Hagler vs. Leonard!!

[Wiirdo]

What the hell? Double standards if I've ever seen any.

Hagler is slated for losing to an ATG a division below past his prime, but Leonard is given a free pass for losing to Duran in his prime? ****ing bull****. Why are you punishing Hagler for not getting a rematch?

Hagler gave into ALL of Leonard's demands, and still made it an extremely close controversial decision. Leonard also completely blindly robbed Hearns in the rematch that was supposed to clear any doubt about the previous fight. It's sad that even if it was a 15-rounder and Hagler won the last three, he still would have lost on Guerra's card.

I can't believe people are trying to turn only being knocked down once against him. First of all, he still won the fight and it was also clearly a slip. Hearns would have never beaten Hagler, yet he knocked Leonard down in a single fight double the amount of times Hagler's ever been knocked down in his whole career. Hagler also fought a better version of Hearns.

[GJC]

What the hell? Double standards if I've ever seen any.

Hagler is slated for losing to an ATG a division below past his prime, but Leonard is given a free pass for losing to Duran in his prime? ****ing bull****. Why are you punishing Hagler for not getting a rematch?

Hagler gave into ALL of Leonard's demands, and still made it an extremely close controversial decision. Leonard also completely blindly robbed Hearns in the rematch that was supposed to clear any doubt about the previous fight. It's sad that even if it was a 15-rounder and Hagler won the last three, he still would have lost on Guerra's card.

I can't believe people are trying to turn only being knocked down once against him. First of all, he still won the fight and it was also clearly a slip. Hearns would have never beaten Hagler, yet he knocked Leonard down in a single fight double the amount of times Hagler's ever been knocked down in his whole career. Hagler also fought a better version of Hearns.

You are best to quote the post you are replying to for ease

[Wiirdo]

You are best to quote the post you are replying to for ease

Yeah, probably, but I'm not really aiming at certain posts, just the general theme of the thread.

[GJC]

Don't neccessarily agree that is the general theme of the thread, generally quite balanced with a couple of exceptions.

[donkim]

Hagler is slated for losing to an ATG a division below past his prime, but Leonard is given a free pass for losing to Duran in his prime? ****ing bull****. Why are you punishing Hagler for not getting a rematch?

Hagler is slated for losing to a washed up,inactive smaller man and rightfully so.If he was as great as they say,he would have not only have beaten Leonard,but stopped him in a convincing fashion.

Hagler gave into ALL of Leonard's demands, and still made it an extremely close controversial decision. Leonard also completely blindly robbed Hearns in the rematch that was supposed to clear any doubt about the previous fight. It's sad that even if it was a 15-rounder and Hagler won the last three, he still would have lost on Guerra's card.

Leonard's rematch with Hearns is irrelevant to this topic so don't bother using it to try and support your faulty argument.

Hagler was had thirty six minutes to beat a washed up,inactive welterweight who had spent his hiatus sniffing coke.and he failed to beat him.

Hagler didn't give into any demands,he happily accepted Leonards requests as he was making more money than Leonard and rightfully was confident enough that Leonard stood no chance.

I can't believe people are trying to turn only being knocked down once against him. First of all, he still won the fight and it was also clearly a slip. Hearns would have never beaten Hagler, yet he knocked Leonard down in a single fight double the amount of times Hagler's ever been knocked down in his whole career. Hagler also fought a better version of Hearns.

Hagler struggled greatly against a crude fighter who spent the vast majority of the fight with one eye after Hagler had thumbed him.Roldan didn't lose because he was knocked out,he lost because after spending a few rounds debating whether or not he wanted to continue,he finally decided to pack it in.As for the knockdown,it wasn't that much of a clear slip.

Leonard fought a far more dangerous Thomas Hearns than Marvin Hagler ever did.Thomas Hearns as a welterweight was a killer who could end a fight with a single right hand.Hearns was never as devestating a fighter as he moved up from welterweight.

[JAB5239]

[QUOTE]

Hagler is slated for losing to a washed up,inactive smaller man and rightfully so.If he was as great as they say,he would have not only have beaten Leonard,but stopped him in a convincing fashion.

Since when does one fight, his 67th and last fight, determine a fighters greatness over his entire career?

Hagler struggled greatly against a crude fighter who spent the vast majority of the fight with one eye after Hagler had thumbed him.

Why is it when you don't like a fighter you try to put him down in any way possible, including alluding that he intentionally cheated. You did this very same thing with Duran just a couple days ago.

[donkim]

Since when does one fight, his 67th and last fight, determine a fighters greatness over his entire career?

because that last fight and that one loss occured to a hopeless washout who had no business doing what he did.

Ray Leonard was finished as an elite fighter the moment he retired in 1982.

******* abuse and inactivity will destroy a young athlete in their prime.


Leonard was there to be finished off in dramatic fashion and Hagler couldn't do it.

Why is it when you don't like a fighter you try to put him down in any way possible, including alluding that he intentionally cheated. You did this very same thing with Duran just a couple days ago.

Hagler did thumb him,that is an absolute fact.Roldan's eye was completely shut.

[BennyST]

because that last fight and that one loss occured to a hopeless washout who had no business doing what he did.

Ray Leonard was finished as an elite fighter the moment he retired in 1982.

******* abuse and inactivity will destroy a young athlete in their prime.


Leonard was there to be finished off in dramatic fashion and Hagler couldn't do it.

Hagler did thumb him,that is an absolute fact.Roldan's eye was completely shut.

You call that the performance of a 'hopeless washout', non elite fighter? Did you even see it? I'd hate to see what you consider a great performance or a bad one at that too.

Fighters can come back you know? Ali did it to beat a prime Quarry. After a couple of years Oscar came back to stop Mayorga in a flawless performance. While not as good opponents as Leonard or Hagler, it shows that having trained for a lifetime, you don't lose skill with proper training but you can lose motivation. Determination and motivation are more important in this sport than skill and Leonard had a lot more at that point than Hagler who was going to retire anyway.

Now, I know you think everything written and discussed about a fighter you don't like equates to an excuse, but maybe, just maybe, a lack of motivation and overconfidence thinking he could beat Leonard, as he had been retired for so long, didn't prepare him for the Leonard that did come to fight because Leonard fought as good as he ever did and fought the perfect fight plan and stuck to it. It wasn't so much Hagler being ****e but Leonard being so damned good coming back along with what I would say was a possibly overconfident Hagler. As well as him fighting an utterly ****** fight.

Anyway, that was not the performance of a shot, washed up fighter and saying it was is just an insult to Leonard as well as Hagler.

It's not as if he was old and you simply have no way of knowing how he was feeling. Obviously he was more than confident after seeing Hagler's recent performances as well as how he knew he was feeling in himself.

[StarshipTrooper]

Since when does one fight, his 67th and last fight, determine a fighters greatness over his entire career?


Why is it when you don't like a fighter you try to put him down in any way possible, including alluding that he intentionally cheated. You did this very same thing with Duran just a couple days ago.

Trying to argue logically with him? Sorry my friend but you're WAY over his head

Poet

[JAB5239]

because that last fight and that one loss occured to a hopeless washout who had no business doing what he did.

Leonard a hopeless washout? I don't think so. and one loss still does not determine an entire career.

Ray Leonard was finished as an elite fighter the moment he retired in 1982.

You are basing this on what, the Howard Davis fight and his decision to retire again? Its obvious he wasn't finished as he has wins over Hagler, Duran, LaLonde and a draw with Hearns (yeah, I thought he lost too) after the fact.

******* abuse and inactivity will destroy a young athlete in their prime.

I could be wrong, but I thought Leonard only dabbled in ******* for a short period. You are making it seem like he spent hundreds of thousands of dollars at the local crack den day in and day out.

Leonard was there to be finished off in dramatic fashion and Hagler couldn't do it.

Maybe he simply fought the wrong game plan against a motivated fighter he had underestimated.

Hagler did thumb him,that is an absolute fact.Roldan's eye was completely shut.

So he thumbed him, big deal. This is boxing and these things happen. You've tried to make it sound intentional thought just as you tried to make it sound intentional with Duran.