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George Foreman dodging Jerry Quarry?

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  • #21
    Originally posted by observer22 View Post
    Hi,

    1) a Boston promoter was featured in a Spring 1973 Ring Magazine story offering a million bucks to Foreman to make his first title defense against Quarry.

    2) there seems to have been some financial hassle that forced Foreman to make all his title defenses on foreign soil.

    3) **** Sadler, a shady elderly hustler who controlled Foreman's career evidently right up to George's losing the title, was quoted in a 1971 Ring magazine article that Foreman would not be fighting top contenders before getting a title shot. A year earlier, on the undercard of Frazier-Ellis, Foreman received a bad scare from a crafty soft punching veteran Gregorio Peralta. The face-first upright mauler George Chuvalo was, of course, made to order for Foreman.

    4) Quarry never seemed to beat opponents who had faster hands than him and who threw combinations. Most forget that Frazier, with his thick legs making Joe resemble a typical slugger, had the hand speed of a middleweight until he faded in his career after whipping Ali in 1971.
    But.....Foreman....like Lyle, Mac Foster, Shavers, Bodell, Randy Neumann etc., did not have fast hands and usually did not throw combinations. Foreman could have pushed and bullied the much shorter and 20 pounds lighter Quarry.

    5) In 1991 I had the pleasure in talking with a true gentleman and boxing scholar, Gil Clancy. Gil, as he did in the 1991 boxing book "In the Corner", mentioned how Quarry always had marriage problems keeping him mentally off-balance (and that was besides the large child support payments Jerry was burdened with from his first marriage).
    From 1972 until sometime in the 80s, Jerry was with a beautiful, flashy, tempermental and obviously expensive blonde, Arlene Charles, known as Charlie. Jerry was still with Arlene Charles at the 1982 Holmes-Cooney tussle, I saw them together. Before Quarry's second Frazier fight, this blonde was telling newspapers that Jerry looked slow.
    Gil Clancy swatted down a false rumor that Quarry had frozen in his dressing room and almost refused to come out and fight Frazier in their rematch in 1974 (as Max Baer froze up in his dressing room before facing Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey had to threaten to fight the playboy Baer to get Max into the ring). Totally untrue said Clancy.

    6) supposedly Quarry had told people over the years that Patterson was the dirtiest fighter he ever fought.

    7) Quarry and his handlers and management team unbelievably did not take advantage of slow motion reviews of when he was smashed with Ali's elbow in the third round of their first meeting (1970). The VHS tape of that fight, when viewed frame by frame, very clearly shows Ali jabbing and then hooking his left elbow into Quarry's eye. Totally illegal. Quarry could have contested the result, took a financial settlement to not block the coming Frazier-Ali first fight, and been the first title defense for whomever won (which was Frazier).
    Jerry could have had the rather uninterested, unfocused, self-satisfied Frazier who fought Terry Daniels. Until Gil Clancy resurrected Jerry in late 1972, Quarry had poor management and suspect training.

    8) Quarry never got over widespread criticism that he was too timid in his loss to Jimmy Ellis (no one knew he had injured his back and should have canceled the fight).
    This stubborness led to Jerry being more of a slugger for almost all his later fights.
    Sports Illustrated had a detailed article with drawings before his first Frazier fight showing how Quarry would block Joe's left hooks and counter, thus winning the fight. Quarry instead fought Joe's fight and had no chance.

    9) another mental flameout happened in his second Ali fight. For two rounds he fought a smart, strategic fight. Quarry quit in round three and Ali STILL could not knock him down or even cut him (Ali was not using his elbow that night). By round seven Quarry simply stopped punching, which caused the referee to stop the non-fight.
    Quarry's team should have had him fight first before his brother Mike took on a dangerous Bob Foster. Foster had smashed top contender Vicente Rondon only two months earlier in a couple of rounds. Foster had knocked out wily vet **** Tiger, a horrible beating. Mike was knocked out by Foster for about five minutes and Jerry flamed out mentally and lost. This loss led to Gil Clancy training Jerry.
    nice post, i enjoyed reading

    Comment


    • #22
      Originally posted by observer22 View Post
      Hi,

      1) a Boston promoter was featured in a Spring 1973 Ring Magazine story offering a million bucks to Foreman to make his first title defense against Quarry.

      2) there seems to have been some financial hassle that forced Foreman to make all his title defenses on foreign soil.

      3) **** Sadler, a shady elderly hustler who controlled Foreman's career evidently right up to George's losing the title, was quoted in a 1971 Ring magazine article that Foreman would not be fighting top contenders before getting a title shot. A year earlier, on the undercard of Frazier-Ellis, Foreman received a bad scare from a crafty soft punching veteran Gregorio Peralta. The face-first upright mauler George Chuvalo was, of course, made to order for Foreman.

      4) Quarry never seemed to beat opponents who had faster hands than him and who threw combinations. Most forget that Frazier, with his thick legs making Joe resemble a typical slugger, had the hand speed of a middleweight until he faded in his career after whipping Ali in 1971.
      But.....Foreman....like Lyle, Mac Foster, Shavers, Bodell, Randy Neumann etc., did not have fast hands and usually did not throw combinations. Foreman could have pushed and bullied the much shorter and 20 pounds lighter Quarry.

      5) In 1991 I had the pleasure in talking with a true gentleman and boxing scholar, Gil Clancy. Gil, as he did in the 1991 boxing book "In the Corner", mentioned how Quarry always had marriage problems keeping him mentally off-balance (and that was besides the large child support payments Jerry was burdened with from his first marriage).
      From 1972 until sometime in the 80s, Jerry was with a beautiful, flashy, tempermental and obviously expensive blonde, Arlene Charles, known as Charlie. Jerry was still with Arlene Charles at the 1982 Holmes-Cooney tussle, I saw them together. Before Quarry's second Frazier fight, this blonde was telling newspapers that Jerry looked slow.
      Gil Clancy swatted down a false rumor that Quarry had frozen in his dressing room and almost refused to come out and fight Frazier in their rematch in 1974 (as Max Baer froze up in his dressing room before facing Joe Louis, Jack Dempsey had to threaten to fight the playboy Baer to get Max into the ring). Totally untrue said Clancy.

      6) supposedly Quarry had told people over the years that Patterson was the dirtiest fighter he ever fought.

      7) Quarry and his handlers and management team unbelievably did not take advantage of slow motion reviews of when he was smashed with Ali's elbow in the third round of their first meeting (1970). The VHS tape of that fight, when viewed frame by frame, very clearly shows Ali jabbing and then hooking his left elbow into Quarry's eye. Totally illegal. Quarry could have contested the result, took a financial settlement to not block the coming Frazier-Ali first fight, and been the first title defense for whomever won (which was Frazier).
      Jerry could have had the rather uninterested, unfocused, self-satisfied Frazier who fought Terry Daniels. Until Gil Clancy resurrected Jerry in late 1972, Quarry had poor management and suspect training.

      8) Quarry never got over widespread criticism that he was too timid in his loss to Jimmy Ellis (no one knew he had injured his back and should have canceled the fight).
      This stubborness led to Jerry being more of a slugger for almost all his later fights.
      Sports Illustrated had a detailed article with drawings before his first Frazier fight showing how Quarry would block Joe's left hooks and counter, thus winning the fight. Quarry instead fought Joe's fight and had no chance.

      9) another mental flameout happened in his second Ali fight. For two rounds he fought a smart, strategic fight. Quarry quit in round three and Ali STILL could not knock him down or even cut him (Ali was not using his elbow that night). By round seven Quarry simply stopped punching, which caused the referee to stop the non-fight.
      Quarry's team should have had him fight first before his brother Mike took on a dangerous Bob Foster. Foster had smashed top contender Vicente Rondon only two months earlier in a couple of rounds. Foster had knocked out wily vet **** Tiger, a horrible beating. Mike was knocked out by Foster for about five minutes and Jerry flamed out mentally and lost. This loss led to Gil Clancy training Jerry.




      OK. Show us the "elbow" that cut Quarry. I see Quarry getting hit with a lot of left jabs and right crosses. Quarry didn't complain because he had no case. And Ali kicked Quarrys ass in every round that second fight. Don't try to rewrite history.
      Last edited by joseph5620; 08-10-2009, 10:50 AM.

      Comment


      • #23
        Originally posted by TheGreatA View Post
        There is a rumour that Quarry handled Foreman in sparring in almost embarrassing fashion for Big George.

        Foreman stated in the 90's that he purposefully ducked Jerry Quarry (one of the top contenders at the time) but it may have been just out of respect for Jerry.


        1:40
        Quarry was a talented heavyweight who happened to fight(imo) in the toughest era for heavyweights. A fighter with his talent would be champ today I think. He was also a good blow by blow announcer who would do very well if he was still alive. Also,his imitation of Ali was great and spot on lol.

        Comment


        • #24
          Originally posted by joseph5620 View Post
          Quarry was a talented heavyweight who happened to fight(imo) in the toughest era for heavyweights. A fighter with his talent would be champ today I think. He was also a good blow by blow announcer who would do very well if he was still alive. Also,his imitation of Ali was great and spot on lol.

          Comment


          • #25
            Originally posted by boxingbuff View Post
            I hope your not going by there "sparring" sessions?

            A young 19 year old with 4 pro fights sparred circles around the Heavyweight Champion of the world back in the early 1960's.

            The Champion's camp ended up throwing this 19 year old with 4 pro fights out of there camp because he made the Champion look silly.

            There are many other Champions who got showed up in "sparring" but in a real fight would/did destroy the sparring partner.

            So I hope your not going by there "sparring" sessions?
            No.. I'm going on Quarry's all round ability..

            Comment


            • #26
              Originally posted by mickey malone View Post
              Foreman would have needed to be at his very best to KO Quarry.. If they'd fought during the 70's, I think Foreman would have needed to travel into the later rounds in order to stop Quarry on his feet.. The 90's Foreman or the one who fought Jimmy Young would stand a good chance of losing to Quarry.. He without doubt, was the very best of the rest, back in one of the strongest eras..
              If Quarry couldn't beat Ali, Frazier, or Norton , there is nothing to back up the claim that he could beat Foreman.

              Comment


              • #27
                Originally posted by mickey malone View Post
                No.. I'm going on Quarry's all round ability..
                Good enough.....

                I'm just curious,how do you think Quarry would do against Sonny Liston.

                Comment


                • #28
                  Originally posted by TheGreatA View Post
                  OMG that was awsome and funny LOL. Jerry Quarry is a fighter I will truly miss.

                  Comment


                  • #29
                    Quarry vs Liston

                    Originally posted by boxingbuff View Post
                    Good enough.....

                    I'm just curious,how do you think Quarry would do against Sonny Liston.
                    Depends on when in Jerry Quarry's career Liston would fight him.

                    Either way, Liston's jab and huge reach advantage would have been far too much for Irish Jerry.

                    Liston's jowls and facial wrinkles clearly show he was was well into his 40s by the time he smashed Patterson for the title on a cool Chicago evening in Sept 1962. So, even in his 40s, Liston would have been too much for Jerry.

                    If Liston were allowed to fight (and not throw the fight), he would have scored a middle round TKO against the more cautious, early career Jerry Quarry (the Quarry up until the Jimmy Ellis fight).

                    The post-Ellis slugger that Jerry Quarry morphed into (he was reacting to widespread criticism of looking hesitant and tenative against Ellis, Quarry and his camp should have been yelling long and loud of how Quarry entered the Ellis fight with a hurt back)......this version of Jerry Quarry would have been slashed by Liston in 3 or 4 rounds. Would likely have been like Foreman's August 1970 three round wipeout of Chuvalo.

                    In 1987 I had the pleasure of having a rather long conversation with Floyd Patterson and Floyd was convinced that Liston threw both Ali fights.

                    Comment


                    • #30
                      Originally posted by observer22 View Post
                      Depends on when in Jerry Quarry's career Liston would fight him.

                      Either way, Liston's jab and huge reach advantage would have been far too much for Irish Jerry.

                      Liston's jowls and facial wrinkles clearly show he was was well into his 40s by the time he smashed Patterson for the title on a cool Chicago evening in Sept 1962. So, even in his 40s, Liston would have been too much for Jerry.

                      If Liston were allowed to fight (and not throw the fight), he would have scored a middle round TKO against the more cautious, early career Jerry Quarry (the Quarry up until the Jimmy Ellis fight).

                      The post-Ellis slugger that Jerry Quarry morphed into (he was reacting to widespread criticism of looking hesitant and tenative against Ellis, Quarry and his camp should have been yelling long and loud of how Quarry entered the Ellis fight with a hurt back)......this version of Jerry Quarry would have been slashed by Liston in 3 or 4 rounds. Would likely have been like Foreman's August 1970 three round wipeout of Chuvalo.

                      In 1987 I had the pleasure of having a rather long conversation with Floyd Patterson and Floyd was convinced that Liston threw both Ali fights.
                      i am interested to know more about your conversation with Patterson... dont keep it to yourself, im sure many others are also interested

                      Comment

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