Any one else on here Rank Gene tunney higher than Micky walker

[Scott9945]

A clear choice? Come on. Walker is being extremly underrated here.

It's not as if Tunney was boxing the ears of a prime Jack Dempsey. He beat a past prime Demspey both times. Dempsey as that point had lost alot of hunger and drive he once had and had been away from the ring for 3 years. And yet Dempsey still managed to drop him and hurt him heavily. Would of he beat a prime Dempsey? I have my douts.


Jack Sharkey was also boxing a past prime Dempsey's ears off without much trouble, only to be hit while on the break, he was most likely on his way to doing what Tunney done to Dempsey, before being hit with a cheap shot.

And Walker's record isn't sensational? Read my first post again.

Listen Tunney was a truly great fighter, but to say he ranks way ahead of Walker is plain ******. People just don't know enough about Walker I feel.

I really wasn't dumping on Mickey Walker. He was one of the greatest middle and welterweights ever. But he doesn't belong ahead of Tunney on an all time list. Walker fought for 10 years and lost 19 times. Nothing wrong with that. But Tunney fought for 10 years and lost only once. So who's record is truly sensational?

I'm tired of hearing about how washed up Dempsey was when he fought Tunney. He had just turned 31. If Demspey was truly an ATG, he wouldn't have been washed up at 32. And by most accounts, Tunney won about 19 of the 20 rounds they fought. Yeah Tunney was badly hurt, but he still won the remaining rounds.

The only legitimate knock on Tunney is his lack of fights against African Americans.

[Kid McCoy]

I really wasn't dumping on Mickey Walker. He was one of the greatest middle and welterweights ever. But he doesn't belong ahead of Tunney on an all time list. Walker fought for 10 years and lost 19 times. Nothing wrong with that. But Tunney fought for 10 years and lost only once. So who's record is truly sensational?

I'm tired of hearing about how washed up Dempsey was when he fought Tunney. He had just turned 31. If Demspey was truly an ATG, he wouldn't have been washed up at 32. And by most accounts, Tunney won about 19 of the 20 rounds they fought. Yeah Tunney was badly hurt, but he still won the remaining rounds.

The only legitimate knock on Tunney is his lack of fights against African Americans.

By the same token Sven Ottke has no losses, but that doesn't make him better than Tunney. I think it's unfair to downgrade Walker for those 19 losses. A lot of them are bunched towards the end of his career, and against that level of competition anyone would lose a few. I'd be surprised if Tunney went through Sharkey, Schmeling, McTigue, Berlenbach, Loughran (a 19-year-old Loughran gave Tunney a hard fight) and Rosenbloom et al unscathed.

If anything Tunney is overranked considering he was quite carefully matched for his era. A few of his big wins were against fighters past their peak, like Dempsey, Gibbons and Carpentier. There are also some top names from that era, like Kid Norfolk or Berlenbach, who for some reason he never faced, despite many of his contemporaries doing so.

On the Greb fights, Tunney only won two clearly. He lost the first decisively and Greb was thought to have been jobbed in one of the others. 2-2-1 would be a fairer reflection of how their series went.

I'm not really into precise lists, but based on his accomplishments - beating more great fighters in more divisions than Tunney - I'd rate Walker higher.

[JAB5239]

By the same token Sven Ottke has no losses, but that doesn't make him better than Tunney. I think it's unfair to downgrade Walker for those 19 losses. A lot of them are bunched towards the end of his career, and against that level of competition anyone would lose a few. I'd be surprised if Tunney went through Sharkey, Schmeling, McTigue, Berlenbach, Loughran (a 19-year-old Loughran gave Tunney a hard fight) and Rosenbloom et al unscathed.

If anything Tunney is overranked considering he was quite carefully matched for his era. A few of his big wins were against fighters past their peak, like Dempsey, Gibbons and Carpentier. There are also some top names from that era, like Kid Norfolk or Berlenbach, who for some reason he never faced, despite many of his contemporaries doing so.

On the Greb fights, Tunney only won two clearly. He lost the first decisively and Greb was thought to have been jobbed in one of the others. 2-2-1 would be a fairer reflection of how their series went.

I'm not really into precise lists, but based on his accomplishments - beating more great fighters in more divisions than Tunney - I'd rate Walker higher.

Good to see you back Kid!!

[Greatest1942]

By the same token Sven Ottke has no losses, but that doesn't make him better than Tunney. I think it's unfair to downgrade Walker for those 19 losses. A lot of them are bunched towards the end of his career, and against that level of competition anyone would lose a few. I'd be surprised if Tunney went through Sharkey, Schmeling, McTigue, Berlenbach, Loughran (a 19-year-old Loughran gave Tunney a hard fight) and Rosenbloom et al unscathed.

If anything Tunney is overranked considering he was quite carefully matched for his era. A few of his big wins were against fighters past their peak, like Dempsey, Gibbons and Carpentier. There are also some top names from that era, like Kid Norfolk or Berlenbach, who for some reason he never faced, despite many of his contemporaries doing so.

On the Greb fights, Tunney only won two clearly. He lost the first decisively and Greb was thought to have been jobbed in one of the others. 2-2-1 would be a fairer reflection of how their series went.

I'm not really into precise lists, but based on his accomplishments - beating more great fighters in more divisions than Tunney - I'd rate Walker higher.

Tunney also ducked George Godfrey. And it was not quite subtle either.Tunney was good,yes some might have good resons for him too, but win-losses sometimes are a bit misleading.

[sonnyboyx2]

By the same token Sven Ottke has no losses, but that doesn't make him better than Tunney. I think it's unfair to downgrade Walker for those 19 losses. A lot of them are bunched towards the end of his career, and against that level of competition anyone would lose a few. I'd be surprised if Tunney went through Sharkey, Schmeling, McTigue, Berlenbach, Loughran (a 19-year-old Loughran gave Tunney a hard fight) and Rosenbloom et al unscathed.

If anything Tunney is overranked considering he was quite carefully matched for his era. A few of his big wins were against fighters past their peak, like Dempsey, Gibbons and Carpentier. There are also some top names from that era, like Kid Norfolk or Berlenbach, who for some reason he never faced, despite many of his contemporaries doing so.

On the Greb fights, Tunney only won two clearly. He lost the first decisively and Greb was thought to have been jobbed in one of the others. 2-2-1 would be a fairer reflection of how their series went.

I'm not really into precise lists, but based on his accomplishments - beating more great fighters in more divisions than Tunney - I'd rate Walker higher.

Tunney was the greater of the 2 fighters and should be ranked higher.... Tunney lost to Greb due to circumstances on his "Worst Night" he avenged it easily in their other fights

[Kid McCoy]

Good to see you back Kid!!

Ha thanks. I can't believe it's 18 months since I last posted here.

Tunney was the greater of the 2 fighters and should be ranked higher.... Tunney lost to Greb due to circumstances on his "Worst Night" he avenged it easily in their other fights

Care to amplify on Tunney beating Greb "easily" in their subsequent meetings? Reports of those fights don't bear that out. Considering Walker fought many more top fighters than Tunney did (including at heavyweight) and beat more Hall of Famers in more divisions than Tunney, I'm not sure how you can be so sure Tunney was greater.

[sonnyboyx2]

Ha thanks. I can't believe it's 18 months since I last posted here.



Care to amplify on Tunney beating Greb "easily" in their subsequent meetings? Reports of those fights don't bear that out. Considering Walker fought many more top fighters than Tunney did (including at heavyweight) and beat more Hall of Famers in more divisions than Tunney, I'm not sure how you can be so sure Tunney was greater.

my mistake.. he never beat Greb easily"

[Greatest1942]

my mistake.. he never beat Greb easily"

As far as I was concerned the series was 2-2-1. And there are plenty of evidence to back it up.

[sonnyboyx2]

As far as I was concerned the series was 2-2-1. And there are plenty of evidence to back it up.

put up the evidence you claim to have it should be interesting reading.

[HaglerSteelChin]

Tunney was the greater of the 2 fighters and should be ranked higher.... Tunney lost to Greb due to circumstances on his "Worst Night" he avenged it easily in their other fights

He only lost the first fight since he didn't know much about Greb, after he was told by fellow New York Fighter Benny Leonard that his mistake was that he went for the head instead of the body against the whirling Greb, he corrected and did win comfortably against Greb twice, and had two no decisions.

Just going by mainly memory the rematch with Greb was dominated by Tunney in the first half, and Greb came out strong in the middle rounds, and Tunney would go win the last few rounds. It would be like a modern 116-112 win for Tunney. BTW, while Greb fought with a blind eye and Tunney battling the flu. So both were great warriors. I believe the decision was either a MD or SD? It was in the eye of the beholder and without footage we have only anecdotes. But many who like pure aggression thought Greb was more active, but Tunney many thought landed the cleaner punches while Greb used rough tatics and ineffective aggression.

The third fight was less controversial with Tunney the clear winner, and if i remember he was coming from a hiatus due to an injured hand or finger. Than there were two ND's- the one from Minnesota was possibly Tunney's best pefomance, and i don't remember much about the other one, it might have been a split newspaper decision.

Everyone is entitled to their opinion about Walker vs Tunney. But when you have people comparing Tunney to Sven Ottke than something is wrong. Ottke was a fighter who can't even compare to Tunney in the least bit. Even better undefeated fighters as Calzaghe, Lopez, or Jack McaAullife. If you want to compare Tunney to Ottke, than why not compare Walker to Guillermo Jones? Jones is a modern fighter who won fights from Welterweight all the way up to the Cruiserweight division. The modern Cruiserweight division is like the old heavyweight divsion. Walker being 5-7 beating HW's is not like today.

I don't think Guillermo Jones even witht that P4P distinction of beating guys in 6different divisions makes him a hall of famer, let alone put him in the same class as Walker, so to say Tunney is like Ottke is silly than so is comparing Jones and Walker. Tunney beat like 6 hall of famers and won fights with injuries or being roughed up, Tunney was clean as a whistle and relied on skill and not fouls to win, unlike many of his opponents.


I rate Walker somewhere near the top 25, but he was not more skilled, durable, or had the impact or influece that Tunney had. Walker was knocked out several times, and those knockouts werent from heavyweights, he was knocked out by guys his size. Tunney was only knockdown once, and he was not as hurt as people say. He was following the count from the referee during the entire time with his eyes open. THe ILAC rule clearly stated the ref didn't need to start the count until the fighter went to the neutral corner. Tunney being smart took the 9 seconds, and Dempsey still had 2 minutes to knock him out, and coudln't. Than Tunney dropped Dempsey the very next round.

Greb was one of the few who thought Tunney Would beat Dempsey, nobody did, the odds were very against Tunney. To take away from that win by saying Dempsey was shot is presposterous. I don't rate Tunney as high as Greb, but i think both are top 10 p4p.