Whos a better fighter overall? Hopkins or Toney

[Xplosivo]

Nunn beats Bernard, too. And the fact remains that his two biggest wins came over guys who were much smaller. Old or not, Holyfield was a HEAVYWEIGHT. That was more of the message I'm sending with that one. He fought guys who were not only his size, but much bigger than him, too. Bernard Hopkins struggled with elite guys who were truly his size. The best he's done in that respect was Antonio Tarver.

No ****...Someone should force Hopkins to face Samuel Peter...hahaha one punch at the back of Hopkins head

[warp1432]

Segundo Mercado and Allan and Echols and Holmes gave Hopkins tons of trouble, even a Bo James gave Hopkins a lot of trouble. Play the waiting game and Toney will out play you. Hit with power and Toney will hit with power too. Toney was just the better fighter and it was a plus that he was more exciting then Hopkins.

Allen and Echols did not give Bernard Hopkins trouble. If you mean trouble with being thrown on the canvas and his shoulder being ****ed up and Lane pulling on Hopkins then making it a NC, then yeah.

Holmes didn't give Hopkins trouble either. He lost a huge uniamous decision.

[supermandathoe]

Anyone disagree with me? Toney's skill amalgamated with Hops' dedicaton= p4p top 10 ever.

[ferocity]

To be fair to Hopkins he did beat some top contenders that were suppsedly able to beat Hopkins and he beat them. But, not saying they were great contenders. Just saying Hopkins had great success at Middlweight with what was there for him.

I can remember lot of people wanted Hopkins to lose but Hopkins keep winning, he's a fighter that did it his way and one of the best thing he could have done for his career is join Golden Boy Promotions.

I think, Hopkins should have had no trouble with Taylor if he was that great but i felt Hopkins held back in those fights or Taylor forced him to hold back. Had Hopkin not lost to Taylor i think his greatness could have really had a strong point with that win since Taylor was an Olympian. As it was he lost.

Having seen a Monzon fight, i don't think Hopkins gets past Monzon who was big for his weight and very techniqlly skilled, i don't think Hopins would get knocked out either.

I think Hopkins is a great fighter, maybe not as great as many give him credit for but a great fighter none the less.

I think he wasn't liked more times then none because of the way he fought. He always seemed too cautious and made for ugly fights. But yeah, you have to really rewatch Hopkins to see what he did inside the ring or else you'd think Hopkins has no game plan and is just and ugly style of boxing to watch as i used to think. Though not always as i said he was too cautious but when he wasn't he looked great. But maybe without being caustious he wouldn't have held his title as long as he did.

Hopkins biggest win is Trinidad? Then Tarver? Never seen the second Mercado fight but his win over him the second time around should get good credit for as he was clearly out boxed and fought the first time around with Mercado. The Allan fights don't know much only seen one fight of there trillogy. At the time i thought Allan was winning but the fight was not half way even. I think one of Hopkins toughest fight was the Holmes fight maybe mentally or physiclly cause Hopkins resorted to his dirtyness to win this fight. And of course Echols fight the first one was very close fight one that Hopkins almost lost, only seen parts of it, but do recall some people feeling that Hopkins lost that fight. But over all Hopkins should defently be contemp with how his career went.

[warp1432]

Nunn beats Bernard, too. And the fact remains that his two biggest wins came over guys who were much smaller. Old or not, Holyfield was a HEAVYWEIGHT. That was more of the message I'm sending with that one. He fought guys who were not only his size, but much bigger than him, too. Bernard Hopkins struggled with elite guys who were truly his size. The best he's done in that respect was Antonio Tarver.

Trinidad was not that much smaller then him. Trinidad fit perfectly in at Middleweight, even if his best wins were at smaller weights. De La Hoya is not his second best win anyway.

Toney has 2 wins and a draw over Mike MCcallum, but let's not even mention that he was his best at Jr.Middleweight.

Holyfield was a heavyweight, but that just shows that Toney has an INCREDIBLE chin. Antonio Margarito has an incredible chin and could probably take punches from Kelly Pavlik, but that does not make him a better Welterweight then Sugar Ray Lenoard.

Bernard Hopkins is a better Middleweight then James Toney and he has a better resume.

edit: If Echols gave Bernard so much problems, he would have beat him easily in the rematch since Bernard had a very bad shoulder when he was flipped over.

[K-Nan]

Trinidad was not that much smaller then him. Trinidad fit perfectly in at Middleweight, even if his best wins were at smaller weights. De La Hoya is not his second best win anyway.

Toney has 2 wins and a draw over Mike MCcallum, but let's not even mention that he was his best at Jr.Middleweight.

Holyfield was a heavyweight, but that just shows that Toney has an INCREDIBLE chin. Antonio Margarito has an incredible chin and could probably take punches from Kelly Pavlik, but that does not make him a better Welterweight then Sugar Ray Lenoard.

Bernard Hopkins is a better Middleweight then James Toney and he has a better resume.

Toney didn't beat those Heavyweights with his chin. He beat them with skill. He didn't beat Jirov or Barkley or Nunn with chin alone. Margarito could not take punches from Kelly Pavlik... comparing Antonio Margarito to James Toney is just about the most polar opposite comparison you could think of. Toney was not some guy who relied on his ability to take punches... it was actually the opposite. Margarito is the one who takes punches.

[Jim Jeffries]

Toney didn't beat those Heavyweights with his chin. He beat them with skill. He didn't beat Jirov or Barkley or Nunn with chin alone. Margarito could not take punches from Kelly Pavlik... comparing Antonio Margarito to James Toney is just about the most polar opposite comparison you could think of. Toney was not some guy who relied on his ability to take punches... it was actually the opposite. Margarito is the one who takes punches.

I agree, Toney has a great chin, but it's his ability to slip punches that is much more impressive. And no, Margarito is not standing up to 12 rounds of punches from Pavlik.

[K-Nan]

I agree, Toney has a great chin, but it's his ability to slip punches that is much more impressive. And no, Margarito is not standing up to 12 rounds of punches from Pavlik.

Definitely. I don't even see how a Margarito-Toney comparison is valid.

[warp1432]

Toney didn't beat those Heavyweights with his chin. He beat them with skill. He didn't beat Jirov or Barkley or Nunn with chin alone. Margarito could not take punches from Kelly Pavlik... comparing Antonio Margarito to James Toney is just about the most polar opposite comparison you could think of. Toney was not some guy who relied on his ability to take punches... it was actually the opposite. Margarito is the one who takes punches.

No doubt about that, but Evander Holyfield was way past his prime. It was his only good win at Heavyweight, but even then. I know he didn't beat them with chin alone, I love watching Toney, but he was not better then Bernard Hopkins.

This is a pretty even match up and this fight is close as hell (maybe a draw. I see Toney giving Bernard a hell of a time), but who's the better fighter overall, goes to Bernard Hopkins.

edit: Also I overexagrated the Margarito chin thing.

[!! Shawn]

I think people are insane to vote for James Toney.

This is an honest question. Do you have some sort of mental handicap?