10 best Heavies NOT to win the title...

[mickey malone]

Jimmy Young

Go back 4 posts..

[sonnyboyx2]

Hi Sonnybox, I personally didn't score the Ali fight to Young but many experts did. To be honest even those who scored it for Ali didn't think it was a good showing from him.....Ali was not on form that night, his heaviest ever (230 Lbs). He spent alot of time on the ropes clowning around and his accuracy and timing were not great that night.

As for Young vs Foreman, close fight for me, a very good one too! Foreman was great at points in the fight but was very ill afterwards and collapsed in the dressing room. He would have almost certainly been stopped if it were a fifteen rounder. If you only gave Young 2 rounds this seems very harsh and way out of line with most experts and fans assessments. Even if the fight was declared a draw that would be a great achievement for Young.

your correct it was not one of Muhammad Ali`s best showings but i had him a clear winner as did the judges 72 - 65, 70 -68, 71 - 64 unanimous

[Sugarj]

Yea, I'm suprised Ali took Jimmy so lightly. 230 lbs!!!

Its fair to say that if there was a return Ali would have surely been even more dominant.

[Stoppage]

I'm sure Langford and Wills could have won if they were given a chance. I wouldn't be surprised if any of the boxers on the list would win a title if they were boxing today. There's four (five if you count IBO) versions of world titles.

[Obama]

Yea, I'm suprised Ali took Jimmy so lightly. 230 lbs!!!

Its fair to say that if there was a return Ali would have surely been even more dominant.

dominant? He got completely clowned the first time. I only had Ali winning 3 rounds, with 1 even. One of the worst robberies I have ever seen. If he fought him again maybe he could deserve to win 6 rounds.

[StarshipTrooper]

Yea, I'm suprised Ali took Jimmy so lightly. 230 lbs!!!

The problem was that after Manila Ali fell into the habit of treating his fights as if they were exibitions.....similer to the kind of fights Johnson and Dempsey had in the twilight of their careers. That third fight with Frazier sapped a lot of Ali's desire and it took losing to Leon Spinks to put some fire in his belly.

Poet

[GJC]

The problem was that after Manila Ali fell into the habit of treating his fights as if they were exibitions.....similer to the kind of fights Johnson and Dempsey had in the twilight of their careers. That third fight with Frazier sapped a lot of Ali's desire and it took losing to Leon Spinks to put some fire in his belly.

Poet

After Manilla the only fights of Ali's where he gave a decent performance were Spinks 2 and Shavers. You could say he wasn't that great in either but Shavers was always a dangerous opponent and Spinks 2 was historical if nothing else.

[Sugarj]

Hi Obama, my earlier post was clearer in this thread:

Originally Posted by Sugarj
Hi Sonnybox, I personally didn't score the Ali fight to Young but many experts did. To be honest even those who scored it for Ali didn't think it was a good showing from him.....Ali was not on form that night, his heaviest ever (230 Lbs). He spent alot of time on the ropes clowning around and his accuracy and timing were not great that night.


I did watch the fight a few months ago and was impressed with Young, I personally didn't quite give him the nod........the judges were too generous in Ali's favour. Jimmy should have pressed more when Ali clowned.

Thing is Ali was always better in rematches, he would have trained harder and been in better shape. Predicting that in a return Ali would have won perhaps six rounds wouldn't be a view shared by many.


Hi Poet and GJC,

Yes after Manilla 1975 he was not quite the same, I'm sure that fight started the earliest signs of Parkinson's syndrome. Even watching the documentaries posted yesterday of Ali comparing himself with the legends (in the history section, filmed shortly after the Manilla fight) Ali just occasionally glazed over and ever so slightly his voice would get that tone that only hardcore Ali fans would recognise as post Manilla. He was not quite the same guy as he was in 1974's 'When we were Kings'.

Yes between 1975 and 1978 Ali did fight some bums, Coopman, Evangelista and Dunn were hardly all time greats! Ha ha, but he did obviously fit in Young, Norton and Shavers which were good fighters. Ali was in good shape for the latter two, I really enjoyed the Shavers fight, thought Ali showed great combinations, heart and a strong finish. As for Norton 3, both men were pretty good, a draw may have been a better verdict but I've never scored that one for Kenny.

[joseph5620]

deliberately holding his head out of the ring so that Ali could not punch him, was Youngs game-plan against Ali

A lot of people seem to conveniently forget that so I'm glad you brought it up. He should have been DQ' d and would have been today.

[GJC]

As for Norton 3, both men were pretty good, a draw may have been a better verdict but I've never scored that one for Kenny.

Think his shape and whether he was "gone" as a fighter not neccessary the same thing, he looked in shape against Holmes if you think about it.

Yes guess Ali wasn't in bad shape for Norton, think Norton would have made him look bad in 66/67 to be honest. Personally would have given the nod to Norton.
He should have quit after Shavers really, a lot of the damage was probably done but it would have a good fight to bow out on.