Let's talk about Charley Burley?

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  • GJC
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    #11
    Originally posted by sonnyboyx2
    Burley is vastly over-rated... we can only go by what we watch on film and make up our own judgement of the fighters, i have footage of Burley and IMO Ray Robinson would completely destroy him as would many other greats at 160lbs Burley falls into the Harry Wills & Sam Langford catagory, its all here-say and what could have been stories.
    Kind of see where you are going with that Sonny but think you are being a bit harsh.

    For example I'm always a bit dubious of how highly Les Darcy gets rated by some, obviously a very good fighter but when people starting putting him in at top 10/20 atg MW I think they may be guilding the lilly a touch. At the end of the day he was dead at 21 and if you drew a line across many fighters careers at 21 or even 24,25 you would have an extremely slanted view of them. Think of Benetiz,Curry, Nunn, Norris etc etc
    Kind of the James Dean syndrome I think of it.

    Taking the 3 fighters you have mentioned, I would struggle to find 20 fighters with a resume of strong as Langford's. Whilst I wouldn't have backed him against Johnson who should have given him a shot and likewise Dempsey I think given the range of weights he fought at you would have to admit he would have picked up a world title or two had he have been given his shots?

    Wills is a tricky one, great fighter with a better resume than Dempsey.
    Should Dempsey have fought him? Yes. Do I think he would have beaten Dempsey? No
    I think Wills place in history has been enhanced by Dempsey not fighting him ironically.

    Re Burley should he have gotton a shot? Yes. Would he have picked up a world title? Possibly. I think he would have had the beating of Zale or Graziano but unfortunately the figure of Robinson looms dark over his era. I think that SRR avoided Burley, as he was not the best guy to fight weighing up risk v reward, but I don't think Burley would have beaten Robinson.

    So kind of see your point ( excepting Langford) but think you might have overshot a bit.
    I'll always score you a lot of points for honesty though, criticising those 3 is always going to get you a lot of criticism.

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    • steeluv
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      • Jul 2009
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      #12
      He was great for the phoenix suns

      no seriously he was a very good hard boxer, if la Motta and Robinson ducked him then it says a lot. never knocked down he was a stand up guy!

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      • sonnyboyx2
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        #13
        Originally posted by 'Sugar' Freddi
        I heard about him before but never really did any research until someone mentioned him today in this forum. I managed to do some research on him and it seems like he was a bad ass, being avoided by ATGs like Robinson and Jake LaMotta.

        What is your opinion about Charley Burley?
        Burley`s fight record and the footage available of him do not suggest that Robinson or LaMotta was running scared of the guy, IMO i find it hard to believe that he could beat those two great fighters.. Burleys name only came to prominece after an Eddie Futch interview in the 1990s where Futch claimed Burley was one of the best fighters he had seen, Futch also claimed that Rid**** Bowe was the best he had ever seen or trained.

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        • TheGreatA
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          #14
          The only reason I think Burley tends to be overrated is because of how he is rated in comparison to the likes of Lloyd Marshall, Jimmy Bivins, Holman Williams, Eddie Booker. I don't think there's any reason why he should be considered a level above any of them.

          Robinson did turn down an opportunity to fight Burley. LaMotta was quoted as saying "Where do I need Charley Burley when I have Fritzie Zivic?". Henry Armstrong chose to rather defend his title against Zivic. Zivic bought out Burley's contract so that he didn't have to face him again. Zale never mentioned his name.

          He was definitely avoided but the Second World War hurt his chances of getting a title shot even more so. He was at his very best during the war when all the world titles were "frozen".

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          • TheGreatA
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            #15
            Here's a pretty well thought out analysis of Burley's style based on the second Oakland Billy Smith fight:



            A bit "ambitious" but a nice tribute to Burley nonetheless.
            Last edited by TheGreatA; 02-02-2010, 04:26 PM.

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            • JAB5239
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              #16
              Originally posted by TheGreatA
              Here's a pretty well thought out analysis of Burley's style based on the second Oakland Billy Smith fight:



              A bit "ambitious" but a nice tribute to Burley nonetheless.

              ...Good vid!

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