I don't see how Pavlik is undefeated. All he throws are basic 1-2's

[danny stash]

H.e.a.r.t.

[Silencers]

He's undefeated because he is relentless, I know he can be crude and predictable at times but he never stops doing what he's doing until it works for him, his power helps too and he has good heart and stamina, his arsenal is limited but he uses what he got very well.

[FIGHTING_FLIP]

cuz he hits ****ing hard.

[-Antonio-]

He hooks off the jab well too, but he does like to stick with the 1-2's you're right. I was waiting for him to throw a looping right against Jermain and it never came. He is excellent at finishing guys though once they are hurt. That's when he really mixes up his punches well.

[TheGreatA]

co-signed, except for the Monzon part. I am not a Monzon fan and don't get the big deal. He is one of the most overrated boxers of all-time. I think pavlik has already defeated tougher competition comparatively in Taylor. I don't think Monzon has ever beaten a fighter as good as Taylor in his entire career even for his time.

Monzon, one of the most overrated of all time???!!! Where in the hell did you get the idea that he is overrated? Have you seen many of his fights?

Monzon was one hell of a fighter and is often underrated. Everything he did, he did perfectly and without any fuss. He had great basic technique with good speed, fantastic leverage, great chin, very, very good defense which came about from being quite unorthodox and awkward and all this came behind a killer jab and incredible right hand that was difficult to catch. His jab set up everything in his fights and it being so long and actually very hard won him most of his fights.

Monzon beat so many fighters better than Taylor that what you're trying to say is simply laughable! If you had actually studied some of the fighters he beat or seen them fight you might know that. Taylor was just KO'd and then beaten on points by a poor mans version of Monzon who really didn't actually have half the good qualities of Monzon. Monzon would have destroyed Taylor.

Have you even seen any of these guys fight? Rodrigo Valdez x 2, Tony Mundine, Jose Angel Napoles, Tony Licata, Emile Griffith x 2, Nino Benvenuti x 2, or what about the baddest of all 'Philly' fighters Bennie Briscoe?

To say the guys above don't equal an incredible list of fighters would be one of the most daft things ever said on this forum! Every one of them are HOF type fighters! Valdez was the unheralded middleweight who without Monzon in the picture would have dominated and been considered as a worthy holder of Monzons place. He was easily one of the best ever fighters out of Columbia. Maybe the best.

Everyone knows the Griffith story so I won't have to go into that despite saying he fought more title fight rounds than any other fighter in history!

Napoles? Considered by many to be the greatest welter after Ray Robinson. Tony Mundine is considered as one of the best ever Australian middleweights. Nino Benvenuti? Without a doubt the greatest ever fighter from Italy.

Overrated? Gimme a break!!! Learn what you're talking about first!

The truth.

Carlos Monzon had wins over Nino Benvenuti (82-4, 3-time world champion), Emile Griffith (70-11, 5-time world champion), Jose Napoles (75-5, 3-time world champion) and Rodrigo Valdez (57-4, 2-time world champion).
All of those fighters are better than Jermain Taylor.

Monzon fought anyone, anywhere, anytime. He always fought solid opposition (contenders like Briscoe, Licata, Mundine, Bouttier) and beat all of them in their own home countries.
Also count in the fact that he was not beaten for 13 years, Monzon only lost in his early 20's.


Monzon KO's Benvenuti


Monzon vs Napoles

[Welter_Skelter]

All this guy does is plod forward like Frankenstein with concrete boots on and throws the left jab then right hand. 1-2's all day. How in the world this club fighter is undefeated is beyond me. He should have a loss on his record since he was thoroughly outboxed by Jermain in the rematch. Anyways, once this guys steps up against the likes of Jones, Kessler, Calzaghe, Wright, Abraham, Hopkins, etc. he will be badly exposed. You heard it here first.

This post shows just how little you understand the sport of boxing..

[Mickey Gomez]

he has a 0 in the loss column. if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Many men have fallen victim to this horrendous cliche. So far what Pavlik has done has worked for him, however to be a world class fighter you have to adapt and augment your style to fit every opponent. It's no good saying "I beat Taylor using this method so therefore I'll beat Kessler or Calzaghe or whoever".

Every fight is different. For example Ricky Hatton vs Floyd Mayweather (I don't like using this analogy because the fight is mentioned to often but it's the one that springs to mind) Ricky trained with Billy the preacher Graham. He said he trained in the same way as he did for his other 43 fights. One the main aspects of his training was the "body bag", chasing a chain smoking Billy Graham around the ring hitting a black sumo outfit the size out Butterbean is hardly ideal when trying to mimic one of the slickest fastest defensive fighters in the world. But the method had worked for him countless times before. When questioned on it, Hatton's words were "if it's not broke don't fix it".

That cliche should be erased from the English language. Possibly to be replaced with something slightly less catchy like... "if it has worked before there's no guarantee it will work again, we need to prepare for each fight as if we've never fought before because each fight brings a new fighter, we need to find out what areas need improvement adjustment and tweaking, then we can fix them".

[revs1227]

pavlik will break abrahams jaw alot worse then edison did //....i agree kessler and joe could prolly beat him but maybe winky 2 but cmon those are the elite thats like sayin ..hatton sucks he moved up n lost 2 mayweather teh best n the world ...cmon

[BennyST]

The truth.

Carlos Monzon had wins over Nino Benvenuti (82-4, 3-time world champion), Emile Griffith (70-11, 5-time world champion), Jose Napoles (75-5, 3-time world champion) and Rodrigo Valdez (57-4, 2-time world champion).
All of those fighters are better than Jermain Taylor.

Monzon fought anyone, anywhere, anytime. He always fought solid opposition (contenders like Briscoe, Licata, Mundine, Bouttier) and beat all of them in their own home countries.
Also count in the fact that he was not beaten for 13 years, Monzon only lost in his early 20's.

Right on. I can't believe I actually read that. I can't believe some of the things that come out of people's keyboards on this forum!

"I don't think Monzon has ever beaten a fighter as good as Taylor in his career, even for his time". Now, this has to be one of the most moronic (Kswizzy: sorry mate, but it is) statements I've seen recently here. Before that it was this one: "I think Pavlik has defeated tougher competition comparatively..."

Taylor is a one dimensional fighter with terrible defense. He is athletic and fast, but, apart from that he fights much the same way and just comes forward and straight back. Every one of those fighters listed by Manchine would have beaten Taylor and Pavlik as well. Griffith, Benvenuti, Napoles and Valdez certainly would have and I'd give more than a good chance for the other guys to as well.

A guy like Monzon has his reputation and record for a reason Kswizzy. Maybe it's about time you went and had a proper look at why that is so. While you're at it try having a good look at as many fights of his as you can get and you might realise why he was unbeaten over the last 81 fights (13 years, 15 title fights with 14 title defenses) of his career which had some amazing opposition! We're not talking just amazing for the time either, we're talking all time amazing!

Where the hell has Kswizzy gone anyway? No reply? I can dig you saying you don't like Monzon and even that you think he is overrated but those quotes are simply daft and must be explained!

[deuce_drop]

consistency, will, work rate, chin, pressure, stamina, and sticking to a well thought out game plan......