Joe beats Pavlik, and Manny beats Diaz. Which win would be more impressive?

[Jim Jeffries]

pavlik is the champion at 160 and he's not washed up. believe me it's a better win that a 41 yr. old hopkins. kessler is a good win too and even he is a better win than hopkins.

hopkins has the name but he's 41 yrs. old! was rocky marciano's biggest win joe louis? he was even younger than hopkins and he was coming off numerous wins. no. because history judged that louis was past prime. they will do the same with hopkins that's why joe needs a win against a younger guy who will keep on winning after joe retires to cement his legacy.

if joe can beat a pavlik and pavlik regains the 160 belt or become 168 champ after joe retires. that's a bigger win for joe's legacy.

The difference between Hopkins and Louis was that Hopkins was a top 5 p4p coming off back to back wins over top 10 p4p fighters. Louis only had some wins over some mediocre fighter since losing to Ezzard Charles and by all acounts Jersey Joe Walcott. Even the two losses Hopkins had had in the previous 15 years or so were highly controversial against a top fighter.

[Left Hook Tua]

The difference between Hopkins and Louis was that Hopkins was a top 5 p4p coming off back to back wins over top 10 p4p fighters. Louis only had some wins over some mediocre fighter since losing to Ezzard Charles and by all acounts Jersey Joe Walcott. Even the two losses Hopkins had had in the previous 15 years or so were highly controversial against a top fighter.

true. maybe it's because i don't rate hopkins highly. i didn't have him on my top 10p4p. i had joe at the bottom end of my p4p and just moved him up to #3 because he took the lineal 175 belt. tarver is nothing to me. i love winky but he's disappeared recently.

a 41 yr. old hopkins should not be his greatest win! the fact that it is says it all for me. it has nothing to do with european vs. american. or fight in america. joe's resume is good but not great. the fact he is undefeated improves his standing not his record. people complained about floyd's record. floyd's record before he jumped to 140 is tougher than joe's!