It's sad that Joe Louis' contributions to his country are somewhat forgotten

[Ray Corso]

welts.......you really need to get a grip and study before you post or just stick with the "fantasy" section since that has become just BS since you and "tool boy" have flooded the area.

The Joe Louis era was selling out stadiums and the talent at that time was the best in all weight classes with the contenders all fighting each other for their shot at the title! The 30's up to the mid 50's was outstanding competition filled with talented men. The 60's through the 80's was very good also but when you compare the best from each class the older generation has the edge in my opinion.
Boxing struggled in its infancy because it was illegal as far as a competitive balance this is the worse era for boxing.
The heavyweight champ fights in an era that's has horrible fighters. The best fighter in boxing refuses to fight the best challenger that's available.
The best current fighter/boxer (Rigo) is unable to show his skills because the financial end of the sport can't be satisfied by fighter and management.
The phony "junior divisions" hide fighters who want weight advantages even with 40 hours to rehydrate, joke!

Remember before the bum of the month started Louis cleaned his division top to bottom. He also fought 10 round exhibitions and also gave local favorites a shot at the title!!!
As for money problems the managers (Arnold & Gould) and James Braddock held the title hostage from Louis. Louis gave away 20% of the rest of his career earnings to them to get the title shot!
That should not have happened and I think that deal was relinquished after a few years.

Louis remains the best technical heavyweight of all times and that has to do with the great Mr. Blackburn his trainer and mentor!
No one throws better combination with power than Louis did, no one!
Ray.

[RSBonos]

The popularity of the sport declined after Dempsey's era and didn't really revive until Ali. Louis was in an era were the public generally didn't care for boxing and many called for the sport to be banned too, due to several ring deaths and it was viewed as a too brutal sport.

Louis v Max II had the largest American audience average (on radio) of all time.

[brian___]

Louis gets a ton of respect, the world considers him a hero. Sad about him being broke later in life but that happened to a lot of people that did great things but didn't pay their taxes.

[- Ram Raid -]

Louis' finances were a mess and his tax debt spiralled way out of control. From his final retirement in 1951 until 1962 when a deal was made with the IRS he was hounded mercilessly for unpaid taxes. The figure was in excess of $1.3 million.

He'd stepped back through the ropes in 1950 after he received a bill for $246,056. Long after he'd retired for good in 1955 he received the bill for the audits of the final three years of his career for another $507,610.

As early as 1942 his debts had started to spiral. He owed the IRS $117,000 on his 1941 income. He owed Mike Jacobs $59,000 and was into John Roxborough for $41,000. By the time he finished his service in 1945 the debt to Jacobs had reached $170,000 plus he owed his ex-wife $25,000 in divorce settlements. So despite earning around $4 million between 1935 and 1942 he came out of the army owing $350,000 of debt.

What rankles any sense of decency though was that in 1942 he fought Buddy Bear in January and donated his entire purse of $65,200 to the Navy Relief Fund. The money went to the families of fallen sailors. Then in March of that year he fought Abe Simon and again donated his entire purse, this time $45,882 to the Army Relief Fund.

So the Heavyweight Champion of the World stepped through the ropes twice that year and put his title on the line for no financial gain. It was the first time that that had ever happened.

In their infinite wisdom the IRS decided that both purses should be considered as income and he was taxed at the normal rate.

Not everyone he owed money to was quite so callous, Jacobs refused to press him on the fortune that he was owed telling friends, "He's done enough for me." It's sad that certain members of the states' bureaucracy didn't also feel that he'd done enough for his country, rather than taxing him on donated earnings.

[billeau2]

Louis' finances were a mess and his tax debt spiralled way out of control. From his final retirement in 1951 until 1962 when a deal was made with the IRS he was hounded mercilessly for unpaid taxes. The figure was in excess of $1.3 million.

He'd stepped back through the ropes in 1950 after he received a bill for $246,056. Long after he'd retired for good in 1955 he received the bill for the audits of the final three years of his career for another $507,610.

As early as 1942 his debts had started to spiral. He owed the IRS $117,000 on his 1941 income. He owed Mike Jacobs $59,000 and was into John Roxborough for $41,000. By the time he finished his service in 1945 the debt to Jacobs had reached $170,000 plus he owed his ex-wife $25,000 in divorce settlements. So despite earning around $4 million between 1935 and 1942 he came out of the army owing $350,000 of debt.

What rankles any sense of decency though was that in 1942 he fought Buddy Bear in January and donated his entire purse of $65,200 to the Navy Relief Fund. The money went to the families of fallen sailors. Then in March of that year he fought Abe Simon and again donated his entire purse, this time $45,882 to the Army Relief Fund.

So the Heavyweight Champion of the World stepped through the ropes twice that year and put his title on the line for no financial gain. It was the first time that that had ever happened.

In their infinite wisdom the IRS decided that both purses should be considered as income and he was taxed at the normal rate.

Not everyone he owed money to was quite so callous, Jacobs refused to press him on the fortune that he was owed telling friends, "He's done enough for me." It's sad that certain members of the states' bureaucracy didn't also feel that he'd done enough for his country, rather than taxing him on donated earnings.

Great post RR! Great information. And people should keep in mind that at the time those figures were really huge.

[- Ram Raid -]

Great post RR! Great information. And people should keep in mind that at the time those figures were really huge.

Thank you. Apparently the amount he donated equates to around $1.8 million today. But if we keep in mind that sportsmen in the 1940's weren't paid the astronomical fees that they are now then that figure seems even more generous.

It wasn't an unproblematic donation on his part either. The decision had been made before America entered into the war and it garnered pockets of serious criticism amongst black Americans. The U.S Navy, perhaps above all others, was seen as being a Jim Crow institution and in 1940 only 2.3 % of its personnel were black. The Secretary of The Navy, Frank Knox, had met with civil rights leaders and President Roosevelt that year and stated that he would rather resign than integrate the Navy.

One newspaper had stated that what Louis was doing was the equivalent of the NAACP "donating half of the funds it collects to the Ku Klux Klan". Dan Burley advised him not to "sell out his race" because the Navy was asking him to ". . . come bouncing like the sorriest Uncle Tom to do its bidding - giving it everything, receiving nothing".

There were of course sections of the black community and its leading writers that supported what Louis was doing and when the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbour in December 1941 support for his actions grew even stronger. Asked how he felt about fighting for nothing he replied, "I'm not fighting for nothing, I'm fighting for my country." And, "No place else in the world could a one time black cotton picker like me get to be a millionaire. I love this country like I love my people." Whilst acknowledging that America had serious racial issues he stated that they weren't "something that Hitler would solve."

Perhaps that starts to hint at one of the reasons why for some of us Louis isn't remembered as highly as we feel he should be. He wasn't an entirely counter cultural figure and nor did he have the kind of personalty that the likes of Ali or Jack Johnson possessed. I'm not suggesting that Johnson is held in a more esteemed position but when counter cultural figures of the 1960's like Ali were looking for inspiration from earlier figures, Louis was bypassed in favour of more incendiary personalties like Johnson.

At one point Ali had labelled him an Uncle Tom, a statement he later expressed regret for. But never the less, at the height of Ali's influence that would have damaged Joe's reputation. He'd damaged Joe Frazier's standing with the same vitriol as he had Floyd Patterson's along with a long line of fellow back fighters that didn't agree with his separatist views.

If we put Ali's opposition to the Vietnam war aside, his views on racial politics often verged on the absurd. Louis as a national symbol arguably did more than Ali for the cause of black progress and it's a shame that this isn't more widely acknowledged. In fact he arguably did more for the advancement of America's race relations as a whole regardless of colour. He was the first African American to become a truly national hero.

[billeau2]

Thank you. Apparently the amount he donated equates to around $1.8 million today. But if we keep in mind that sportsmen in the 1940's weren't paid the astronomical fees that they are now then that figure seems even more generous.

It wasn't an unproblematic donation on his part either. The decision had been made before America entered into the war and it garnered pockets of serious criticism amongst black Americans. The U.S Navy, perhaps above all others, was seen as being a Jim Crow institution and in 1940 only 2.3 % of its personnel were black. The Secretary of The Navy, Frank Knox, had met with civil rights leaders and President Roosevelt that year and stated that he would rather resign than integrate the Navy.

One newspaper had stated that what Louis was doing was the equivalent of the NAACP "donating half of the funds it collects to the Ku Klux Klan". Dan Burley advised him not to "sell out his race" because the Navy was asking him to ". . . come bouncing like the sorriest Uncle Tom to do its bidding - giving it everything, receiving nothing".

There were of course sections of the black community and its leading writers that supported what Louis was doing and when the Japanese bombed Pearl Harbour in December 1941 support for his actions grew even stronger. Asked how he felt about fighting for nothing he replied, "I'm not fighting for nothing, I'm fighting for my country." And, "No place else in the world could a one time black cotton picker like me get to be a millionaire. I love this country like I love my people." Whilst acknowledging that America had serious racial issues he stated that they weren't "something that Hitler would solve."

Perhaps that starts to hint at one of the reasons why for some of us Louis isn't remembered as highly as we feel he should be. He wasn't an entirely counter cultural figure and nor did he have the kind of personalty that the likes of Ali or Jack Johnson possessed. I'm not suggesting that Johnson is held in a more esteemed position but when counter cultural figures of the 1960's like Ali were looking for inspiration from earlier figures, Louis was bypassed in favour of more incendiary personalties like Johnson.

At one point Ali had labelled him an Uncle Tom, a statement he later expressed regret for. But never the less, at the height of Ali's influence that would have damaged Joe's reputation. He'd damaged Joe Frazier's standing with the same vitriol as he had Floyd Patterson's along with a long line of fellow back fighters that didn't agree with his separatist views.

If we put Ali's opposition to the Vietnam war aside, his views on racial politics often verged on the absurd. Louis as a national symbol arguably did more than Ali for the cause of black progress and it's a shame that this isn't more widely acknowledged. In fact he arguably did more for the advancement of America's race relations as a whole regardless of colour. He was the first African American to become a truly national hero.

Ali needed to grow and mature as a person, there is NO doubt this is true. Ali was also under pressure because the Black ******s bullied him. Malcolm X, who I consider to be the closest person to a real saint that i can think of, went through a similar process and frankly...Ali saw what happened to him.

My dad, who is still on the right side of the ground was a Marine in the second world war. And while it is true what you say about Jim Crow and the navy...probably extending to the service as a whole...there is something very interesting about Louis. My dad is ***ish (mom is a goyem haha) and especially in the marines most of the guys he went to war with Started out being rabid anti semites. When they met my dad they really had an awakening because...SOME OF THESE FELLOWS HAD NEVER MET A ***!!! from the small towns of America the belief was a *** had horns, I mean they really had no idea until they met David Simon. I say this because my dad was loved by the most bigoted bigots and get this...Most of these guys who professed to hate ***s? they coulf actually love Joe louis. They had at least met black guys, and they were willing to put their BS aside thats how much they loved Joe. This transformation was similar regarding when they met my dad and realized that ***s did not have a horn, a tail...oy vay!

It is true Louis had to be really courageous to do what he did. It would make me sick to my stomach but for the knowledge that Louis' unselfish act had the effect, much as my Dad's ***ishness did, of causing people to grow up and realize that we are all brothers and sisters (except Elroy).

those bastards at the IRS should have committed ritual suicide after what they did to Louis regarding those fights. I remember as a kid going with my dad in the city (New york of course) to this nightclub on madison Ave and this big burley guy coming up and saying to my dad "Hey Simon!!! hear about the *** who walked into the wall with an erection? he broke his nose!!' then giving my dad a big hug. This was my dad's captian (I don't think they had sergeants in the marines?) and he was the owner of the place. My dad was treated like royalty and of course I was treated likewise. Murry, in between all the soda pop and treats I was scarfing down told me that all the Marines had listened to Louis' fights while in combat and that my dad, who had been the radio man recieved the fights for them.

Louis was a tiger with the exterior of a sweet, unassuming, mild mannered man. They really do not make em like that anymore. To his credit Ali grew up and when he made his courageous stand it may have helped him appreciate that guys like Louis and Patterson and actually smokin Joe, who were more sympathetic to the mainstream, had their reasons. But yeah...Ali could be a real incidiary prick when he wanted to be. His comments about Frazier's black features were truly tasteless.

[Anthony342]

Its a conspiracy really and athletes fall right into it hook line and sinker. The reason why guys like Louis got in so much trouble is partially that they had no way of comprehending how much the IRS takes from earned income.

Yep, the IRS, oil companies, insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies and banks are all horrible and unfortunately are the ones really in charge of the US.

[Anthony342]

I heard a story of Marciano helping out Louis financially later in life too and they showed a scene of him doing this in the Marciano cable movie, is this true?

[hhascup]

I have the original Western Union telegram thanking Joe Louis, Buddy Baer and Mike Jacobs for donating there purse to the Navy relief fund.