How do Americans rate Mundine?

[mgkirkpatrick]

He’s an impressive fighter and people who disagree either haven’t seen him or are offended by him and his ignorant comments (and rap videos). He’s slick, the guy is just so damned hard to hit, packs a good punch and is easily the best athlete between 154 -205.

He just needs to show more output. You’re not gonna win rounds against the big boys when you throw **** all round after round. The name of the game is to HIT and not be hit.

(i used to talk **** about him in threads until i download like 16 of his fights,impressed me a lot)

i like this post.

ultimate boxa you've got to realise that blind nuthugging is just as bad as blind hating.

ok well ive got respect for mundine's ability but i dont consider myself a big fan boy. ive seen a fair bit of mundine and i think im qualified to give an opinion.

this post will probably be pretty long so unless you actually want to talk boxing dont bother reading it.



these are my opinions on mundine and im happy to talk them out with n e one who wants..

someone said mundine would have learned to box from his dad who was a prominent aussie boxer.. well that's great but it doesnt in any way make up for an amateur career does it? starting boxing in you mid 20s etc

so mundine has grown up with boxing but that doesnt replace experience

mundine doesnt have an iron chin.. i dont think the ottke fight is a good example of this.. that was a good temple shot on a guy who had no kind of fighting fitness.. what does scare me about mundine's chin is being dropped by siaca and nishizawa (sp).. on the other hand he has taken shots from kessler green and echols.. some of the bigger punchers in the division

my conclusion. mundine has an average chin.

as for speed. mundine is the fastest man at SMW. i know alot of people think differently and start to talk about combinations and that but at the end of the day the fact that he doesnt throw punches in bunches doesnt change the fact that he is the quickest man in the division. (IMO obviously)

as to mundine's wins and place in the smw rankings.. i think he is at three. kessler has beaten him already. he did have a back injury. i highly doubt he was at '60%' as alot of people claim. but he did beat him. at the same time mundine is probably the only guy to take rounds off him and has definitely made greater improvements since.

i think calzaghe is a much harder match up for mundine. he's quicker than kessler and throws well in combinations. added to the mix mundine hasnt even fought a solid journeyman southpaw let alone one of calzags calibre.

so behind those two guys mundine is next.. his wins against green and soliman are decent regardless of where they come from. green i think was 4 on the ring's list of smws at the time. there can be alot of criticisms of green and you can say he was soundly beaten by beyer but lets not forget that green had beyer on the canvas twice and was beating him comfortably the first time before he was controversially disqualified. (you can watch him knock griffin out inside six rounds soon for further proof)

add to this the fact that mundine beat him 11 rounds to 1.. that is a good win by anyone's standards..

his win against soliman is also a credible victory. soliman was number 3 at the wba when they fought. he'd lost one of his past 21 fights and that was in a close decision against winky wright. mundine knocked him down 4 times in 9 rounds and arguably lost only one of those rounds..

once again a solid win no matter how you swing it.

as far as pure boxing ability goes mundine is a good fighter who plays to his strengths well. he has a lightning jab and a strong fast right cross. he throws the uppercut well and jabs to the body pretty nicely too. he doesnt fight with angles.. isnt really much of a body puncher and doesnt have much of a hook. this straight ahead punching is a reason why i think winky is a bad matchup for him.. his high gloves would take mundine's stock punches all night long.

defensively he is very good. he has amazing reflexes and moves well. on the other hand he doesnt like to get hit, which is usually a good thing but in this case not.. he has a tendancy to panic and go into a shell instead of being patient and counter punching when he is under a full blown attack.

if mundine went down to middleweight (which i dont think he comfortably can) he'd be a huge force. i think he'd have a very interesting fight with taylor and probably outjab him for the win.. i also think he'd be quick and elusive enough to beat pavlik from the outside.

mundine is in my opinion a world class boxer tho kessler and calzag are irrefutably the kings of his division. mundine with his head on right would get over the other main contenders (lacy, bute etc), and challenge almost n e one from middleweight to lhw.

[gigogreco]

i like this post.

someone said mundine would have learned to box from his dad who was a prominent aussie boxer.. well that's great but it doesnt in any way make up for an amateur career does it? starting boxing in you mid 20s etc

so mundine has grown up with boxing but that doesnt replace experience

that would be me that you refer to, but before trying to establish your views, it would suit you, to read the post again.. have i ever said it replaced an extensive amateur background, NO, but mundine has fought as a amateur.. if you train boxing from an early age and do alot of sparring, off course you gonna learn the trades of the sport.. the cause as to why i said it, was also stated in an earlier post, where i claimed mundines room for improvement isnt as big, as those fans claiming.. every bloody mundine fan thinks he has improved immensly.. i claim mediocre opponents was the cause for him looking good..

as to mundine's wins and place in the smw rankings.. i think he is at three. kessler has beaten him already. he did have a back injury. i highly doubt he was at '60%' as alot of people claim. but he did beat him. at the same time mundine is probably the only guy to take rounds off him and has definitely made greater improvements since.

again which greater improvements.???

his wins against green and soliman are decent regardless of where they come from. green i think was 4 on the ring's list of smws at the time. there can be alot of criticisms of green and you can say he was soundly beaten by beyer but lets not forget that green had beyer on the canvas twice and was beating him comfortably the first time before he was controversially disqualified. (you can watch him knock griffin out inside six rounds soon for further proof)

personally i valued his wins over soliman and green, in the region from average - good.. and thats realistic.. as pevious stated, from the aussie standpoint, its much much bigger, because its to guys from the same country, deciding whos the best, but world wide, its nothing special..

congratulations on green having beyer down but getting dq´ed, part of the game, GREENE GOT HIS REMATCH, BUT FAILED, failed against what many considered a rather protected fighter in beyer. beyer was an okay champ, but not great, and green wasnt able to win.. i couldnt care less about what the ring had green placed as, he had 2 chances against beyer, but couldnt capitalize

his win against soliman is also a credible victory. soliman was number 3 at the wba when they fought. he'd lost one of his past 21 fights and that was in a close decision against winky wright. mundine knocked him down 4 times in 9 rounds and arguably lost only one of those rounds..

once again a solid win no matter how you swing it.

now i gotta take a piss at you, he had allready beaten soliman once, then mundine improves, and beats him again.. again its nothing special.. soliman rated nr 3, but wasnt that at mw.. soliman is a natural 160, but as i remember has fought at 154 as well.. a smalller guy, that he allready beat once.. be realistic

as far as pure boxing ability goes mundine is a good fighter who plays to his strengths well. he has a lightning jab and a strong fast right cross. he throws the uppercut well and jabs to the body pretty nicely too. he doesnt fight with angles.. isnt really much of a body puncher and doesnt have much of a hook. this straight ahead punching is a reason why i think winky is a bad matchup for him.. his high gloves would take mundine's stock punches all night long.

defensively he is very good. he has amazing reflexes and moves well. on the other hand he doesnt like to get hit, which is usually a good thing but in this case not.. he has a tendancy to panic and go into a shell instead of being patient and counter punching when he is under a full blown attack.

if mundine went down to middleweight (which i dont think he comfortably can) he'd be a huge force. i think he'd have a very interesting fight with taylor and probably outjab him for the win.. i also think he'd be quick and elusive enough to beat pavlik from the outside.

mundine is in my opinion a world class boxer tho kessler and calzag are irrefutably the kings of his division. mundine with his head on right would get over the other main contenders (lacy, bute etc), and challenge almost n e one from middleweight to lhw.

ill agree you with this, mundine is a very good boxer and your assesment sounds about right.. but i have to question the fact if he is timid or afraid to get hit, this i base on, that he more then once held his hands low against kessler and invitited him to throw more, perhaps not a choice a scared and timid fighter would make..

he allready has his hands full at smw, so lhw isnt within his reach, the guys are to big and to strong..

[No1]

And why is that? The guy has made 50 million dollars from boxing already. He made about 1 million in league.

If you think hes a d fighter i would love to see a c. I think your confused. Download a few of his fights, and watch him fight, im sure you haven't seen any footage of him at all. Then get back to me mate.

I dnt get how you can say he's made 50million whereas calzaghe as only made around 7-8 million and he's far better than mundine.
I hope calazaghe beats kessler then comes 2 kangaroo world and beats the **** out of mundine. How can you say mundines comming to his peak, he's about 32 or sumthing and if anyhting his limited skills are going downwards.
Also you keep talkin about soliman, last time i looked soliman had a load of loses on his record and you then compare mundine to winky wright, what a joke.
Get off his **** yeah because you only see it from your down under view and fail to see that he's an average fighter and no where near champion material.

[adamk1304]

Have you ever watched Mundine fight? Geese sometimes i think people haven't seen him at all and they comment and rubbish him, its a fair joke. Im presuming you haven't seen him fight if you think hes no where near as fast as Calzaghe. Hes a lot quicker than him.

I have seen him get dominated by an injured kessler, get knocked out by sven ottke, and knocked down and beaten by manny siaca. His best victory is over danny green, who is an average fighter at best.

[No1]

I have seen him get dominated by an injured kessler, get knocked out by sven ottke, and knocked down and beaten by manny siaca. His best victory is over danny green, who is an average fighter at best.

totally agree. Mundine at most is a contender in no way is he a champ.

[mgkirkpatrick]

that would be me that you refer to, but before trying to establish your views, it would suit you, to read the post again.. have i ever said it replaced an extensive amateur background, NO, but mundine has fought as a amateur.. if you train boxing from an early age and do alot of sparring, off course you gonna learn the trades of the sport.. the cause as to why i said it, was also stated in an earlier post, where i claimed mundines room for improvement isnt as big, as those fans claiming.. every bloody mundine fan thinks he has improved immensly.. i claim mediocre opponents was the cause for him looking good..

ive heard too common stories as to mundine's amateur experience. no fights.. and 3 as a young teen. you have to remember from his late teens to his mid 20s he was a professional football player and that's a lot of prime time spent completely devoid of any boxing.

i agree that having been brought up in his circumstances wouldnt have hurt but mundine was a national school boy rep in basketball, league, union and athletics.. he wasnt spending too much time at the gym.

again which greater improvements.???

in all seriousness at this point i have to ask which fights of his you've seen? just so i can get a grasp on where you are coming from?
there are many improvements. his stamina, workrate and defence come to mind immediately.

personally i valued his wins over soliman and green, in the region from average - good.. and thats realistic.. as pevious stated, from the aussie standpoint, its much much bigger, because its to guys from the same country, deciding whos the best, but world wide, its nothing special..

congratulations on green having beyer down but getting dq´ed, part of the game, GREENE GOT HIS REMATCH, BUT FAILED, failed against what many considered a rather protected fighter in beyer. beyer was an okay champ, but not great, and green wasnt able to win.. i couldnt care less about what the ring had green placed as, he had 2 chances against beyer, but couldnt capitalize

yeah soliman and green arent elite fighters you are completely correct. but they are still world class. yep green was robbed in his first fight against beyer but beyer improved in their second stoush .. came in the better fighter and beat him the second time round. so green couldnt quite get over marcus beyer.. but did pretty well against him..

mundine shut him out. mundine took all 12 rounds on most people's scorecards.. and you might discredit the ring magazine but not too many guys that are number four on their lists lose 12 rounds in a night.

now i gotta take a piss at you, he had allready beaten soliman once, then mundine improves, and beats him again.. again its nothing special.. soliman rated nr 3, but wasnt that at mw.. soliman is a natural 160, but as i remember has fought at 154 as well.. a smalller guy, that he allready beat once.. be realistic

and this is where i gotta 'take a piss at you'. you're sayin it wasnt an improvement because he had already beat soliman? when he fought soliman the first time solimans record was 12 and 6! and mundine won an extremely controversial split decision.

since that fight in 2001 sam soliman had gone 6 years with only one loss in 21 fights and that was against winky right in a close fight...

mundine then knocked soliman down and out without losing a round.. i think its safe to say that mundine has improved since the first fight as had soliman.

yes sam is a natural middleweight but he was ranked number three at smw by the wba that's why they were fighting for the vacant regular smw title.

ill agree you with this, mundine is a very good boxer and your assesment sounds about right.. but i have to question the fact if he is timid or afraid to get hit, this i base on, that he more then once held his hands low against kessler and invitited him to throw more, perhaps not a choice a scared and timid fighter would make..

yeah maybe i got my words wrong their.. he's not comfortable getting hit is more what i meant.. i think he also has a fair amount in his reflexes.. thus the hands down and showboating.

[mgkirkpatrick]

I dnt get how you can say he's made 50million whereas calzaghe as only made around 7-8 million and he's far better than mundine.
I hope calazaghe beats kessler then comes 2 kangaroo world and beats the **** out of mundine. How can you say mundines comming to his peak, he's about 32 or sumthing and if anyhting his limited skills are going downwards.
Also you keep talkin about soliman, last time i looked soliman had a load of loses on his record and you then compare mundine to winky wright, what a joke.
Get off his **** yeah because you only see it from your down under view and fail to see that he's an average fighter and no where near champion material.

yeah mundine definitely hasnt made 50 mil but he has made stacks. he has a big following here with most australians wanting to see him lose. he made 6.25 million for his fight against green alone.. he has a boxing label, a boxing promotions business and even a record label.. pretty wealthy guy.

yeah sam has some losses on his record. but 6 of the 8 were prior to 2001. in his last 22 fights he's lost 2.

a close decision to winky wright.. and he was knocked down, shutout and knocked out against mundine. that's why ultimate boxa is probably comparing the two.

although it's very much a styles make fights thing and NO ONE would suggest mundine is better than winky dont stress.

No1 you say his limited skills are going down but what do you base that on?

[gigogreco]

off course mundine is a multi talented athlete, with some gifts when it comes to sports, ive never said otherwise, but again my main point, is that so called room for the SUPREME improvemnet you mundine fans seem to belive he has, for me isnt there, at least it isnt that huge.. he has been very familiar with boxing, and trained it for years, perhaps used it as training for other sports as well.. my point is, if he allready trained, and had rather polished skills, he all of a sudden doesnt improve extraordinary..

ive seen kessler, soliman and green.. and thats the improvement-period im talking about.. and again his stamina, defence and work rate wasnt a problem agaisnt kessler..

it might be the case soliman was ranked 3, but thats just pissing in the face of all the quality fighters, who were and is miles ahead of soliman, that ranking is simply a joke..!!! i could from the top of my head name 10 fighters in smw that would beat the **** out if him.. even green ;-)

im not claiming that all ring rankings are ****ed, but a guy who gets 2 chances to beat beyer, and doesnt pull it of, he isnt nr 3 or 4, that should be common consensus..

shutting out any fighter is impressive mate, thats not what im saying.. green could be ranked 15 th and a shut out would still be good.. but green is ages away from his prime, hasnt beaten any note worthy opponent in a while, so again the fight and win is by me rated from average - good..

soliman is hardly a world beater, i dont know the exact record of soliman, but for all i know he could have fought bums, he is a guy most known for going the distance with winky, winning a couple of rounds.. piss all you want, mundine beat him once, did it again and all of a sudden this is extraordinary.. as said before the win ranks from average - good..

eventhough mundine has a fair amount of reflexes and is quick on his feet, a guy afraid of being hit, just doesnt stand infront of perhaps the strongest smw.. even if it was showboating..

[Dick-Sucker]

i like this post.

ultimate boxa you've got to realise that blind nuthugging is just as bad as blind hating.

ok well ive got respect for mundine's ability but i dont consider myself a big fan boy. ive seen a fair bit of mundine and i think im qualified to give an opinion.

this post will probably be pretty long so unless you actually want to talk boxing dont bother reading it.



these are my opinions on mundine and im happy to talk them out with n e one who wants..

someone said mundine would have learned to box from his dad who was a prominent aussie boxer.. well that's great but it doesnt in any way make up for an amateur career does it? starting boxing in you mid 20s etc

so mundine has grown up with boxing but that doesnt replace experience

mundine doesnt have an iron chin.. i dont think the ottke fight is a good example of this.. that was a good temple shot on a guy who had no kind of fighting fitness.. what does scare me about mundine's chin is being dropped by siaca and nishizawa (sp).. on the other hand he has taken shots from kessler green and echols.. some of the bigger punchers in the division

my conclusion. mundine has an average chin.

as for speed. mundine is the fastest man at SMW. i know alot of people think differently and start to talk about combinations and that but at the end of the day the fact that he doesnt throw punches in bunches doesnt change the fact that he is the quickest man in the division. (IMO obviously)

as to mundine's wins and place in the smw rankings.. i think he is at three. kessler has beaten him already. he did have a back injury. i highly doubt he was at '60%' as alot of people claim. but he did beat him. at the same time mundine is probably the only guy to take rounds off him and has definitely made greater improvements since.

i think calzaghe is a much harder match up for mundine. he's quicker than kessler and throws well in combinations. added to the mix mundine hasnt even fought a solid journeyman southpaw let alone one of calzags calibre.

so behind those two guys mundine is next.. his wins against green and soliman are decent regardless of where they come from. green i think was 4 on the ring's list of smws at the time. there can be alot of criticisms of green and you can say he was soundly beaten by beyer but lets not forget that green had beyer on the canvas twice and was beating him comfortably the first time before he was controversially disqualified. (you can watch him knock griffin out inside six rounds soon for further proof)

add to this the fact that mundine beat him 11 rounds to 1.. that is a good win by anyone's standards..

his win against soliman is also a credible victory. soliman was number 3 at the wba when they fought. he'd lost one of his past 21 fights and that was in a close decision against winky wright. mundine knocked him down 4 times in 9 rounds and arguably lost only one of those rounds..

once again a solid win no matter how you swing it.

as far as pure boxing ability goes mundine is a good fighter who plays to his strengths well. he has a lightning jab and a strong fast right cross. he throws the uppercut well and jabs to the body pretty nicely too. he doesnt fight with angles.. isnt really much of a body puncher and doesnt have much of a hook. this straight ahead punching is a reason why i think winky is a bad matchup for him.. his high gloves would take mundine's stock punches all night long.

defensively he is very good. he has amazing reflexes and moves well. on the other hand he doesnt like to get hit, which is usually a good thing but in this case not.. he has a tendancy to panic and go into a shell instead of being patient and counter punching when he is under a full blown attack.

if mundine went down to middleweight (which i dont think he comfortably can) he'd be a huge force. i think he'd have a very interesting fight with taylor and probably outjab him for the win.. i also think he'd be quick and elusive enough to beat pavlik from the outside.

mundine is in my opinion a world class boxer tho kessler and calzag are irrefutably the kings of his division. mundine with his head on right would get over the other main contenders (lacy, bute etc), and challenge almost n e one from middleweight to lhw.

Great Post, can not agree with this more.

[Dick-Sucker]

I dnt get how you can say he's made 50million whereas calzaghe as only made around 7-8 million and he's far better than mundine.
I hope calazaghe beats kessler then comes 2 kangaroo world and beats the **** out of mundine. How can you say mundines comming to his peak, he's about 32 or sumthing and if anyhting his limited skills are going downwards.
Also you keep talkin about soliman, last time i looked soliman had a load of loses on his record and you then compare mundine to winky wright, what a joke.
Get off his **** yeah because you only see it from your down under view and fail to see that he's an average fighter and no where near champion material.

On the 50 million, yeh he has made around that. Its because of his large PPV sales. They eclipse any other fighter we have had in Tzyu, Green, Briggs by a big margin.

Hes not an average fighter, he is a good fighter with talent. Not champion material? Maybe in SMW with kessler there, but if he moves down to middleweight he will be a champion for a while. Download a few of his tapes then get back to me.

P.S for all you boxing experts, i thought you would have been smarter with the Kessler injury thing. No boxer fights at 60%. Heck no boxer fights at 90%. That injury stuff is bullcrap, because one loss could spell the end of a boxers career. Boxers only fight at 100%. Don't believe that kessler crap, theres to much at stake and no boxer in the world fights injured they just say it when there was a close fight or to make there fight look better than it actually was.