Ray Robinson in his prime

[Boxing_12]

Sorry I meant that there are over 50 filmed fights of Robinson in total.

There are already a couple of his welterweight fights posted on this thread. Check out the Charley Fusari and Bernard Docusen fights. There is also the Sammy Angott fight of which you can see a brief clip in the post you quoted.

Some other Robinson fights exist from the 1940's but most of them are over the weight fights against journeymen, for example the Cliff Beckett, Tony Riccio, Georgie Abrams, Freddie Flores.

Can you upload these please?

[Doctor_Tenma]

Yes. The only reason i didint mention him is because of one thing really, when whitaker uses that upper body movement, robinson might be fast enough to catch him off gaurd, thats the only thing i fear about him. However i think whitaker would pose ALOT of problems, and again, like mayweather, would time robinson and bait him, but robinson, you can tell just by looking at those videos would do just the same. From the modern era its telling that very few off top could even compete with him.

Whitaker or Mayweather would be too small for Ray Robinson. Whitaker's movement and defensive style could trouble anyone but Ray would be all over Whitaker due to Whitaker's power. Again, wouldn't matter, Ray would be too big for both.

[SugarRayRealist]

** Can't figure why he didn't strip his shorts down and spit out his gum.

This his last welt fight. 2nd to last was the Gavilan title fight with 13 middle bouts in between.

Fusari a modest boxer with a good record fairly padded out. He's unwilling to go after the title and Robinson content to lay outside and box relaxed. More feints than punches and more bouncing around outside than anything.

Not a flattering fight. Fusari 2-4 after this and retires. The other guys look like muscled up stiffs. I'm fairly sure Ray boxed to the level of his threat, and Fusari was zero threat, plus he seemed to have a friendship with Charley.

Robinson admitted to carrying Fusari in his autobiography. He could have knocked out Fusari anytime he felt like it; but he agreed to carry him. Fusari's manager Vic Marsillo needed a fight; and Robinson needed an opponent for the Damon Runyon cancer fund. Robinson gave his entire earnings to the cancer fund for this fight.

[SugarRayRealist]

Sugar Ray Robinson simply the best period!!!

I also reckon whitaker would give him a few problems.........

Are you guys serious? Forrest, Whitaker, Leonard, Mosley, Mayweather, Hearns, Hopkins, Hagler, Monzon, Delahoya, Trinidad, Cotto, or anyone you could think of would have been koed by Robinson.

Robinson was and still is simply the greatest fighter pound for pound in the history of boxing. Basketball had Michael Jordan. Kung Fu/Karate had Bruce Lee. But in boxing there will never be another fighter with the skills and chin of Robinson.

Sugar Ray did it all. Outboxed boxers. Outpunched Punchers. Outbrawled Brawlers. Robinson was the master in the sport of boxing. I was a boxer and became involved through boxing because of Muhammad Ali; I had never heard about Robinson as a kid. But after furthering my knowledge on boxing and boxers; I found out that the greatest fighter ever was Sugar Ray Robinson. Even Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Sugar Ray Leonard, Sugar Shane Mosley, Alexis Arguello, Floyd Patterson and so many more champion; and quite a few sportswriters said the same thing.

I am a boxing historian and know the sport better than most without bragging about my knowledge.

[TheGreatA]

I am a boxing historian and know the sport better than most without bragging about my knowledge.

I think you just did.

[Boxing_12]

I think you just did.

:

[Richie-G]

Are you guys serious? Forrest, Whitaker, Leonard, Mosley, Mayweather, Hearns, Hopkins, Hagler, Monzon, Delahoya, Trinidad, Cotto, or anyone you could think of would have been koed by Robinson.

Robinson was and still is simply the greatest fighter pound for pound in the history of boxing. Basketball had Michael Jordan. Kung Fu/Karate had Bruce Lee. But in boxing there will never be another fighter with the skills and chin of Robinson.

Sugar Ray did it all. Outboxed boxers. Outpunched Punchers. Outbrawled Brawlers. Robinson was the master in the sport of boxing. I was a boxer and became involved through boxing because of Muhammad Ali; I had never heard about Robinson as a kid. But after furthering my knowledge on boxing and boxers; I found out that the greatest fighter ever was Sugar Ray Robinson. Even Muhammad Ali, Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano, Sugar Ray Leonard, Sugar Shane Mosley, Alexis Arguello, Floyd Patterson and so many more champion; and quite a few sportswriters said the same thing.

I am a boxing historian and know the sport better than most without bragging about my knowledge.

I just meant i thought he would give him problems, didn't mention him beating him......

[Joe2608]

I have a few questions, i know pretty much nothing about him and i feel i should research him before i make an opinion. Might look and see if there is a non biased book about him.

Here's some noob questions for you:

1) How do you feel Ray Robinson would do in modern times against modern boxers who have much healthier lifestyles, better technology and knowledge of the game?

2) Do you think he would be better in modern times due to having 6 months to prepare for a fight, rather than fighting twice a month, or do you think the greater activity helped him?

3) Was his competition strong, or were there a lot of bums?

4) If you can, can you give a rating out of 10 for each of his abilities, eg hand speed, foot speed, power, stamina etc.

5) How would his greatest rival (LaMotta, at least i think it is) do in modern times?

[TheGreatA]

1) How do you feel Ray Robinson would do in modern times against modern boxers who have much healthier lifestyles, better technology and knowledge of the game?

Robinson did have a healthy lifestyle and trained hard for every bout. Even at 45 years of age he was in remarkable shape physically even though his skills had declined.

I feel that the training methods have not changed very drastically in the past 50 years, in boxing that is, or atleast they are not taken advantage of for the most part.

I don't think anyone, except possibly Floyd Mayweather and Bernard Hopkins can match Robinson's boxing knowledge. He studied old tapes intensively and went to see fights in order to pick up new tricks and work on his own flaws. As a professional he fought 200 times.

2) Do you think he would be better in modern times due to having 6 months to prepare for a fight, rather than fighting twice a month, or do you think the greater activity helped him?

Robinson preferred to fight often. He made enough money so that he did not need to fight as often as he did but he felt it kept his skills sharp and he learned from every fight.

However some of his best performances were after he had a couple of months to prepare for a fight.

3) Was his competition strong, or were there a lot of bums?

Overall his competition were strong but there were some "bums" in between. Even then some of the lesser opponents he fought were actually fairly good fighters.

Here are all the top 10 ranked opponents Robinson defeated:

Joe Ghnouly
Pete Lello
Maxie Shapiro
Maxie Berger
Norman Rubio (x2)
Tony Motisi
Reuben Shank
Izzy Jannazzo (x4)
Ralph Zannelli
Sheik Rangel
Tommy Bell (x2)
George Costner (x2)
Jose Basora (x2)
Jimmy McDaniels
California Jackie Wilson (x2)
Cecil Hudson (x2)
Georgie Abrams
Jimmy Doyle
Bernard Docusen
Vic Dellicurti
Steve Belloise
Aaron Wade
Ray Barnes
Robert Villemain (x2)
Charley Fusari
Bobby Dykes
Holly Mims
Artie Levine
Cyrille Delanoit
Rocky Castellani
Denny Moyer
Hans Stretz
Ralph Dupas

Hall of famers:

Sammy Angott (x3)
Fritzie Zivic (x2)
Jake LaMotta (x5)
Henry Armstrong
Kid Gavilan (x2)
Carl Olson (x4)
Randolph Turpin
Rocky Graziano
Gene Fullmer
Carmen Basilio

4) If you can, can you give a rating out of 10 for each of his abilities, eg hand speed, foot speed, power, stamina etc.

I'd say that he did most things great. He was not among the greatest defensive fighters perhaps, when compared to Whitaker, Pep, Locche, etc. more like a Muhammad Ali who relied on his reflexes early on and later his guile and ability to take punishment. He was also quite aggressive, not a defensive artist by any means although he did display the ability to box defensively in his career as well.

5) How would his greatest rival (LaMotta, at least i think it is) do in modern times?

LaMotta may not have been Robinson's greatest opponent but he was the toughest Robinson ever fought according to his own words. LaMotta had to cut down weight to make 160, something he would not really have a problem with today. He was quite short for a middleweight but he used it to his advantage with his bobbing and weaving, put on trendemous pressure and had better boxing skills than given credit for.

I think he would have success in today's weak middleweight division. Sebastian Sylvester is actually an inch shorter than LaMotta and he holds a title.

[Boxing_12]

Robinson did have a healthy lifestyle and trained hard for every bout. Even at 45 years of age he was in remarkable shape physically even though his skills had declined.


I don't think anyone, except possibly Floyd Mayweather and Bernard Hopkins can match Robinson's boxing knowledge. He studied old tapes intensively and went to see fights in order to pick up new tricks and work on his own flaws. As a professional he fought 200 times.

This isn't true I belive. Robinson was never a big fan of watching boxing, and after reading numerous books and watching doc's on him, it have never stated he liked to watch old fight tapes.

He once said that he never liked boxing as it was barbaric and he done it soley for the money.