Brian Vera Wrecks Andy Lee’s American Showcase

[jbin333]

Oh Manny!!!

I've heard so much about this kid Andy Lee,and how he is the next big thing to hit the middleweight division. I was just flipping the channels and landed on espn's showing of this Vera/Lee fight. As I stopped to watch it the 1st thing that came to mind was, "this Is Andy Lee?, what a joke!" To hear Manny talk about this kid the way he does, I really have to start asking myself if Manny is starting to lose it in his old age. Lee is very much like another so called next big thing John Duddy, I'm not impressed with either of these guys. Jermain Taylor would wipe the floor with these guys, Pavlik would probably send them both to the hospital, and Miranda would send thm eto the morgue. I'm just glad thses clowns are being exposed before they get undeserved title shots!

[pesticid]

Emmanuel's argument is that since Lee has had an extensive amateur career and the best of sparring he's ready for the big stage. There's a big difference b/w amateurs and professionals, and even a bigger difference b/w sparring and fighting. But we should just keep listening to Manny talk, maybe we could learn smth.

[Famoso Matador]

That would make it like the seventh year of the upset in the last eight years. Maybe it just means no one really knows ****.

you may be on to something
boxing outcomes are very hard to predict

[Chase8400]

Lee exposed?

I do believe that the hype about Andy Lee was way beyond him at this piont, but nobody can argue that this was a pitiful stoppage. I think his fundamentals are mostly good, but he needs to mate a good defense with that offense and wear his oponents out with some body work before going for the KO. Steward has a point in saying that he could be great, but should have kept that to himself until his resolve was tested fully. The fact that the ref didnt let the fight continue was sickening and I hope he never gets involved in a top tier fight ever again. There is one thing to stop a fight when somebody is hurt, but to stop it while both men are trading punches is pathetic. Lee got hit by that single right hand and fired right back and acually looked like he hurt Vera, then the ref jumps in and stopped it. There was more reason to stop it about 30 seconds earlier when Lee was getting hit in the back of the head while ducking than the point where the ref jumped in. Its a shame that Lee had to lose his dignity and undefeated record because of this. In no way am i suggesting that he still would have won the fight, but at least he would have been given a chance. What would have happened if the ref didnt let Marquez-Vasquez fight til the end of their last fight or if the ref would have stopped the Gatti-Ward fights? It makes no difference that these two fighters are a little less known. Every fighter deserves his time to come back from adversity and I think that Lee was robbed of that possible glory. An immediate rematch is needed and I am sure Manny Steward will get it done. I doubt that Vera will get the same results, even though I was happy to see him do better than getting starched in the 1st or 2nd round, like I though would happen.

[EDD1]

I may be wrong but it seems to me that a lot of fighters hwo do well on their own then seek out Emanuel Stewart and then they have bad showings. If someone outhere knows steearts stable you kind of see these moment where he is begging them in the corner to fight or trying to instruct then after he has lost them. Im not saing he is a bad trainer because I know he had done some wonderful things for fighters and he cares about them greatly, but I think fighters think he can make them better and somewhere along the way he seems to change them too much. I may be wrong but on more than one occation I have seen fighters that he trains show up out of shape and or nonresponsive to his instructions on the stool.
other than that I like the thread that said "no one knows ****"lol

[edgarg]

Andy Lee is def. still a prospect, but only about as much as Brian Vera is, I think the only thing that made this such a huge upset and andy lee such a huge favorite is the way Emanual Stewart hyped him up, wich this fight proves isnt always a good thing. Sometimes you just gotta let the guys performance in the ring do the talking.

This letter above is correct in all details. I can only add that it was obvious the Manny Steward wastrying to make him into another Tommy Hearns. The style, movement, hands psition (except for his rt. being somewhat too low) the way of poking out the left, and manouevering around etc. His left was not nearly sharp enough, nor was his right thrown either fast not straight enough, the way Tommy did it. Yest he was able to take much punishment, and we have to ask just how good is his chin. vera has only about a 50% KO record, and yet his punches were thrown with full force, although the roundabout route took some steam from them.

I believe the ref was absolutely correct in stopping it. in fact I was saying that it should have been stopped about the 2nd punch after his legs were buckled. that's about 6 punches before it actually WAS stopped. They gave us a great fight, Vera showed great soaking-up power, and maybe not enough of his own, whilst Andy Lee showed us he still needs to learn to punch in combinations. I don't see what Manny S. sees but HE'S in the business, and I'm not and maybe his eyesight is better. Or maybe it's the usual hype for-in this case- an attractive, fairly good prospect.

[Chase8400]

This letter above is correct in all details. I can only add that it was obvious the Manny Steward wastrying to make him into another Tommy Hearns. The style, movement, hands psition (except for his rt. being somewhat too low) the way of poking out the left, and manouevering around etc. His left was not nearly sharp enough, nor was his right thrown either fast not straight enough, the way Tommy did it. Yest he was able to take much punishment, and we have to ask just how good is his chin. vera has only about a 50% KO record, and yet his punches were thrown with full force, although the roundabout route took some steam from them.

I believe the ref was absolutely correct in stopping it. in fact I was saying that it should have been stopped about the 2nd punch after his legs were buckled. that's about 6 punches before it actually WAS stopped. They gave us a great fight, Vera showed great soaking-up power, and maybe not enough of his own, whilst Andy Lee showed us he still needs to learn to punch in combinations. I don't see what Manny S. sees but HE'S in the business, and I'm not and maybe his eyesight is better. Or maybe it's the usual hype for-in this case- an attractive, fairly good prospect.

You lost all your credibility when you said it was a good stoppage. You need to comment on a different sports board and leave boxing to people with some sense. Maybe you can make sense in the MMA threads.

[KOKEVIN]

Has anyone heard or read any post fight quotes from Lee or Steward? I can't imagine both of them being ok by the stoppage as was mentioned by one of the commentators.

[daz147]

He is in no way ready for Winky or Pavlik by the end of this year. He wouldn't be the same person after Kelly by the way he absorbed so many clean rights from Vera. Is it me or does Emmanuel seem not so legendary as a trainer?

[edgarg]

You lost all your credibility when you said it was a good stoppage. You need to comment on a different sports board and leave boxing to people with some sense. Maybe you can make sense in the MMA threads.

It's actually a very big PLUS for me when YOU impugn my credibility. I wasn't even aware of you, so I hesitate to say ANYTHING about YOUR credibility. You're welcome to say anything you like about me. I know where it's coming from anyway. Perhaps, when you grow up, and learn something about boxing-better still- join a club and get into the ring yourself- THEN, perhaps, you'll MAKE sense, and be listened to, or GET sense and don't talk about what you don't understand.

As for the stoppage, (and I'm not talking to you at all, now) it was a GOOD stoppage, the ref was hesitating on the verge for several punches before he did. I was expecting ...NOW...after each punch, then...NOW ....again, but it took him that last dead-straight-on-the- kisser (added to the previous ones for him to dive in. Andy was running on fumes since that punch which buckled his legs. he could have been irrevocably injured. (that means "for life" in case you don't know). His return punch was purly reflexive and had nothing on it at all.

And, for your information, I've almost certainly forgotten more about boxing than you'll ever even be "exposed to", let alone learn. I merely mention it, since you feel qualified to criticize my expertise, so that you can feel superior to someone who actually DOES know boxing. You need encouragement anyway.

Maybe you're an expert pretending to be an ignoramus?? You're doing a good job of it.