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well then they need to come over and take LESS pay and make a fight... If they want to PROVE something then coming to AMERICA and taking less everything and beating the champ in there OWN back yard is the way to do it. So yeah I can see why the blame is on them, they dont want to leave. They expect the CHAMP to come to them. Wrong...But I can this being a NEVER ENDING argument....
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I think the most obvious question here is - what does Paul Williams and Bob Arum know about his fighting condition that we don't? I mean, everyone admits that Paul is simply a freak for being as large as he is and still making 147; is he admitting to us, without saying it, that his fighting days at welterweight are almost through? Paul Williams is in the division most widely considered the deepest in the sport, holding a championship belt, with a good record and an increasing fan base. Why move up in weight??
It looks ballsy on paper...but it's very, very dangerous for him unless he honestly feels his true home is at middleweight. I don't think many people here regard him as being that large or capable at 160, but the man must feel he is....point being: is this a subtle statement that Paul Williams is a middleweight who, all credit to him, has managed to drain, dehydrate, starve and overall shed a bare minimum of 13 pounds before each fight?
Hmm..Comment
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Yeh would be good. I favour Pavlik strongly out of all the domestic fights the teams been trying to get and are in the pipeline, and that kind of underlines the point that it does seem like Arums chasing the money, less risk, and supposed names. Pavliks not saying much otherwise, he says he'll fight anyone but sorry it's just a cliche. He's a boxer that's not man enough to raise the names of the belt holders in and around his division like Abraham and Kessler, and show any drive for wanting to prove himself against this top guys, so it's a contradiction.
Abraham does have a decent name, and if I'm honest, did a better job of endearing himself to the American public and building his name than Calzaghe did, only partially because of the performance, a lot outside of it. Kessler is well regarded and recieves SOME decent coverage in the USA, admittedly not enough but that's not his fault. So for me they are fairly big names now favoured well against the elites, and it is a double standard those guys are somewhat being ducked, at least far more than Calzaghe supposedly ducked Kelly.
Calzaghe and Roy fighting doesn't really effect Kessler or AA, Joe nor Roy were ever going to fight either of them, and Pavlik's not interested, he's teams not remotely responding to the call outs, or looking at those guys soonish as is wanted.Comment
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you beat me to it. i totally agree. if he wins (which he should) then people will criticize him for beating a fattened up welterweight and say he "ducked" this guy and that guy. and if he loses (which i really doubt) then not only does he lose his title, but he would be losing to a fattened up welterweight.
also, this is probably a bad move for williams. moving up 2 weight classes to fight the best middleweight in the world after never fighting above welter??? spells trouble.Comment
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Dude Abraham and Kessler are champs themselves. So what's to say they should chase the fights any more than Pavlik? It's 50-50, if you want to be judged well as a boxer than face the top guys, it's a mutual thing.
Now, it's become more like 80-20 AA and Kessler talking of wanting to fight Pavlik which is more than enough, much more there'd be called ******* for letting Pavlik run circles round them, them drop belts, fights, travel to the US more, just on the wing and a hope of Pavlik saying yes ok then.
They would be willing to take less money and negotiate around different fights hence speaking openly of wanting to fight Pavlik soon. But jeez there's limits lol, they're men ffs, and professional sportsmen, not slave girls in Africa. The blame is clearly on Pavlik, saying otherwise is a clear mis representation of the facts.Comment
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Weird ass fight. Pavlik should dominate.Comment
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I guess.... lol.. Pavlik sometimes just seems like he's riding the wave of this NEW SUPER STARDOM! I've seen some interviews and its like he doesn't really care who he's in the ring with as long as he gets paid. He talks like he just enjoys fighting and doesn't care who or when it is.... but that's just me.Comment
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Totally agree yah, I've complimented him on this before and do so. But a more careful look at the facts and his behaviour, there's some contradictions there. A lot of fighters say they're willing to fight anyone it's a cliché, doing it is another thing, and he's not. He's not even openly talking about them, and theyre the guys a top guy should be chasing in return, the other top guys, he's hardly mentioning them or returning call outs with any words at all. He's a bit of a Bob Arum puppet really which is a little weak unfortunately. I'll quite happily take that criticism allbeit to a lesser extent, or Joe on Warren.Comment
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When you're fighting at your opponents weight, chances are you're going to get hurt no matter how big you are. Chirs Byrd can take shots from a heavyweight but when he moved down to LHW, he got one of the worst beatings of his career. Same thing with Diego Corrales. He was 5'11 and as big as he was, you expected him to walk through his opponents, but no he gets punished badly by guy's who are much smaller then him, why? Because he was fighting at his opponents weight. Pavlik would lose to Cotto too if he tried draining himself to 147. I'm not saying Williams is going to win, but he does have a chance.Last edited by Boxingwizard; 07-11-2008, 04:29 PM.Comment
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