Calzaghe vs Dawson at 175 lbs

[RubenSonny]

Your welcome

True.

Depends how you look at it. HBO were willing to air Lewis-Ruiz though. Either way I wouldn't of watched that fight, lol

True, but that would of been because Hopkins had no choice

When Jones fought McCallum Hill would call him out and Jones would turn him down saying that Hill hadn't fought anyone except Hearns and he had lost that fight. He would then go on and face Griffin. Its the reason that Hill was in the crowd hoping to fight the winner of Jones-Griffin. Those guys decided to have a rematch, so Hill decided fight other opponents. By the time a Jones-Hill fight was made Hill hadn't fought in a year, could no longer make the lhw limit, and was coming off a loss to Darius.m. So a win over that version of Hill doesn't mean much.

HBO wanted Jones-Nunn because they were hoping to put together a lhw tournament to crown a fighter the undisputed champion:

https://groups.google.com/group/rec....edef2ab2dfbfd9

And at the end of the day he is 1*-2 against Tarver, with many observers (myself included) having him losing their first fight as well

It doesn't matter about him losing its about the fights he took and he took the best version of Tarver.

Jones has a better resume than Calzaghe no doubt about that, but Hopkins resume is about equal to Calzaghe's:

Best wins:
Hopkins > Tarver
Hopkins proved he was a better fighter than Tarver by winning every single round and Calzaghe beat Hopkins
Kessler=Tito
Tito didn't really do much at mw except beat fringe contender Joppy, Kessler best win is Froch
Eubank=Oscar
Oscar lost the Sturm fight and got a gift and he basically quit against Hopkins
Lacy=Pavlik
Both 1 dimensional punchers and Pavlik was fighting 2 divisions above his prime weight class
Reid=Joppy
Neither were anything special
Jones=Winky
Pointless fights
Manfredo=Jones
Pointless fights
Sheika=Johnson
Sheika beat Johnson at smw
Brewer=Holmes

Missed competition:
Calzaghe:
Johnson: Calzaghe pulled out of their fight three times
Pavlik: He should of fought him instead of Jones

Hopkins:
Jones, Toney, Dawson, Ademek, Green, Calzaghe(2002)

Draws:
Hopkins drew with a journeyman called Segundo Mercado

Losses:
Hopkins:
Mitchell, Jones, Calzaghe, Taylor I, Taylor II
The best opponents Hopkins faced who were comparble to him in size were:
Taylor I, Taylor I, Calzaghe, Tarver and Jones and he is 1-4 against them

No Contests:
Hopkins dived through the hopes because he was having a hard time with a green contender called Robert Allen

Intangibles:
Calzaghe always fought within the rules to win, while Hopkins cheats to win

I absolutely disagree, Calzaghe is NOT an ATG and Hopkins clearly is. Hopkins beat top 10 contenders Mercado, Lipsey, Vanderpool, Echols x2, Allen x2, Daniels and Eastman. Hes really in a different league to Calzaghe, I also thought Hopkins edged the Calzaghe and Taylor fights so I count that as a win for him, either way Calzaghes best win was controversial, and even if I took it as a Calzaghe win Hopkins is clearly greater. He certainly deserved the Pascal fight and I count that as a win. I don't see how you can have the Lacy and Pavlik fights even, Lacy hadn't beat anyone and didn't do anything after, there wasn't much in it between Hopkins and Pavlik in terms of size, its well known that Pavlik use to weigh a lot on fight night (around 180 pounds if I'm not mistaken). Pavlik was a top fighter and was expected to win or atleast be very tough but no Hopkins outclassed a much younger fighter, who had beaten a top fighter in Taylor twice. The fact that Hopkins has done what he has done at such an advanced age is truly amazing and should be an addition to his greatness, there is only one fighter who really competes with him in that aspect and thats Moore. Not to mention Hopkins snatched 2 legitimate championships in 2 legitimate weight-classes. By the way I don't count paper belts so I don't put any stock into 21 or 20 title defenses or whatever, I certainly don't regard Hopkins as the longest reigning MW, I don't really see how they are close at all, different classes of fighter.

[SCtrojansbaby]

LMAO at Jones who was shot to pieces and been knocked out and beaten far more impressively then Calzaghe did it being equal with #2 pound for pound Winky Wright.

You just showed you have absolutely no knowledge of the sport of boxing

[awais]

we all know deep down RJJ would have killed calzaghe in his prime

[Pastrano]

It doesn't matter about him losing its about the fights he took and he took the best version of Tarver.



I absolutely disagree, Calzaghe is NOT an ATG and Hopkins clearly is. Hopkins beat top 10 contenders Mercado, Lipsey, Vanderpool, Echols x2, Allen x2, Daniels and Eastman. Hes really in a different league to Calzaghe, I also thought Hopkins edged the Calzaghe and Taylor fights so I count that as a win for him, either way Calzaghes best win was controversial, and even if I took it as a Calzaghe win Hopkins is clearly greater. He certainly deserved the Pascal fight and I count that as a win. I don't see how you can have the Lacy and Pavlik fights even, Lacy hadn't beat anyone and didn't do anything after, there wasn't much in it between Hopkins and Pavlik in terms of size, its well known that Pavlik use to weigh a lot on fight night (around 180 pounds if I'm not mistaken). Pavlik was a top fighter and was expected to win or atleast be very tough but no Hopkins outclassed a much younger fighter, who had beaten a top fighter in Taylor twice. The fact that Hopkins has done what he has done at such an advanced age is truly amazing and should be an addition to his greatness, there is only one fighter who really competes with him in that aspect and thats Moore. Not to mention Hopkins snatched 2 legitimate championships in 2 legitimate weight-classes. By the way I don't count paper belts so I don't put any stock into 21 or 20 title defenses or whatever, I certainly don't regard Hopkins as the longest reigning MW, I don't really see how they are close at all, different classes of fighter.

Oh come on! Mercado was a BUM and the others were never that special. Daniels was good as a LMW, but he was crap as mw. He was just undersized in comparison to Hopkins too. Eastman? Lol! He's a joke and he even gave Borenard some tough rounds. Echols was just a hard hitter, nothing special. Allen...he was perhaps the best of the bunch but still nothing special. Lipsey I know very little about and Vanderpool was overated.

[Vadrigar.]

It doesn't matter about him losing its about the fights he took and he took the best version of Tarver.



I absolutely disagree, Calzaghe is NOT an ATG and Hopkins clearly is. Hopkins beat top 10 contenders Mercado, Lipsey, Vanderpool, Echols x2, Allen x2, Daniels and Eastman. Hes really in a different league to Calzaghe, I also thought Hopkins edged the Calzaghe and Taylor fights so I count that as a win for him, either way Calzaghes best win was controversial, and even if I took it as a Calzaghe win Hopkins is clearly greater. He certainly deserved the Pascal fight and I count that as a win. I don't see how you can have the Lacy and Pavlik fights even, Lacy hadn't beat anyone and didn't do anything after, there wasn't much in it between Hopkins and Pavlik in terms of size, its well known that Pavlik use to weigh a lot on fight night (around 180 pounds if I'm not mistaken). Pavlik was a top fighter and was expected to win or atleast be very tough but no Hopkins outclassed a much younger fighter, who had beaten a top fighter in Taylor twice. The fact that Hopkins has done what he has done at such an advanced age is truly amazing and should be an addition to his greatness, there is only one fighter who really competes with him in that aspect and thats Moore. Not to mention Hopkins snatched 2 legitimate championships in 2 legitimate weight-classes. By the way I don't count paper belts so I don't put any stock into 21 or 20 title defenses or whatever, I certainly don't regard Hopkins as the longest reigning MW, I don't really see how they are close at all, different classes of fighter.

This is pretty good:

[Pastrano]

Come to think of it, did Hopkins ever fight and beat a good white fighter in his prime?? Or anybody not black? Trinidad doesn't count. DLH must be the only really good non black fighter he beat and we all know it was a mismatch. All in all, he just beat 1 white fighter and that was a recently flu-recovered, non-technician Pavlik.

Im just saying because its ironic, he talked about how he would never let a white boy beat him, as if he had fought so many "whiteboys" in the past.

[RubenSonny]

Oh come on! Mercado was a BUM and the others were never that special. Daniels was good as a LMW, but he was crap as mw. He was just undersized in comparison to Hopkins too. Eastman? Lol! He's a joke and he even gave Borenard some tough rounds. Echols was just a hard hitter, nothing special. Allen...he was perhaps the best of the bunch but still nothing special. Lipsey I know very little about and Vanderpool was overated.

They were in the top 10 when Hopkins beat them.

Come to think of it, did Hopkins ever fight and beat a good white fighter in his prime?? Or anybody not black? Trinidad doesn't count. DLH must be the only really good non black fighter he beat and we all know it was a mismatch. All in all, he just beat 1 white fighter and that was a recently flu-recovered, non-technician Pavlik.

Why is skin colour relevant to anything?

[RubenSonny]

This is pretty good:

Thanks man I'll listen when I've got the time.

[Vadrigar.]

Come to think of it, did Hopkins ever fight and beat a good white fighter in his prime?? Or anybody not black? Trinidad doesn't count. DLH must be the only really good non black fighter he beat and we all know it was a mismatch. All in all, he just beat 1 white fighter and that was a recently flu-recovered, non-technician Pavlik.

Im just saying because its ironic, he talked about how he would never let a white boy beat him, as if he had fought so many "whiteboys" in the past.

race baiting now are we?

[Pastrano]

They were in the top 10 when Hopkins beat them.



Why is skin colour relevant to anything?

Who said it is?

race baiting now are we?

Certainly not. Just pointing out an amusing fact. Hopkins went ballistic at Calz claiming he would never get beat by a white boy, while he didn't beat many white boxers, if any, at that point.