Dispelling the myth about the "rope-a-dope" (Rumble In The Jungle)

[SalimShady1212]

Actually, it's a bad vid, just an example of how to distort the truth by cutting together scenes which justifies the view the maker wants to foist on people.

Like all these fake vids that "prove" that astronauts never have walked on the moon.

Ali has in his biography clearly described how Foreman forced him to 'invent the rope-a-dope' strategy during the fight to survive it.

There's footage of the whole fight for people to make their own judgement, the two things you mentioned are world apart. There's conclusive footage that the fight took place and you can see what's going on. Whereas going to the moon is what you've heard and seen minimal footage with not many witnesses. I'm not saying it's not true but it's a terrible comparison.

Hard to believe he invented the rope-a-dope midfight, to roll with the punches or even take them will have taken plenty of conditioning (medball and so on) as well as plenty of training with sparring partners practiciing against a similar opponent. Ali will have seen plenty of footage where George pushes opponents back to the ropes.

[BKM-2010]

Actually, it's a bad vid, just an example of how to distort the truth by cutting together scenes which justifies the view the maker wants to foist on people.

Like all these fake vids that "prove" that astronauts never have walked on the moon.

Ali has in his biography clearly described how Foreman forced him to 'invent the rope-a-dope' strategy during the fight to survive it.

If that is the case then I challenge you to edit a video that would show the opposite: Foreman beating Ali up on the ropes which infamously caused his own demise(I'm Just repeating the silly myth here).

You can't, because that didn't happen. Every time I watch the fight I see Ali outboxing, outsmarting and outlasting Foreman with a combination of beautiful offensive boxing, smart defense and gritty heart that surpassed big George's, and then an ATG combination that finished the job.

He was even able to outshine Foreman second biggest asset: physical strength. Foreman could not man handle him like he did Frazier and so many others. Ali was so superior, he did everything better expect getting into a slugfest with Foreman.

[rightsideup]

Muhammad Ali suckered both invincible Champs in both liston and foreman in different ways.

[BKM-2010]

Muhammad Ali suckered both invincible Champs in both liston and foreman in different ways.

He could not sucker Frazier though despite heavier mind games than the others. Credit to Frazier?

[Ben Bolt]

There's footage of the whole fight for people to make their own judgement.

If that is the case then I challenge you to edit a video that would show the opposite: Foreman beating Ali up on the ropes which infamously caused his own demise(I'm Just repeating the silly myth here).
You can't, because that didn't happen.

As I said, Ali himself has described how he experienced the fight. How he learned in round one that George effectively cut off ring, forcing him to take three-four steps for every step George took, which would had left him exhausted. How George was on the verge of stopping him, because George's punches did funny things to his brain.

I prefer to believe Ali's own words than your opinions.

[Ray Corso]

When Ali first came to the gm for spar he would rope a dope "lounge" on the ropes to take some body shots, working twists and practicing grabbing or hooking. He had specific spar partners to engage in different sessions to go along with midsection work from exercise to actually absorbing shots. . For the most part Ali worked defense in close then move a round or two then he'd go back to clinching, holding, walking off and turnoing. He worked on techniques that a fighter would need when in trouble. Fighters today don't work hard on defense they play pad games and exercise a million times.
Ali at the end of a training camp would work on his combinations and lateral moves but he put his punches together on the heavy bag and was a master at utilizing it.
The "rope a dope" was just part of Ali's training program after his 3 year barring. He knew his legs weren't going to be what they were in younger years so he prepared for defense all the time. Thats were the left glove around the back of the opponents head came from. He could controll and adjust and didn't cheap shot while doing it so he was rarely penalized.
He is easily the smartest heavy of all time and one of the smartest at any weight. He knew his strengths and weaknesses and his opponents too.
Promotionally the Greatest Ever, in the ring the Smartest Ever.

Ray.

[billeau2]

When Ali first came to the gm for spar he would rope a dope "lounge" on the ropes to take some body shots, working twists and practicing grabbing or hooking. He had specific spar partners to engage in different sessions to go along with midsection work from exercise to actually absorbing shots. . For the most part Ali worked defense in close then move a round or two then he'd go back to clinching, holding, walking off and turnoing. He worked on techniques that a fighter would need when in trouble. Fighters today don't work hard on defense they play pad games and exercise a million times.
Ali at the end of a training camp would work on his combinations and lateral moves but he put his punches together on the heavy bag and was a master at utilizing it.
The "rope a dope" was just part of Ali's training program after his 3 year barring. He knew his legs weren't going to be what they were in younger years so he prepared for defense all the time. Thats were the left glove around the back of the opponents head came from. He could controll and adjust and didn't cheap shot while doing it so he was rarely penalized.
He is easily the smartest heavy of all time and one of the smartest at any weight. He knew his strengths and weaknesses and his opponents too.
Promotionally the Greatest Ever, in the ring the Smartest Ever.

Ray.

And as is the case with so many things...to the untrained eye what appears is entirely different than to the expert. The reason why some people think he rope a doped and others think he did not is because of imprecise descriptions ladened with assumptions. Ali moved very precisely on the ropes. He knew how to time it so the guy thought he had Ali with the punch. This is done in the martial arts all the time because we need the guy to commit to his punch to do technique. Consequently Ali always looks like he is getting tagged. But in fact he is moving at the last moment to deflect the punches. With Foreman there were times when he straight out made Foreman miss, other times he twisted as the punch contacted his body, which also puts one in a perfect position to counter.... When you use movement like this often you actually move foward, or very little making it look like you are....ready for this? standing there and taking the punch.

Punches are very difficult animals. YOu have a sweet spot where distance, balance, and your footing have to all come together for an instant....when any of these variables are adversely affected the punch starts to lose considerable power. If George Foreman throws a body blow hook to the midsection and I turn into the punch, shortening his distance, and then tense my abs and turn, deflecting his shot...he has little power to deliver. Thats what Ali did. For head shots, you move your head an inch....not a foot because when you move it a foot a good puncher will track your head and catch you with the next punch. Moving an inch though confuses the puncher and he is now off balance. Notice how this happens to George and all Ali has to do at that point is step in and lay his weight on Foreman, or....lay back on the ropes!

So both parties are partially right. Yes Ali did something that looked like he was taking blows and little else...no that was not what he was doing, but it looked that way. Yes, he was not moving his legs much and using the ropes to distance George properly, no this was not simply letting the punches come and tire Foreman out.

For anyone interested, take a friend and ask them to pantomine a hard punch at slow speed. Make sure that at the point of impact all the dynamics are as they would be on a hard punch... So, let your friend hit your gut 3 times perfectly, feel the weight, and hand tense, the instant where he locks the body on contact...and let it push you back...Now once your friend is pretty confidant that he can do this and not fear sudden movements from you, let him throw another punch, just before it contacts you gently bend your knees, settle your weight off on the outside leg (to his punching arm) and turn....just an inch. What happened? If you did it right he should have lost his balance. Now, let him get his confidance back and as he punches, about midway start to move...this is what most people do...what happened? he probably drew his hand back to start the punch again becaus he was not fooled. See what Ali did now?

[The Old LefHook]

Is there a forking point to this halfwitted thread? The rope-a-dope happened. End of case. Close this piece of **** down.

[Ben Bolt]

Ali worked on techniques that a fighter would need when in trouble.

If we all were that dedicated, we would be prepared for any setback in life.

So both parties are partially right.

Quote (by whoever it was): "Every person's opinion does matter." True!

[billeau2]

If we all were that dedicated, we would be prepared for any setback in life.



Quote (by whoever it was): "Every person's opinion does matter." True!

Ben

the funny thing about Ali is that because of his charisma people often thought he was arrogant...there are numerous tales that show he wasn't. Because of his laid back ways people often think he was not a hard worker...he was a perfectionist. Ali's timing in avoiding punches is as close to perfect as I have ever seen in a fighter. Early Floyd is up there as well. This timing takes practice, there is a whole routine for avoiding shots and Ali worked on this.

I tell this story about Ali occasionally:

There was a martial artist who wrote about an experience he had with Ali, the guy was a kick boxer which to some of us old school ****ers is "half assed boxing mixed with half assed karate." So, there is a charity event where this guy is doing demo and they ask Ali to show up and he does. the guy wants to go a round with Ali, and Ali agrees.

Now what most people do not realize is that Ali had a tremendous amount of respect for martial arts and Ali could be the clown prince! So Ali gets on stage and starts hamming it up telling the crowd that this black belt master will teach him a lesson, bowing to the guy..... The guy thinks to himself "hmmm...this guy is mocking me! I WILL teach him a lesson!" Ali was just being Ali and really did respect but wanted to get a few laughs...at any rate the bell rings...

The guy goes at Ali Iron and tongs as we say, Ali is dodging, juking and at one point Ali hits the guy with a light tap of a jab (this is the guy describing the fight) his knees start to buckle and he sees the chrome bubbles, Ali goes in grabs him up while feigning a continued attack until the guy is steady again, the fight stops, Ali starts thanking him for teaching him a lesson as a martial arts master...

This guy had this to say: " i realized a couple of things that made me a humble human being, a better martial artist and a real fan of Ali: Ali couild have killed me at any time, Ali had the decency to make sure I was not injured, nor my self esteem damaged, and the kindness/skill as a teacher to teach me a lesson, show his skill and make the crowd see something totally different.

That is quinessential Ali.