The Top 20 All-Time Greatest P4P List

[Happy Lora]

Harry Greb
Sam Langford
Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Ezzard Charles
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Muhammad Ali
Packey McFarland
Willie Pep
Bob Fitzsimmons
Ray Leonard
Barney Ross
Gene Tunney
Joe Louis
Tony Canzoneri
Archie Moore
Jimmy McLarnin
Mike Gibbons

[QueensburyRules]

Harry Greb
Sam Langford
Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Ezzard Charles
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Muhammad Ali
Packey McFarland
Willie Pep
Bob Fitzsimmons
Ray Leonard
Barney Ross
Gene Tunney
Joe Louis
Tony Canzoneri
Archie Moore
Jimmy McLarnin
Mike Gibbons

- -In a p4p sense, Dempsey and Louis beat vastly larger, bigger, stronger fighters than did Ali.

Louis a still unbroken record setter...just stating the obvious.

[OldTerry]

This is my top 20 list, which will remain fluid, that way adjustments can be made over time.

1- Ray Robinson

2- Willie Pep

3- Archie Moore

4- Ezzard Charles

5- Harry Greb

6- Roberto Duran

7- Henry Armstrong

8- Barney Ross

9- Benny Leonard

10- Sam Langford

11- Mickey Walker

12- Manny Pacquiao

13- Tiger Flowers

14- Jake LaMotta

15- Jack Dempsey

16- Ray Leonard

17- Emile Griffith

18- Gene Tunney

19- Roy Jones Jr

20- Ike Williams

Plenty of honorable mentions who can easily be rotated on or off the list. In no particular order:

Jose Napoles
Pernell Whitaker
Julio Cesar Chavez Sr
Michael Spinks
Joe Louis
Jimmy McLarnin
Joe Gans
Charley Burley
Sandy Saddler
Holman Williams
Tony Canzoneri

Post up your lists!

Your list is a good starting point for discussion. Some how I would have to include Lomenchenko, Aaron Pryor, Joe Calzaghe, Alexis Arguello, Floyd Mayweather, Muhammad Ali and a prime Larry Holmes. The question is who would I remove from your list to accommodate their additions?

[Happy Lora]

- -In a p4p sense, Dempsey and Louis beat vastly larger, bigger, stronger fighters than did Ali.

Louis a still unbroken record setter...just stating the obvious.

Neither beat better fighters, though. Louis made my list, by the way.

[QueensburyRules]

Neither beat better fighters, though. Louis made my list, by the way.

- -Joe listed in the rear, sacrilegious!

Both Joe and Jack won their biggest fights.

Ali got whooped bad in his after slurring Frazier as an Uncle Tom.

Just da fax...

[JAB5239]

Harry Greb
Sam Langford
Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Ezzard Charles
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Muhammad Ali
Packey McFarland
Willie Pep
Bob Fitzsimmons
Ray Leonard
Barney Ross
Gene Tunney
Joe Louis
Tony Canzoneri
Archie Moore
Jimmy McLarnin
Mike Gibbons

Nice list. I have things a little different, but nothing to get into a twist about.

Loving where you have Ross and Leonard. I did a thread some time ago asking who ranked higher. I've always been of the opinion they were very close together no matter which one you rank higher.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Harry Greb
Sam Langford
Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Ezzard Charles
Roberto Duran
Benny Leonard
Joe Gans
Muhammad Ali
Packey McFarland
Willie Pep
Bob Fitzsimmons
Ray Leonard
Barney Ross
Gene Tunney
Joe Louis
Tony Canzoneri
Archie Moore
Jimmy McLarnin
Mike Gibbons

There's a lot wrong with that list. But what strikes me as particularly odd is that you rank Langford at the top of your list and McLarnin way at the bottom. That's a real head-scratcher.

[Willie Pep 229]

There's a lot wrong with that list. But what strikes me as particularly odd is that you rank Langford at the top of your list and McLarnin way at the bottom. That's a real head-scratcher.

It is a very good list if you don't considered it to be ordered.

I like that he included Mike Gibbons, he often goes unnoticed.

Of course it is all opinion; I suspect I would try to squeeze in Jimmy Wilde and maybe Sandy Saddler, but wouldn't know who to take off. Then again I'm really not not sure how to rate Wilde.

[ALinares521]

Best of all times..

Almost impossible to agree on who top 10 fighters of all time list. So many different factors to take in consideration.. If we go strictly by win and lost record it just would not be accurate because as we all know, champions do not retire while they are on top and end up fighting more than a few too many fights past their best form. Boxing skills, ability to take a punch, punching power, ability to adjust to different styles, accomplishments and able to defend a title against the best on the division. I continue to love boxing but at the same time it is very disappointing to see how " Big Money " fighters today get so much protection so they could stay in the sport.

[Rusty Tromboni]

Almost impossible to agree on who top 10 fighters of all time list. So many different factors to take in consideration.. If we go strictly by win and lost record it just would not be accurate because as we all know, champions do not retire while they are on top and end up fighting more than a few too many fights past their best form. Boxing skills, ability to take a punch, punching power, ability to adjust to different styles, accomplishments and able to defend a title against the best on the division. I continue to love boxing but at the same time it is very disappointing to see how " Big Money " fighters today get so much protection so they could stay in the sport.

That's a beautiful insight.

But I do believe when taking those matters into consideration we can fairly well afix a value to a fighter in comparison to his colleagues.

If Archer had Floyd's special treatment he would have gone 49-0 in only 10 years.

Mayweather, Holmes, Marciano... these guys all settled in around the coveted 49-0 mark, but under different conditions and in different spans of time. And while they all picked up the impressive hardware, do any of them compare to what Archer accomplished? I think not. But rankings are inherently biased against men like Archer, not because they're impossible to do or too dependent on subjective analysis, but because Boxing is a very old sport where facts compete with fiction, and fans are too lazy to do their homework. Rankings basically become a popularity contest.