Roy Jones should be favored against anyone from 160-175

[The Surgeon]

I think the people that are picking Hagler against Jones are assuming that its not the ageing, grumpy and somewhat careless version of Hagler.

Still i think his points relevant, Hagler wasnt shot or even close to it, just a touch past his best

[Barn]

I don't think so, but certainly not a heavy underdog against anyone. I'd give him just about even or better odds against most because he'd either have a size advantage (Robinson, Hagler, Monzon) or a talent advantage (pretty much everybody not named Sugar Ray).



He never proved a great chin, but he never showed the shakiness that he did when he got sparked by Glen Johnson. He rarely got hit clean enough to show what kind of chin he had...

I'm pretty confident he is the same height as Ray.

[Barn]

Still i think his points relevant, Hagler wasnt shot or even close to it, just a touch past his best

Oh, come on really?
Now I'm a big Hagler fan so take that as you will but, look at the Mugabi fight. Mugabi was not skillster and look at the shots Hagler is taking that he would have slipped or parried in his prime. Look at the missed oppurtunites, if you don't want to take my word I'll type up a report frim George Kimball.

[BigStereotype]

I'm pretty confident he is the same height as Ray.

Diego Corrales was taller than Joshua Clottey and Clottey was still the much bigger man.

[Barn]

Diego Corrales was taller than Joshua Clottey and Clottey was still the much bigger man.

Valid point I automatically assume height.

[RubenSonny]

Still i think his points relevant, Hagler wasnt shot or even close to it, just a touch past his best

Yeah but Rays performance was very circumstantial, its not just the "past hi best" factor but the grudge and situation Hagler was in made Hagler fight in a particular way against Leonard. I'm not trying to discredit Leonard here, what I'm saying is that I'm logically presuming Hagler would not be in that circumstance and would fight like he normally did - with intelligence. Also he was undeniably past his best.

[The Surgeon]

Oh, come on really?
Now I'm a big Hagler fan so take that as you will but, look at the Mugabi fight. Mugabi was not skillster and look at the shots Hagler is taking that he would have slipped or parried in his prime. Look at the missed oppurtunites, if you don't want to take my word I'll type up a report frim George Kimball.

**** Kimball. I call it as i see it myself.

Im a Hagler man too Barnburner, i just think Roy has the size and BIGtime speed advantages to beat em. Im not saying he would but i wouldnt bet against him.

I dunno man, Mugabi was a badass and he really fought the fight of his life that night. I was impressed with Hagler there, mabey he took a few shots he otherwise wouldnt have but he wasnt too Far off his best imo, past his best yes but not by that much and Roy was bigger harder hitting and possibly faster than that Ray

[The Surgeon]

Yeah but Rays performance was very circumstantial, its not just the "past hi best" factor but the grudge and situation Hagler was in made Hagler fight in a particular way against Leonard. I'm not trying to discredit Leonard here, what I'm saying is that I'm logically presuming Hagler would not be in that circumstance and would fight like he normally did - with intelligence. Also he was undeniably past his best.

I guess there is probably some truth to that yeah. Still a guy with Sugar Ray or Jones speed will always be a problem for a BRILLIANT but standard guy like Marvin.

I say standard not disrespectfully at all, i just mean he isnt huge, he isnt particuarly fast or hard punching (tho no slouch either) and he isnt particuarly good in any one area other than chin. He's just such a solid all rounder i rate him most likely as the best MW ever but that dont mean he cant be beat

[Barn]

I guess there is probably some truth to that yeah. Still a guy with Sugar Ray or Jones speed will always be a problem for a BRILLIANT but standard guy like Marvin.

I say standard not disrespectfully at all, i just mean he isnt huge, he isnt particuarly fast or hard punching (tho no slouch either) and he isnt particuarly good in any one area other than chin. He's just such a solid all rounder i rate him most likely as the best MW ever but that dont mean he cant be beat

Hagler had very good power, just not 1 punch KO power, his shots were grinding down shots that constanly were hurting and breaking.

Well put it this way the Hagler you just described and Hearns

Hearns hits harder
Hearns is bigger
Hearns is faster
Hagler is only better in chin.

Result? Hagler KO3?

[RubenSonny]

I guess there is probably some truth to that yeah. Still a guy with Sugar Ray or Jones speed will always be a problem for a BRILLIANT but standard guy like Marvin.

I say standard not disrespectfully at all, i just mean he isnt huge, he isnt particuarly fast or hard punching (tho no slouch either) and he isnt particuarly good in any one area other than chin. He's just such a solid all rounder i rate him most likely as the best MW ever but that dont mean he cant be beat

Hagler had serious ATG skills, incredibly complete fighter who had excellent finishing ability, you can't just reduce it down to a game of top trumps in predicting this fantasy fight, with all due respect Surge.