Big Name Missing
Sad list. Says a lot about the fate of fighters and African-American men from the inner city.
The list is missing one essential name - James 'Lights Out' Toney. Of course he was from Ann Arbor but he started training at Kronk when he was 17 and became Bill Miller's greatest success.
You really nailed the Nunn fight. Beyond the showboating, Nunn was extremely gifted. Unfortunately, he thought he was invincible and he wasn't quite Muhammad Ali. As you note, Toney really invested in body work in the early rounds in textbook manner. Dundee had been telling Nunn to box and move from the first round but by the time that cocky MF started listening, his body could no longer perform - Toney had drained it.
One thing people don't understand is how frickin' hard Sosa hit. He was a caveman with massive power. Toney's mom was ringside and she told me that out of all his fights, that was the only one where she could actually see Toney wincing from the shots, and that the solid connects sounding like a baseball bat hitting a side of beef.
Toney broke Nunn down. Nunn was soooo cocky and thought he could clown with Toney and beat him on the inside. And when he realized he was in trouble, it was much too late - his legs were gone from the body work Toney had consistently laid on him.
Griffin might have 'won' those fights but everyone not sitting at the judges' table, it was clear that Toney had won a large majority of the rounds. Interesting point about moving to the right of Toney although he always he handled southpaws well.
The first McCallum fight also seemed to be a clear Toney W. 90% of the big shots were landed by Toney. In the second fight, McCallum wanted no part of Toney inside and spent the entire fight jabbing and back away.
Really it seems that the best way to do well against Toney is to give him a lot of movement and ride that bicycle backward although that style won't win too many fans.
As far as the Jones fight goes, if Toney hadn't needed to lose about eighty pounds in the two months before the fight, well...Roy might have won anyway but it would have been much more interesting.
Sherry Toney told me that right before the second McCallum fight, Futch told Toney that he'd trained his dad. That's a real trainer - anything to get his fighter an edge.
Yes
Toney was an all-timer.
I've been around boxers for thirty years and i don't think I've ever seen a fighter spend as much time in the gym as Toney. He'd be the first man in the gym and the last to leave, and he only left the ring when there were no more sparring partners to bruise.
His one and enormous problem was the buffet table. No matter how much he trained, he ate more.
All of his bad fights - Jones, etc., - were due to him being drained from losing so much weight.
I've watched the Griffin fights at least eight times. He won those fights going away but was being punished for dumping his trainer.
He won the first Peter fight by a good amount also.
I think he beats B-Hop pretty handily if they fought at, say, super middle. A healthy Toney might struggle against prime Roy Jones but only because Jones would spend the entire fight on his bicycle. Toney would have been great in any era. The chin alone...