Dempsey and Marciano switch opposition

[uncle ben]

Dempsey fights:
Walcott
Lastarza
****ell
Charles
Moore

Marciano fights:
Willard
Brennan
Miske
Firpo
Carpentier
Jack Sharkey
Gene Tunney

Could Marciano achieve better results against Dempseys competition? Does Dempsey slip on a banana peel vs Rockys competition?

[Marchegiano]

I heavily favor one entire era over the other. 50s>20s

I don't think just Marciano would stomp Dempsey's....resume...a new ass, I reckon Moore, Charles, and Walcott would too, and, LaStarza, ****ell, and Matthews would definitely be among the best of the era if not dominate that resume.

Rather than going through Dempsey's names, name-by-name, and saying what can be summed up with - they'd lose cause they suck - let's just jump to the one who didn't suck, Tunney.

Gene Tunney is the base for modern boxing. Good feet, good jab, good distance control, good guard, he's great, and boxing exactly like Gene Tunney is fabulous. For amateur boxers there's no one better to emulate. Shoulder rolling and/or dipping, hybrid stance, shuffle, using the ropes to absorb energy, you know, basic stuff you expect to see more of in pros than you do amateurs....not exactly Tunney's bag is it? In Tunney's era basic, amateur level, boxing was the trick.

Do I think the master of the sucka punch can sucka punch Tunney? Yes. Absolutely. Walcott sets him up and blows him out. I don't think Tunney has a chance. Joe's not just bigger, he's trickier, smarter, more evolved. Tunney's second worst nightmare.

Second, after Rocky Marciano who absolutely batters him. Tunney has no means to keep Marciano off him nor any to hurt him, he just gets smothered from a long distance than beaten into another KO for The Rock.

That said, I think LaStarza-Dempsey is the best match up because the only thing Roland brought to the game was catching punches on his elbows while riding the ropes to absorb the energy. I think Jack would find a way to break Roland down eventually, I don't think it'd be that easy for him. Certainly not Miske easy.

Miske-Marciano would be the worst. I don't think Billy Miske even gives Marciano a fight.

[Willie Pep 229]

Billy Miske had 104 fights - KO once (by Dempsey). Traded wins with Battling Levinsky, drew twice with Harry Greb, traded wins withTommy Gibbons had wims over Gun Boat Smith; Charley Weinwert; Jack Dillion, Bill Brennen, Fred Fulton, Jim Flynn, plus others of the era - did you even bother to look at his resume before declaring him a bum, or is just another post about how all white fighters of the 1920s were bums because of the color line?

[uncle ben]

Billy Miske had 104 fights - KO once (by Dempsey). Traded wins with Battling Levinsky, drew twice with Harry Greb, traded wins withTommy Gibbons had wims over Gun Boat Smith; Charley Weinwert; Jack Dillion, Bill Brennen, Fred Fulton, Jim Flynn, plus others of the era - did you even bother to look at his resume before declaring him a bum, or is just another post about how all white fighters of the 1920s were bums because of the color line?

Where did I declare him a bum?

[Marchegiano]

Billy Miske had 104 fights - KO once (by Dempsey). Traded wins with Battling Levinsky, drew twice with Harry Greb, traded wins withTommy Gibbons had wims over Gun Boat Smith; Charley Weinwert; Jack Dillion, Bill Brennen, Fred Fulton, Jim Flynn, plus others of the era - did you even bother to look at his resume before declaring him a bum, or is just another post about how all white fighters of the 1920s were bums because of the color line?

Where did I declare him a bum?

Well, I didn't say bum, but absolutely compared to Marciano he is.

Billy Miske is also from an era when very good boxers dropped wins to not so good boxers more often and his piss poor brags are about equivalent to any random name pulled out of sundowners or black genesis or bare knuckle 1722-1888 or peter maher by matt dunnellon, or any other book that puts over early mid level boxers like they were something special.

If that was Dempsey's resume this thread wouldn't exist.

Ezzard Charles. ... I don't mean that as a name for Marciano, I mean Ezzard ****ing Charles compared to Billy Miske. Exactly my point. Ezzard has real brags and there's a very good reason why Willie might not like Miske being disparaged but won't go as far as to even pretend Billy is in the same league as a LHW or HW contender as Ezzard.

[QueensburyRules]

I heavily favor one entire era over the other. 50s>20s

I don't think just Marciano would stomp Dempsey's....resume...a new ass, I reckon Moore, Charles, and Walcott would too, and, LaStarza, ****ell, and Matthews would definitely be among the best of the era if not dominate that resume.

Rather than going through Dempsey's names, name-by-name, and saying what can be summed up with - they'd lose cause they suck - let's just jump to the one who didn't suck, Tunney.

Gene Tunney is the base for modern boxing. Good feet, good jab, good distance control, good guard, he's great, and boxing exactly like Gene Tunney is fabulous. For amateur boxers there's no one better to emulate. Shoulder rolling and/or dipping, hybrid stance, shuffle, using the ropes to absorb energy, you know, basic stuff you expect to see more of in pros than you do amateurs....not exactly Tunney's bag is it? In Tunney's era basic, amateur level, boxing was the trick.

Do I think the master of the sucka punch can sucka punch Tunney? Yes. Absolutely. Walcott sets him up and blows him out. I don't think Tunney has a chance. Joe's not just bigger, he's trickier, smarter, more evolved. Tunney's second worst nightmare.

Second, after Rocky Marciano who absolutely batters him. Tunney has no means to keep Marciano off him nor any to hurt him, he just gets smothered from a long distance than beaten into another KO for The Rock.

That said, I think LaStarza-Dempsey is the best match up because the only thing Roland brought to the game was catching punches on his elbows while riding the ropes to absorb the energy. I think Jack would find a way to break Roland down eventually, I don't think it'd be that easy for him. Certainly not Miske easy.

Miske-Marciano would be the worst. I don't think Billy Miske even gives Marciano a fight.

- - Willard, Brennan, and Firpo massively bigger/stronger/powerful punchers than anyone Rocky fought, and prime Tunney better than shopworn Charles and JJ in their last relevant days as contenders.

Don't look like you thought this out very well, a failing grade.

[Willie Pep 229]

Where did I declare him a bum?

Not you sir.

[Willie Pep 229]

Well, I didn't say bum, but absolutely compared to Marciano he is.

Billy Miske is also from an era when very good boxers dropped wins to not so good boxers more often and his piss poor brags are about equivalent to any random name pulled out of sundowners or black genesis or bare knuckle 1722-1888 or peter maher by matt dunnellon, or any other book that puts over early mid level boxers like they were something special.

If that was Dempsey's resume this thread wouldn't exist.

Ezzard Charles. ... I don't mean that as a name for Marciano, I mean Ezzard ****ing Charles compared to Billy Miske. Exactly my point. Ezzard has real brags and there's a very good reason why Willie might not like Miske being disparaged but won't go as far as to even pretend Billy is in the same league as a LHW or HW contender as Ezzard.

So your answer to Miske's resume is that it's based on fixed fights.

Do you realize you're the Donald Trump of the forum, when reality doesn't match your agenda you just announce it is fake. No proof, no particulars, you just go ahead an announce it.

Ok let's take your tale as fact, what does that do to Sam Langford's prowess? How many of his wins against repeated opponents should we knock off his record; how many of his fights were 'my turn, your turn' fights?

I suspect you'll explain to me how it was different for Langford, then Miske. You know what I mean the way the Georgia vote was fraud but Florida's wasn't.

Why do I have this gut feeling your accusations of fixes is going to be selective?

[HOUDINI563]

Marciano loses to Tunney. Has very tough bouts with Sharkey, Firpo and Gibbons.

Dempsey knocks out all of Marciano’s opponents with Charles providing the most resistance.

[Marchegiano]

So your answer to Miske's resume is that it's based on fixed fights.

Do you realize you're the Donald Trump of the forum, when reality doesn't match your agenda you just announce it is fake. No proof, no particulars, you just go ahead an announce it.

Ok let's take your tale as fact, what does that do to Sam Langford's prowess? How many of his wins against repeated opponents should we knock off his record; how many of his fights were 'my turn, your turn' fights?

I suspect you'll explain to me how it was different for Langford, then Miske. You know what I mean the way the Georgia vote was fraud but Florida's wasn't.

Why do I have this gut feeling your accusations of fixes is going to be selective?

I only skimmed after the first like because I have no clue where you got fixed fights from. I was leaning into his unimportance.

Langford drop just a ton of fights to guys he could have probably beaten, it's well accepted. When you're talking about one of those fellas the fact that they tied or beat Sam is put over like this big achievement. Looks good until your bring context to it and understand why Sam was overworked or not taking the fight seriously or whatever.

Kid McCoy KO'd Peter Maher, twice. Sounds great until you understand that Kid did nothing but trick Maher into taking it easy on him and then took advantage of Maher being there to pantomime. Kind of takes some of Kid's perceived power away from the first statement huh?

couple wins over some mid level, some draws over top level, yeah I know this story and no it's not impressive, every fool from the era has the same one.