How could Hagler stay retired?

[Alan Smithee]

I was a big Hagler guy and attended his second fight against the tough brawler Mustafa Hamsho. I lost a nice chunk of change betting on him agaginst Sugar Ray. Marvin did seem disillusioned with the game after the Leonard loss but it was partially his fault. Hagler was so confident of victory that he acquiesced on the sizes of the ring and the gloves. Hagler was an all time great who won a 165 pound amateur title at 19 years old and fought at middleweight for his entire pro career. It takes training and dedication to achieve a feat like that!

[Alan Smithee]

My own opinion. hagler was not a fighter that left an opportunity in the ring to be second guessed... He was coming hard, come hell, or high water. He never had a reason to second guess his effort.

Compare that to floyd for example. Who fought in a manner which was risk adverse, and left people doubting certain fights, like the Castillo fignt.

Floyd has to tell anyone that will listen how good he was, to me this shows insecurity, the belief that maybe a few more risks coulda/shoulda been taken... For example, risks guaranteeing a really steller round against Pac...

Marvin never had that consideration, never really had to second guess his approach, primarily because of his style... I believe this made him secure enough to not need to wax and wane when it came time to quitting.

Marvin could never say "If I came a little bit harder, and more at Ray, the fight might really be different." The only difference to hagler was what the judges would say.

Great points. I also believe that Hagler lost some of the fire in the belly that the upper echelon of the sport demands. He was a training and conditioning beast who probably had just had enough. How many fighters are 160 at 18 years old and retire at the same weight at just shy of 33 years old?

[billeau2]

Great points. I also believe that Hagler lost some of the fire in the belly that the upper echelon of the sport demands. He was a training and conditioning beast who probably had just had enough. How many fighters are 160 at 18 years old and retire at the same weight at just shy of 33 years old?

Not many that I can think of aside from Hopkins! that is a great point. Green K. As Thomas Hobbes observed, we all have an inclination to prefer the beer, cheese burgers and dancing girls to hard work, discipline, etc.

[BattlingNelson]

Couldn't it have just been the smart move and he is smart man?

There is a prejudice; one expects a fighter to do the wrong thing, and when he doesn't there must be a reason.

Yep. That's why I asked.

For decades we have watched fighters spend themselves broke; so when Tommy Hearns managed his money well, the boxing wags don't praise his thriftiness, (being smart) instead they labeled him 'cheap.'

Why must there be bitterness for Hagler to walk away, how bout just being smart.

Who's bitter? I'm not. In fact quite the opposite. It always hurts me the most to see my old heroes fight on to long. Haglers retirement was near-perfect for me, but also rare.

[BattlingNelson]

I remember Hagler wanted to retire after the tough Mugabi fight but the $$$ for the Leonard fight was hard to pass up. After he lost there were rumors of him being abusive toward his wife and drinking heavily and using drugs. That loss really ate at him. https://www.washingtonpost.com/archi...-521f98cae55c/

https://vault.si.com/vault/1987/09/2...ar-ray-leonard

Unfortunately I cannot access the article from the post, but thanks for sharing anyway.

From the SI article, which by itself is highly recommended, these tidbits stand out:

When they returned home to Hanover, Hagler was an emotional wreck. "He cried a lot," Bertha says. "I got him to talk about it a little. He felt he did get robbed. He said, 'I'll never be able to get my life and marriage together until I get my belts back.' " In the end, she says, he grew colder and more remote.

"I was trying to get him to talk to me," Bertha says. "He'd say, 'I don't want to talk about it.' I'd say, 'You have to talk about it. You can't go on like this.' It was frustrating for me because I couldn't get to him. The more I tried, the more distant he became." Hagler grew further from her, physically as well as emotionally. He spent more time away from home. "I thought, Maybe he'll wake up and find there's more to life than drinking and partying," she says.

She believes that her husband's central problem was the outcome of the fight and that he remains angry with her and the Petronellis over it. "He's bitter toward all three of us," she says. "He's going to have to come down to reality. He knows the mistakes he made in this fight, and he has to deal with them."

So Hagler was a mental wreck after Leonard. Furthermore he was on alcohol and ******* (disputed). So here we have Hagler in a huge hole! What happens next?

Hagler said:

"If I were to walk out of this game of boxing, I'd hate to walk out with this bitterness," Hagler says. "But I'm going to take time out. I don't know if I'm gonna fight again. Leonard doesn't have anything I want right now, except the satisfaction of whupping him. But that ain't what I want. I want my belts that they took...."

Since Leonard made a subsequent 'retirement', the belts was to be distributed on many hands.... Hagler wanting his belts seemed impossible.


Well. I'd like for someone to ask Hagler today as to why he didn't fight again, but maybe the answer is there above: That he couldn't get back his belts.

[VegasMichael]

Unfortunately I cannot access the article from the post, but thanks for sharing anyway. .

Here is the Washington Post article:


HAGLER IS IN THE FIGHT OF HIS LIFE ACCEPTING DEFEAT

"It kind of shattered his life," Marvelous Marvin Hagler's manager said yesterday of Hagler's reaction to his defeat in April by Sugar Ray Leonard.

"I've told him he has a long way to go in life and we want to see him happy," said Hagler's manager, Pat Petronelli. "He's been a great champion. He hasn't been a phony -- he always fought. We love the guy. We hate to see him not handling the situation . . .

"He got moody. He got depressed. He couldn't deal with it. Some people can deal with it and others can't.

"I had a feeling he was going to take it bad, but not this bad."

Since his split-decision defeat by Leonard, Hagler has maintained an even deeper seclusion than normal, and has had marital problems that have left him separated from his wife. In addition, he has been the subject of a report that unnamed friends and relatives were concerned that he was engaged in alcohol and drug abuse. Subsequently, Hagler denied using drugs and abusing alcohol.

In the wake of the Leonard fight, his first defeat in 11 years, Hagler has made himself unavailable to close friends and associates much of the time. "He always reached out for me," said Petronelli. "Now, I have to go looking for him."

Hagler's wife, Bertha, recently filed a family abuse petition seeking custody of their five children and a restraining order prohibiting Hagler access to their Hanover, Mass., home. In her complaint, according to the Associated Press, Bertha Hagler wrote, "Marvin threw me out of the house. He pushed me. He hit the car with a boulder. I am in fear of him."

Following an appearance by both Haglers at a hearing in Hingham (Mass.) District Court, an agreement was reached allowing Hagler limited visiting rights with his five children at their Hanover home, with Hagler abiding by a court order barring him from living there. The order is in effect until Sept. 30.

In addition to appearing at the hearing, Hagler gave an interview to a Boston television station after the station reported that friends and relatives of Hagler had expressed concern about his welfare. "I want to reassure the public I have no problem with drugs or alcohol," Hagler said.

Hagler admitted, however, "I'm probably drinking a bit because of my marriage problems, but not to the extent I'm overdoing it."

Hagler said that the loss to Leonard still bothered him, but that he was "trying to keep from getting down."

Hagler's earnings from the Leonard fight appear to be unprecedented. But the money clearly has not taken the sting out of the setback for Hagler.

Bob Arum, the fight's promoter, has said Hagler could make "at least $18 million." Petronelli said, "It was the greatest deal ever made."

But Petronelli expressed regret over the difficult time Hagler has gone through since the fight. He said Hagler has complained often about the judging of the fight and what Hagler considered unfair tactics employed by Leonard, such as holding but not being penalized by the referee although number of warnings were issued.

"Marvin would keep repeating these things," said Petronelli. "I said, 'It's history now. You've got to go on with your life' . . .

"Of course, Marvin felt bad after the fight. Of course, Marvin felt bad because Leonard would not give him a rematch. Things piled up."

What has appeared to matter most to Hagler is holding the middleweight championship. But both the World Boxing Association and the International Boxing Federation stripped him of their versions of the title because they did not sanction the Leonard fight. The defeat by Leonard left him without the World Boxing Council title, as well.

"Marvin's thinking always was, 'Let some kid come along and beat me,' " said Petronelli. "Not to have it end with a, 'Did he beat him or didn't he beat him?' He said he'll take this to his grave."

As for Hagler's future in the ring, Petronelli said, "He might decide he wants to go after a {championship} belt," but for now Petronelli doubts it. "The only one to get him to fight again would be Leonard."

[LITTLE JOE]

This really stands out to me in the SI article " To be sure, Hagler certainly has been every bit a man when it comes to his trainer and his manager, Goody and Pat Petronelli. For $2 million more, Pat agreed to make the fight 12 rounds instead of 15."

[BattlingNelson]

So I searched the SI vault a bit. It's been a long time since I've done that. As always they have some great written articles and one contains the answer. It's from 1990 and you can go to page 40 here:

https://vault.si.com/vault/710971#&gid=ci0258bf06a00326ef&pid=710971---042---image