Dempsey vs. Marciano

[johnbook]

As a cruiserweight maybe Marciano could go 49-0 in recent times. Maybe not against the likes of Holyfield, and others. As a HW, far too short and short-armed to do much against many HWs of the last 50 years.
Hell he was only 32 when he retired in 1956. Did he know he couldn't beat the likes of Liston and others in what was arguably still his prime?

[HOUDINI563]

There is no story to piece together. Again the history of why a Dempsey-Wills bout never materialized is one of the most well known and understood subjects of boxing history. Dempsey was exonerated of blame nearly 100 years ago. Wills HIMSELF Cast no blame on Dempsey statin, which was and is the historical conclusion, that the powers that be would not allow the bout the occur AND if it were up to Dempsey that the bout WOULD have occurred. Really there is nothing more to be said if the man himself is stating as fact the known history.

[travestyny]

There is no story to piece together. Again the history of why a Dempsey-Wills bout never materialized is one of the most well known and understood subjects of boxing history. Dempsey was exonerated of blame nearly 100 years ago. Wills HIMSELF Cast no blame on Dempsey statin, which was and is the historical conclusion, that the powers that be would not allow the bout the occur AND if it were up to Dempsey that the bout WOULD have occurred. Really there is nothing more to be said if the man himself is stating as fact the known history.

You're still ducking and dodging.

What I want to know is why did Dempsey break what a US court deemed was a valid contract for him to fight "the only man he has wanted to fight since he became champion."

So are you ready to look at those details, starting with if you were wrong about the promoter.

Are you down?

[travestyny]

There is no story to piece together.

By the way, maybe you can also help me piece together whether Dempsey was a liar.


"I have never drawn the color-line. Wills is the only man I wanted."

"As I have drawn the color-line, I am free to say that Harry Wills is a great fighter who will whip the very best of them."

Holy Contradiction, Batman.

[Zmerai Khan]

Athletic ability does.

Sure. But it's the same with man as every species. The prey are more athletic, while the predators are less athletic. Athleticism doesn't stop animals from being eaten; it just determines who's eaten today as opposed to next week.
Also genetic: psyche. Look at how Lomachenko makes guys quit. Fast twitch muscle fibers fail his opponents fast.

I agree with Houdini often. But you have a point, too. Humans are no different than other animals.

[Zmerai Khan]

So did you decide if the public just wanted another black dude to crack Dempsey's ribs? Is that why he refused to fight another black fighter thereafter?

I'm tempted to give you a direct answer. But I know if i play cute, you'll find it irresistible to continue your ranting for another 20 posts.

The best part: your circuitous rambling still won't return to the topic at hand.


What do your neighbors think of you? Anywhere I've lived thre crazy neighbor had a funny nickname. What's yours?

[Zmerai Khan]

As a cruiserweight maybe Marciano could go 49-0 in recent times. Maybe not against the likes of Holyfield, and others. As a HW, far too short and short-armed to do much against many HWs of the last 50 years.
Hell he was only 32 when he retired in 1956. Did he know he couldn't beat the likes of Liston and others in what was arguably still his prime?

He was an old 32. And I don't doubt that he puts away patterson quicker than Ali did.

I think he would easily pack on 25 pounds and maintain the offense we know him for. He'd lose step with quicker fighters, but I do not doubt that a lot of big men - even beyond Cruiserweight- would turn mushy.

Obviously the better Heavyweights would prove too much. But i think he'd do quite well as a Hw in later generations. Toney did just fine.... so did Byrd, Jones, Spinks, Patterson and Moorer. Different men in many ways, but not plainly more talented.

But seriously... how would later generation Heavyweights handle 15 round fights with smaller gloves and greater tolerance for rough-housing?

[HOUDINI563]

Remember...they don’t come greater than Ali and he himself expressed doubt as to whether he could beat Marciano or at least beat him consistently.

Bigger does not mean better. Today’s hwts are big but the talent pool is heavily diluted. 12 round bouts so you don’t need to be in super shape, multiple ways to become a champion do it’s easy to be one, 40 or more top ten contenders so again easy to be a contender.

[travestyny]

I'm tempted to give you a direct answer. But I know if i play cute, you'll find it irresistible to continue your ranting for another 20 posts.

The best part: your circuitous rambling still won't return to the topic at hand.


What do your neighbors think of you? Anywhere I've lived thre crazy neighbor had a funny nickname. What's yours?

Well that's certainly not an answer.

Do you think trolling makes up for your obvious shortcomings?

[HOUDINI563]

Marciano did not retire because Liston was looming. Liston was not on anyone’s radar when Marciano retired.

I’m really amazed by those who place emphasis on size and reach. These are the last things to be considered. Marciano WOULD NOT lose to Holyfield because Holy was bigger nor would he lose to Holy because his reach is longer. Holyfield’s tendency to brawl would be suicide vs prime Marciano.