer. Well, in the SMW division the best isn't that great. Its been a very thin division and Kessler hasn't made moves to fight at higher/lower weights to draw in better competition.

His only loss is to #2 P4P but the HBO numbers were bad and Calzaghe is just now himself getting big money fights.

SMW is arguably better than both LHW and MW. By looking at the rings top 10 in all 3 div. I'm pretty sure you'd agree. And Kessler has called out Calzaghe for a rematch and Kelly Pavlik and RJJ since hospitalizing the undefeated Sartison. What can he do? You say he should step up but all step ups are not willing to fight him (they duck you know...)

[dstew]

Thats neither here nor there. I assume Taylor has some say in who he fights and Im sure he wouldnt have his promoter saying "'we're taking an easier fight" if that hadn't been the case. I admire their honesty if anything in that sense.

Although they arent as honest as Kessler who is clearly frustrated and writing off his fight with Haussler. Yet Taylor vs Lacy will be sold as a big attraction on HBO. Kessler is clearly being forced into his waste of time fight whereas Taylor has chosen to take his.

From what I know about Taylor, he does have some say in who he fights, and after all previous options had been exhausted (he was teased by Mayorga, Trinidad, and RJJ IIRC) he WANTED to finally step into the ring with his old olympic rival Jeff Lacy . Then, along came the offer to fight Carl Froch, who Taylor had probably never heard of, for the WBC belt, and his management advised him that the Lacy fight would bring him more money and a date on his home network, HBO (who didn't want to air Taylor/Froch, even if it was for a belt).

Kudos to Kessler for his honesty about Haussler, but how honest was he when he backed out of the Miranda fight to take what on paper was an easier fight with Sartison for a paper title? His camp finally released a press release blaming the cancellation on Miranda, but that was after failing to pick up the phone for comment when nearly every boxing news outlet around the world was reporting that Kessler was ducking Miranda. When you ignore interview requests in favor of issuing a press release a day or two later, it looks sketchy to say the least.

In the end, at least we know that Taylor is fighting for something, even if it is money. What is Kessler fighting for? A belt that keeps forcing him into mandatories against bums, wasting his time? Neither situation is commendable, but of the two I'd have to say Taylor's career path sounds more reasonable.

[dstew]

You can't avoid top guys non stop for several years when they've called you out and everything else is near saturated. Kessler has called Pavlik out, and Hopkins once I think. He's had pretty much no response, now that's ducking, which ironically is what you kinda criticise Calzaghe for. I spot a slightly double standard, and, as if we need to be over emphasising the money as a factor in boxing today, they do it on their own just fine and it's often not good for the sport.

If Kessler has seen both Pavlik and Hopkins fit to call out, how can you accuse them of ducking when the two of them choose to fight each other instead of him? "Ducking" would imply that one or both of them were taking an easier fight, which doesn't follow the logic of Kessler's world since he saw fit to challenge both of them and now they are fighting each other. Am I making sense? It takes some circular logic, but you'll get there eventually.

And to be honest, Kessler is probably not on either fighter's radar until he wins a semi-high profile fight, considering he lost his only high-profile fight that was aired in the U.S. Unfortunately for Mikkel, Arthur Abraham beat him to the punch in that regard so right now he is the European everyone is talking about.

[abadger]

If Kessler has seen both Pavlik and Hopkins fit to call out, how can you accuse them of ducking when the two of them choose to fight each other instead of him? "Ducking" would imply that one or both of them were taking an easier fight, which doesn't follow the logic of Kessler's world since he saw fit to challenge both of them and now they are fighting each other. Am I making sense? It takes some circular logic, but you'll get there eventually.

And to be honest, Kessler is probably not on either fighter's radar until he wins a semi-high profile fight, considering he lost his only high-profile fight that was aired in the U.S. Unfortunately for Mikkel, Arthur Abraham beat him to the punch in that regard so right now he is the European everyone is talking about.

I think the notion that Kessler is not on peoples radar until he wins a 'high profile fight' is a little disingenuous. I think the reality is that he is a very large blip on every top fighter from MW to LHW's radar, one marked AVOID!

I am not suggesting that this is an out and out ducking scenario, more as you quite correctly point out, an economic and risk/reward based one. I can understand that no matter how well regarded in boxing circles Kessler may be, fighting him might not bring the money they are looking for, beating him might not bring the credit they are looking for, and losing to him would be disastrous!

However, this may all be true, but this scenario is not really a 'justifiable' one. This type of approach to matchmaking is the business led one, which we fans routinely complain about, and I don't see how anyone can deny that from a 'boxing' perspective Mikkel Kessler has not clearly demonstrated that he belongs at the top table.