Toney at Heavyweight - it was a nice dream though, wasn't it?

[Kid Achilles]

Toney was truly a small man, not a small heavyweight. He was not a Walcott or Dempsey or a Louis, or Marciano they were big men, natural heavyweights with fists just as big as Lennox Lewis's, who were shaved down in weight. Toney was a middleweight (not even a very big or cut middleweight) with middleweight fists, who ate his way into the heavyweight ranking because of the weakness of the division. His skills and toughness were enough to see him past what went for a decent contender in this era.

Toney at any point of his heavyweight run would not hang with Louis, Dempsey, or even a guy like Walcott. Guy just wasn't ever a heavyweight. Compare him to Mickey Walker, not Walcott.

[Guest]

People point to the age/eating as a factor in Toney's decline, but I do wonder just how much the punches have played a part?

The guy's spent the last few years getting hit (occasionally) harder than he ever has before. In my book he's gone from ISR 116-110 to 108-119 in the course of a bout. And that wasn't all down to Peter improving.

[BrooklynBomber]

People point to the age/eating as a factor in Toney's decline, but I do wonder just how much the punches have played a part?

The guy's spent the last few years getting hit (occasionally) harder than he ever has before. In my book he's gone from ISR 116-110 to 108-119 in the course of a bout. And that wasn't all down to Peter improving.

I really think that weight training played a big role in his demise. His agility and countering skills were much worse then the first fight. Obviously some of it came from suffering these blowws from PEter, but weight training did affect him.

[Brunswick Assassin]

Lights Out

As much as James 'Lights Out' Toney being one of my all-time favourite fighters, I found it to be quite offensive to Hall of Famer Trainer Freddie 'Road Dog' Roach that Toney made Billy Blanks the main man in his corner (that's the way I saw it Toney-Peter II). Holding his spit bucket and offering him advice between rounds. Isn't Billy Blanks a Tae-Bo instructor??? Toney was apparantly only sparring at Wildcard and was at Billy's Gym the rest of the time. Billy promised he'd bring Toney in perfect shape. Toney looked far from the 'Well-Oiled Machine' that was putting opponents away in 90's and the Jirov fight (my favourite fight). Toney would have been Heavyweight World Champion a long time ago if he kept his weight down to 205pds. Freddie told James the 'lighter the better'. I hope Lights Out makes a comeback even though the Batchelder fight might have been his last. I hope not! Has Toney or Goossen replied to these allegations???

[Don Johnson]

how come this *** hasn't been banned yet?

[Feint]

People point to the age/eating as a factor in Toney's decline, but I do wonder just how much the punches have played a part?

Good point. But I would still say that the age/eating factor did him in before anything else.

I liked Toney but let's face it, he should have never fought as a Heavyweight. Even trying to build up power by using steroids did not help him. (Again, I liked the guy a lot but let’s be realistic, you don't just somehow test positive twice and it not be true. It just doesn’t happen.)

[Don Johnson]

I think a true showcaes of just how bad this man really was was when he fought Iran Barkley. IDK how the **** he lost to Montell Griffin twice. He had his good nights in Middleweight but, damn was he great.