prime marciano vs. 2003 james toney

[StarshipTrooper]

toney had a rock solid chin in '03

sam peter is a much harder puncher than rocky
so was holyfield and rahman to a lesser degree and none of them could even dent toney's chin.


and tony wasn't a huge puncher, but he wasn't a cupcake either, and rocky certainly couldn't just walk through what he had to offer.

no way i see toney getting stopped



i can see toney finding time the opportunity to roll the wide punches to the head from the pocket, even backed against the ropes.
marciano didn't really pick an angle and attempt to be elusive, he mostly used vertical motion (crouching and then rising,) which would afford tony many opportunities to counter with the right uppercut and with the hook to the body and the head
in other words rocky would be there, in front of toney and in the pocket where he wants him, and throwing the sort of shots that he wants to see and has made a reputation of slipping

toney did a tremendous job of muffling shots to the body with his elbows and rotating his torso as well

sure, somethings going to get in, and it's going to wear a soft bodied toney down, but i'm assuming that he comes in the best condition he could be in
and in that case i think he can weather whatever rocky is going to bring, and tie him up when he needs to take a break.

about 200 lbs (jirov fight was in '03 and he was a 190 lb cruiserweight at the weigh in)

six months later he fought holyfield at 220 lbs and looked a tad soft, but as dangerous and effective as he had ever been considering his size and the opponent he took out.




i get the feeling some of the posters (not you, poet, but generally) are forgetting how skilled toney was
when he was sharp, at a weight where he was healthy, and in shape, he was very elusive. a true counterpuncher.

and that marciano was relatively crude for an ATG, and made a reputation taking punishment and persevering


in a 12 round fight i'm taking toney with clean punches scoring over ones that are rolled or blocked
and in 15 rounds i'm still saying toney (in shape) is far too durable and crafty to get stopped, even if he loses.

I seriously doubt Holyfield is a bigger puncher then Marciano. Peter MAYBE, but Peter was no where near the fighter Marciano was. I'd also point out that Walcott was certainly a bigger puncher then Toney and fought at a higher workrate then the version of Toney we're talking about

Poet

[New England]

I seriously doubt Holyfield is a bigger puncher then Marciano. Peter MAYBE, but Peter was no where near the fighter Marciano was. I'd also point out that Walcott was certainly a bigger puncher then Toney and fought at a higher workrate then the version of Toney we're talking about

Poet

walcott is on my forgotten ****ers list ^.^ he could punch certainly


and sam peter certainly left a lot to be desired
but if he could do anything it was swing those things around and knock a guy out.


and we can agree to disagree on holyfield's punching power relative to rocky's. he threw stern punches and combinations and carried his power late into a fight.
he had a good hook
a hard right hand
a very good uppercut
solid body punches

he hurt some very big and durable men


i'd liken his power to marciano, not likely to knock out a great HW without having to wear him down


peter, on the other hand, could end a fight with one punch with either hand, when he wasn't about 260 and carrying gut around
WHO NEX!??
no one can match mai powah!

[The Surgeon]

Toney would be pinned to the ropes all night long but while he often seems comfortable in this position against Rocky Marciano i highly doubt thats possible! James would make Marciano miss and counter him with sweet rights and short jolting uppercuts but ultimately Marciano would be too tough to let that faze him and would merely just keep ****ing away hitting anything he could with his brute force clubs until his superior workrate, power and stamina took over completely. My only question is if Toney would be able to last the distance or not....... I think he see's the end - Toney is slick and incredibly tough himself

[Forza]

I doubt even samuel peter hit harder than rocky, at least not comparing right hand to right hand.

Toney couldn't crack an egg ( to this day I still don't see how he K.O'd nunn )

Both are close in size

[SCtrojansbaby]

Anybody saying that Toney gets stopped at any weight by anybody is just ******

[jabsRstiff]

Anybody saying that Toney gets stopped at any weight by anybody is just ******

A lot of things you say are very ******....

[Barn]

A lot of things you say are very ******....

I concur.

[SCtrojansbaby]

A lot of things you say are very ******....

maybe so but not that ******

[Greatest1942]

maybe so but not that ******

Well Peter dropped Toney. He is a very hard puncher. I doubt however he could dish out the punishment that Marciano would over 15 rounds. Not only will be there a difference in volume but also in the body punches. Toney will have a tough time taking that amount over 15 rounds.

Saying an ATG great heavy who was a supremely good puncher could not KO Toney is a bit overstated.

I pick Rocky to get a unanimous Decison over 15 rounds.

New England :- I agree mostly with what you say, but although I believe Holyfield at his prime was a good puncher he at the time he fought Toney lost much of his handspeed and his combinations were not the same. Holyfield was never a one punch KO artist. It i his combos that did the trick. I didn't see the Toney version of Holyfield as having the same punching stats as the 90's.

And Yea Rocky hit harder, considering the KO % and one punch power hits have to go with the Rock.

[SCtrojansbaby]

Well Peter dropped Toney. He is a very hard puncher. I doubt however he could dish out the punishment that Marciano would over 15 rounds. Not only will be there a difference in volume but also in the body punches. Toney will have a tough time taking that amount over 15 rounds.

Saying an ATG great heavy who was a supremely good puncher could not KO Toney is a bit overstated.

Toney wasn't even really hurt against Peter. Anybody at any weight KOing Toney is ridiculous IMO.