Who Should Calzaghe Have Beat?

[~Lucky13~]

you yanks talk about democracy and all I'm getting a heat for expressing my opinion!
some of you posters need to show a little more class!

[Tuggers1986]

you yanks talk about democracy and all I'm getting a heat for expressing my opinion!
some of you posters need to show a little more class!

Yeah but you're saying Calzaghe is a top 10 all time great!! If it wasn't such an idiotic statement then your opinion wouldn't get slated as much.

[abadger]

And heres 20 boxers not in order who are all higher than Calzaghe in ATG's list.

Willie Pep
Sugar Ray Robinson
Julio Cesar Chavez
Joe Louis
Jimmy Wilde
Henry Armstrong
Benny Leonard
Jack Johnson
Joe Gans
Archie Moore
Micky Walker
Harry Greb
Ezzard Charles
Sugar Ray Leonard
Archie Moore
Eder Jofre
Stanley Ketchel
Pernell Whitaker
Roy Jones Jr
Jack Dempsey

And that was just off the top of my head theres at least another 10 who have a case as well.

Ruben Olivares
Alexis Arguello
Bob Fitzsimmons
Floyd Mayweather Jr
Gene Tunney
Sandy Saddler
George Foreman
Marvin Hagler
Carlos Monzon
Thomas Hearns

I have no problem with any of what you are saying. You can name a large number of boxers better than Floyd Mayweather in ATG lists and it doesn't alarm me that you have so many names ahead of Joe at all. That's the way it is with ATG!

I'm not suggesting for a moment that Calzaghe is the best in the MW - LHW range of all time, though some think, as I said that he is the best SMW ever ( a short lived division I know), though I'm not sure I agree.

The only meaningful way to discuss Calzaghe for my money is to talk about what he himself has done in his career, relative to his immedfiate peers. There are so many posts deriding him as protected and a fraud, and saying he's nowhere near even the level of Hopkins, Jones and Toney, that I felt the need to ask, really, what it is that the current SMW and LHW champion needs to have done to be considered as a modern day elite. In a way its a rhetorical question because as far as I can see the consensus opinion is that Joe is one of the best of the recent era, but there seem to be an awful lot of posters who do not subscribe to this view, and I am just trying to get to the bottom of it, I suppose.

[RichCCFC]

I used to argue my case but when you're argueing with idiots 24/7 you are brought down to their level.

[Burning Desire]

I have no problem with any of what you are saying. You can name a large number of boxers better than Floyd Mayweather in ATG lists and it doesn't alarm me that you have so many names ahead of Joe at all. That's the way it is with ATG!

I'm not suggesting for a moment that Calzaghe is the best in the MW - LHW range of all time, though some think, as I said that he is the best SMW ever ( a short lived division I know), though I'm not sure I agree.

The only meaningful way to discuss Calzaghe for my money is to talk about what he himself has done in his career, relative to his immedfiate peers. There are so many posts deriding him as protected and a fraud, and saying he's nowhere near even the level of Hopkins, Jones and Toney, that I felt the need to ask, really, what it is that the current SMW and LHW champion needs to have done to be considered as a modern day elite. In a way its a rhetorical question because as far as I can see the consensus opinion is that Joe is one of the best of the recent era, but there seem to be an awful lot of posters who do not subscribe to this view, and I am just trying to get to the bottom of it, I suppose.

Oh no doubt Calzaghe is a great fighter and the best Super Middleweight ever, but i still think he is overrated by a lot of people plus he is only the best Super Middleweight because like some people have said before because the division has no real history behind it. And even some of Calzaghe's best wins like Brewer, Eubank, Hopkins, Woodhall, etc. Were not at there peak im not saying thats Calzaghe's fault but thats just the way it is. I personally think Calzaghe should have moved up years ago to LHW and chased the big fights, Calzaghe always said he was tight at the weight so he should have moved up IMO. Calzaghe is one of the greats of the modern era and one of the best British fighters of all time only behind Jimmy Wilde IMO. But i think he should of chased big fights more, a lot of people have said he was avoided by many but i never see Calzaghe ever really force the big fights IMO.

[MANGLER]

He's still the best 168 Lber the division's ever had, but no one could question him if he'd beaten Toney and RJ.

[S.G.]

Glen Johnson, Bernard Hopkins a few years earlier and Antonio Tarver

[abadger]

Glen Johnson, Bernard Hopkins a few years earlier and Antonio Tarver

I agree that these three are the ones he actually could have fought and that beating them would improve his resume, good list.

[Guest]

Alarmingly, that is the best post in the thread so far $in. I can agree with you that it would be nice to have seen him try to unify the title before that, but I would imagine there were two sides to that story, as I'm sure very few of the titleholders would have fancied losing their straps to Calzaghe. Also, who during that time, realistically, would Calzaghe not have beaten? I'm not an expert on the global SMW scene during the 90s by any means so I'd love to hear more about what were and were not the best fights out there.

As for moving up to 175, I can't agree with that. Again, it might have been nice but Joe was a natural SMW and I think the notion that he SHOULD have moved up to a higher weightclass is a little disingenuous. I do see what you're saying though, the name boxers were a division above him.

Truly great fighters move up at least one weight class and dominate. That is why Calzaghe nor Hatton can be considered greats. They couldn't handle moving up just one division because the divisions they dominate are the weakest in all of boxing...

[abadger]

Truly great fighters move up at least one weight class and dominate. That is why Calzaghe nor Hatton can be considered greats. They couldn't handle moving up just one division because the divisions they dominate are the weakest in all of boxing...

So what, honestly, is your assesment of Calzaghe, if you had to put it into a sentence?