Johnson vs Langford 1909

[Dr. Z]

Round 6
" Johnson drove Sam into the ropes.There he landed a volley of punches,punctuated by a hard uppercut to the jaw,that sent Sam crashing to the boards for a count of nine. Sam managed to struggle to his feet,and attempted to clinch with Johnson until he regained his senses,but Johnson was too strong for him.He freed himself and dropped Sam for another count."

Round 8
"Johnson moved easily about the ring as Sam began to slow.Sam tried to retreat.
Johnson followed Sam into the ropes raining a series of blows,and ending with a hard left hook knocking Sam to the canvas."
"The referee began to count,and Jack stood waiting to hit Sam again,should he rise.l
After what seemed to many in attendance a very slow count,Sam rose at nine,by grasping the rope and pulling himself upright A combination of punches and pushes sent Sam back to the mat."

THREE KNOCKDOWNS, FOUR IF YOU COUNT THE LAST ONE !
SOURCE." SAM LANGFORD" by CLAY MOYLE CHAPTER 5 PAGE 55

NOW WHO IS THE LIAR?

Is this the same book that claims Sam was 20 years old? By the way way else are you selectively leaving out?! Sam say he was about 140 pounds. Do you want me to directly quote Sam account of the fight? The knock down he claims along with what the French press says.

[Ivich]

Is this the same book that claims Sam was 20 years old? By the way way else are you selectively leaving out?! Sam say he was about 140 pounds. Do you want me to directly quote Sam account of the fight? The knock down he claims along with what the French press says.

I've provided an unimpeachable source Clay Moyle, an acknowledged authority and biographer of Langford .His report is taken from same day newspaper records .The fight was in the USA in Chelsea Mass ,Langford's adopted home town.

Why would I take a French report over those?Clay and I have spoken about Langford's DOB he told me that as far as he can ascertain Langford was 20 years old when he fought Johnson ,but that no one can say for certain. As usual you've been made to look like the complete fool you are ,and ,as usual you are in denial.To the extent that you are now calling Clay a liar.
A year before he fought Johnson Langford weighed 155lbs for a fight with Young Peter Jackson.Do you think 20 years old Langford then dropped 15 lbs to fight Johnson? You are a definitely not dealing with a full deck!.LOL

[Ivich]

Who? And it is not a permanent by the way, nor does it read that way. You should know, you have been banned many times! Enough talk about other boards.

Johnson backed out of a signed contract. He could have honored or at least given Langford a shot after Burns. But he folded and the promoters were angry with him!

Johnson refused to defend his worlds heavyweight title for £1000 and yes the promoters were angry with him ,they liked slave contracts.

[QueensburyRules]

Given Johnson won every round against Burns and floored him several times , Burns' jaw was badly swollen with both eyes were blacked why would a rematch be a lucrative proposition?
Name a single promoter who was interested in putting this fight on?
Name a single "lucrative," purse offer,Johnson was offered to defend against Burns?
Burns was so badly beaten he did not fight again for nearly a year and a half and he was never again a factor in the heavyweight title scene.

- - Burns built an arena specifically for the rematch, the arena where the surreal tragedy of Luther McCarthy's tragic ring death occurred resulting in a bogus murder charge against Arthur Pelkey that bankrupted and ruined him. Arsonists burned down Burns' arena during the night that near ruined Burns.

You must still be a noob...

[Ivich]

- - Burns built an arena specifically for the rematch, the arena where the surreal tragedy of Luther McCarthy's tragic ring death occurred resulting in a bogus murder charge against Arthur Pelkey that bankrupted and ruined him. Arsonists burned down Burns' arena during the night that near ruined Burns.

You must still be a noob...

NOPE! Burns built an arena specifically to stage the McCarty v Pelkey fight which he then billed as for The White Heavyweight Championship of the world.Burns never at anytime engaged in talks with Johnson concerning a rematch after the beating Johnson gave him Burns was dead in the water at world level,that's why in an attempt to rehabilitate himself he took on Pelkey barely scraping a draw against him he focused on promoting Pelkey.You don't go building arenas on the off chance that the worlds heavyweight champion who has already beaten the piss out of you will consent to a box office dud rematch!
Tip for you.When you find yourself in a deep hole.Stop Digging!LOL

[Dr. Z]

I've provided an unimpeachable source Clay Moyle, an acknowledged authority and biographer of Langford .His report is taken from same day newspaper records .The fight was in the USA in Chelsea Mass ,Langford's adopted home town.

Why would I take a French report over those?Clay and I have spoken about Langford's DOB he told me that as far as he can ascertain Langford was 20 years old when he fought Johnson ,but that no one can say for certain. As usual you've been made to look like the complete fool you are ,and ,as usual you are in denial.To the extent that you are now calling Clay a liar.
A year before he fought Johnson Langford weighed 155lbs for a fight with Young Peter Jackson.Do you think 20 years old Langford then dropped 15 lbs to fight Johnson? You are a definitely not dealing with a full deck!.LOL

Learn to read. I said nothing about the author. I am quoting the fighter ( Langford ) himself and the French press. I get that you and old man, and your memory bad.

Yes, no one say for certain Langford age he might have been younger the 20! Like 18 or 19 as Sam Mcvey was when he meet Johnson. What victory over boys! You are a fool and not to be taken seriously. Others make fun of you here.

[Ivich]

Learn to read, I said nothing about the author. I am quoting the fighter ( Langford ) himself and the French press. I get that you and old man, was your memory this bad in your youth...if you can remember that far back.

Yes, no one say for certain Langford age he might have been younger the 20! Like 18 or 19 as Sam Mcvey was when he meet Johnson. What victory over boys! You are a fool and not to be taken seriously. Others make fun of you here.

And he very well might have been older!
What I produced was concrete proof that Johnson floored Langford at least 3 times,and no amount of infantile obfuscation by you will ever alter that! You made a post of 4 sentences with 4 spelling mistakes in it and 3 punctuation errors.You have the literacy of a chimp with brain damage.
This is your post from 2 days ago.
Yes and based on his results in 1909 a prime heavyweight Sam Langford 175 pounds ( not the 156 pound 20 year old . Sam says he was even lighter ) would be a very good match, Johnson's results in 1909 were suspect. A news draw to a 162 pound O'Brien ( some felt O'Brien was the better) and a TKO loss in a 4 round ex match to Gunboat Smith who also was not selected for a title match despite being the most qualified " white hope " of the times.
1. In1909 Langford scaled a verified 158lbs for his fight with Hague that's15lbs less than you claim [175lbs] he weighed that year!

1909-05-24

158

196

William 'Iron' Hague

2,The Johnson v OBrien fight was NO DECISION.

3 Neither Johnson or O Brien weighed in for the fight.


4. You cannot be tko'd in a sparring match, I don't know how many times you have been corrected on this absurdity?

5.Johnson sparred a further 6 rds with 3 more partners after boxing with Smith I have their names.
,

6.In 1906 Johnson scaling an estimated 185 lbs beat the living **** out of Langford who weighed an estimated 156lbs. In 1909 we know Langford weighed 155lbs.we also know Johnson weighed 207lbs for his fight with Ross,and 209 lbs for his fight with Kaufman

Now my question is: Who wins their fight in1909 Langford, or the 52/57lbs heavier Johnson?

Best not talk about reading ability! lol

You are not right mentally Fella!

[QueensburyRules]

NOPE! Burns built an arena specifically to stage the McCarty v Pelkey fight which he then billed as for The White Heavyweight Championship of the world.Burns never at anytime engaged in talks with Johnson concerning a rematch after the beating Johnson gave him Burns was dead in the water at world level,that's why in an attempt to rehabilitate himself he took on Pelkey barely scraping a draw against him he focused on promoting Pelkey.You don't go building arenas on the off chance that the worlds heavyweight champion who has already beaten the piss out of you will consent to a box office dud rematch!
Tip for you.When you find yourself in a deep hole.Stop Digging!LOL

- - Dope History!

Burns in Canada was infinitely BIGGER than Firemen Flynn in the sticks of New Mexico.

You know, Canada!

Where he fled from his Mann Act sentencing to eventually disembark in France so he could duck Sam and Joe!

Thanks for the reminder. You the gift that keeps on giving...

[Willie Pep 229]

- - Dope History!

Burns in Canada was infinitely BIGGER than Firemen Flynn in the sticks of New Mexico.

You know, Canada!

Where he fled from his Mann Act sentencing to eventually disembark in France so he could duck Sam and Joe!

Thanks for the reminder. You the gift that keeps on giving...

Johnson's exodus from the U.S.A. to France went through Canada (and then England) but it was a strange event.

One in which I can't understand Canada's motivation.

The Feds (no FBI yet, just U.S. Marshalls and Treasury guys) knew where JJ was the whole time and informed the Canadians.

For some reason the Canadians chose to stick to the law explicitly and refused to detain Johnson as the U.S. had requested. Their argument was that JJ was was not seeking to stay in Canada nor was he asking for asylum, and was only a transit passing through Canada.

The legal boiler plate came down to the technicality that Johnson actually had a ticket/reservations to board a ship to Great Britain, and then did.***

P.S. I believe JJ first fled to England but was refused a license to fight (at the behest of, [pressure from] the U.S.A.). Britian, always seemingly willing to be the U.S.'s bltch forced JJ to flee to France.

If this part is incorrect please correct me.

*** I often wonder if maybe the U.S. government actually wanted JJ to run and didn't actually want him back while he was still champion. It made things politically simpler than trying to imprison the HW Champion. While they did achieve a conviction the populace at the time were already calling it a trumped up charge. It didn't take history to expose the corrupt use of the law The contemporaneous generation (White reformers and Civil Rights activists (e.g. NAACP, who had just formed) were already looking at the conviction as bogus and were ready to challenge it. JJ running made it easier for the White Supremacists to get what they want most. No Jack Johnson. I really wonder if the Canadians let JJ go because the U.S. wanted them to.

[Ivich]

- - Dope History!

Burns in Canada was infinitely BIGGER than Firemen Flynn in the sticks of New Mexico.

You know, Canada!

Where he fled from his Mann Act sentencing to eventually disembark in France so he could duck Sam and Joe!

Thanks for the reminder. You the gift that keeps on giving...

Yes I know Canada I've been to Toronto. Burns never drew over $17,000 there.Johnson received $31,500 ,[the box rec figures are wrong] plus a% of the movies from promoter Barney Curley for beating up Flynn.
NB Johnson later cabled Burns and told him he was prepared to defend against McCarty at the Manchester Arena Calgary for $30,000.Burns didnt want to know!
I'll ask you again produce ONE offer from Burns or ANY promoter for a Johnson v Burns rematch!

Game Set and Match! lol